To ask for your help in deciding between two job offers?

[nightcarro]

Not really an AIBU, but I'm in desperate need of advice. I'm lucky enough to have been offered two graduate positions and cannot choose between them.

They are both in the same industry, doing similar work.

Job 1 - company is more prestigious than job 2 and I would be working on higher profile projects. Company 1 is probably the leader in the industry. Company has a general friendly feel to it and was my first choice for a long time. Got a very good impression of the company and its employees at the interviews. The teams are big and I'd be one of ~60 graduates starting, so probably less involved in the projects and potentially less exposure to senior members. The job is based in London.

Job 2 - slightly less prestigious but still a well-known company. Most important distinction is that the job is in Asia! The projects would likely be less well known, but I'd be one of 3 graduates in a team of ~30 overall, working directly with very senior members. I didn't get as great an impression from the interviewers (though they were perfectly nice) but since I got the offer, a whole load of different team members have been emailing/calling me to say congrats and introduce themselves/offer advice etc. Pay is significantly higher (around £16k higher per year, plus lower tax rates) and accommodation would be provided for the first 6 months.

As a bit of background, I don't currently live in either city, though of course London is a lot closer! I have no real responsibilities (no partner, kids etc) that stop me moving abroad but I have no clue if it's the right thing for me, or how easy it would be to internally transfer back to the UK again if I needed to. I feel like if I don't move abroad now, I probably never will but I worry that with such a small team, the whole experience will be awful if (for whatever reason) I don't get along with the rest of the team.

Any input whatsoever is hugely appreciated as I am currently clueless!

Another vote for abroad but do check cost of living. £16k swing for a similar role does seem a lot???? Is the high cost of Singapore living a possible reason for this?

Go to Singapore too good an opportunity to miss whilst you are in a position with no ties!

Working in a smaller team you can be recognised and appreciated more. Even if you only did it for six months the time will fly by. There are so many ways to keep intouch with friends and family now you won't lose touch with anyone and it will still be here to cone back to.

Have an amazing adventure :-)

The thing I regret is not going to work Hong Kong in 2003 when I had an opportunity.

At graduate age I would have gone for job 1, with the benefit of hindsight I’d have wished I’d have gone for job 2.

Good luck! It sounds like you don’t have a bad choice to make!

I think I would go for Job 1 in London. It sounds like it was your first choice and I would not underestimate the value of London experience either.

I think going overseas for a first graduate job could be quite tough. There is absolutely no reason to think if you don't go overseas now you never will. I first moved overseas when I was 36 and then I moved to another part of the world when I was 40. I have met many people moving overseas and to be honest, don't recall any new graduates doing it.

Go for Asia.

More money early is important to minimise pay gapping .Smaller numbers give you a better chance to shine and your learning will likely be accelerated as you get more exposure to projects and diff areas of business it will give you several soft skills

All things being equal if will likely fast track your career and you can probably apply for jobs in company 1 in 3 years that would take 5 years or so to reach through promotion it you had come up within company 1

I thought I had a made a decision last night but I keep changing my mind

Generally, people I speak to who know the industry say job 1, people who don't say job 2.

Job 1 is the better company and I would have the opportunity to go abroad if I wanted to - they are very big on internal mobility. They are also stronger in Asia than company 2 and I think working for them would open more doors. But does this outweigh the smaller teams in company 2 and easier access to heads of departments etc?

For me, having time abroad on your CV isn’t just about the role. You will gain so much as well as being in a smaller team and having access to seniors. Working abroad says something about the kind of person you are. It demonstrates confidence, resilience, tenacity, and much more. I think you will regret it if you play it safe with the London job.

The next three years will go by anyway...

If job 1 is strong in Asia you can have your cake and eat it. You can take the London job now and transfer to Asia later.

My sister works in finance (Goldmans). She started off London just after she graduated, and then worked in New York, Paris and Japan. All before she got married and had kids. Well actually she was still living in Paris when she had her first baby, she returned after that.

I think you will regret it if you play it safe with the London job.

I don't think you will regret either choice. It's win win. They're both top companies. Whatever you choose you will make work for you.

Asia. I'd go for the bigger adventure.

Also an ex of mine who was French, worked for BNP - started off in Paris and then worked in NY, Berlin, Hong Kong and London.

The idea that if you start here you'll never leave simply isn't true.

What have you decided OP?

Another 4 hours to decide and still a bit undecided, I am beyond useless!

For more or less the reasons that @Shambu mentioned above, I'm tempted to take job 1. Mobility there seems really good and I have spoken to a relatively senior person who has said they would support me in moving abroad after 2 years (of course, when it comes down to it after two years, who knows...).

Job 2 seems so incredibly exciting but my main concern is that there is no clear path back to the UK if I hated it. Even if I just did 2 years in company 1, the experience I'd get would open up more or less any door I wanted. I'm not so sure that's the same with job 2. I remember company 2 placing a large emphasis on wanting people to stay in Singapore during the interview (which is fair enough) and there was some implication that because I'm from a country miles away, they wouldn't necessarily believe I was committed to Singapore, which may suggest I'd be fighting a losing battle from the start.

Despite this, job 2 is definitely the more adventurous so I'm still tempted! May still change my mind again at last minute.

Thanks all for the solid advice.

Forgive me for butting in, just read the thread.

Have you been to Singapore OP?

If not I would be cautious. I think you need to really like somewhere to live there for a few years to make the most of it. I could live in Japan but I wouldn’t want to live in Singapore.

Fun to visit, but very hot, and quite claustrophobic. If you like skyscrapers, shopping malls and Disney theme parks it might be your thing, but it wasn’t mine. Plus it’s very expensive hence the extra salary, a good whack of which will go in rent and living expenses. Taxis are cheap though.

I think your heart is with job 1 - go for it, enjoy London and then aim for an internal transfer abroad.

I am also wavering between 2 possible jobs so mega sympathies there (!!)
We're lucky to have more than one decent choice.
I'm sure yours will be fine, either way.

To answer a couple of questions:

Re the salary difference, it arises from a while ago when the companies standardised pay across their global offices. Once the pound depreciated, the pay in London was never adjusted and now London employees are relatively badly paid compared to the US, Asia etc.

I have been to Singapore multiple times, it's a lovely city and seems very easy to live in. It is fairly expensive but things like transport and food can be a lot cheaper. I do worry that I'd eventually find it boring, there doesn't seem to be as much to do as there is in London, though the job itself requires long hours and I'm not sure how much more I'd value a nice, efficient, clean city over the huge range of things to do in London.

That answers that question. Choosing something blind is totally different to choosing somewhere you know.

I have to agree there’s not a huge amount to do, even as a tourist. London you’ve got the whole of Europe on your doorstep for city breaks etc.

You could travel all over Asia from Singapore. Seoul is amazing, you could explore Japan, China, you’d never be bored!

Option 2 100%!
You sound the type that's pretty independent and go-getting, I had my first grad job abroad and it was one of the highlights of my life.
The 1st job, one of 60......you'll be lost in the crowd.

Job 2 without a doubt. Job 1 you will just be a worker bee with likely very poor job satisfaction and less chance of keeping a job after the programme finishes.

Asia is leading the world in innovation and is an exciting fun place to be. A smaller team will mean more input and ability to really get hands on with your career, not just be a pen pusher.

For so many reasons, job number 2.

Hi everyone, thanks again for the support and advice.

I ended up choosing job 1. I know it goes against most of the advice on here, but here are my reasons for anyone who's interested (it's quite long so I don't expect anyone to, just please know that I did truly consider both options alongside the advice given!):

• I spoke with some people who had moved to job 2 from New York. While they said the job itself was interesting, they all expressed some concerns about being stuck there now as the move from Singapore -> NYC/London is very challenging, whereas going the other way is a lot easier.

• The industry is very client relationship based, and the teams in Singapore are split by country coverage. A similar thing happens in London, and 98% of people in these teams will be from that region, the other 2% tend to be people who studied the language at university. I know I don't have firsthand experience of this, but I'm not sure how much success I will have with clients as a fresh graduate in a completely new region. Clients like people who are similar to them.

• Company 2 admitted that after the 2 year graduate programme, they will only have headcount for 2 out of 3 graduates to continue there. I'm trying not to use this as an excuse for being cautious and taking job 1, but I worry it will create a toxic, highly competitive culture at company 2 with three of us aiming for two jobs.

• Company 2 were great with accommodation, but rather unhelpful regarding all the other logistical elements of moving halfway round the world. Apart from them sorting out the work visa itself, there was no help with figuring out healthcare or the different pension plans over there or any other kind of paperwork.

• A friend sent me screenshots of my angry texts to her after interviewing for job 2. One of the interviewers there implied that I would have to work twice as hard to show commitment to the company/region as the other two (native) hires and overall just said some very blunt things about how I'd probably regret it, miss my family etc. Perhaps I was just moody and annoyed at the time, but I feel like my initial judgment of job 2 and the people I'd be working with has been lost in the excitement of potentially moving abroad.

Overall, when it came down to it and I was on the verge of accepting job 2, I just couldn't bring myself to click reject on company 1's offer.

I do still very much hope to move abroad early on in my career, hopefully after the initial two years - company 1 very strongly encourage rotation at this point. I'm hoping that I will be able to gain a good footing in London and then make the move with the full support of company 1.

I'm fully aware there's a significant chance of me eventually regretting turning down job 2 as it's such an exciting opportunity, but I really don't know what I want to do or where I want to be in the long term and job 1 keeps more options open.

Once more, thank you all for the advice, it means a lot!

Sounds like a fully considered and reasonable decision, congratulations. And true, you want to get a full expat package and assistance if moving abroad.
I still advise to do it as soon as possible - I've recently had several opportunities that I would have grabbed without second thought as a young single person, but decided to decline as I didn't think they would be the best for my DH and DC. Of course, plenty of people with families re-locate, but it's much, much harder.

Congrats. Was coming on to say without a doubt job 1. For a grad job there are things you need to learn that the bigger intake will allow you to do. Asia will always be there.