was everyone slim in the 1950s/60s

[ambereeree]

I've been watching old films and it seems that everyone was slim in the 50s and 40s. Even women with quite a few children. Is this reality or just in films?

Middle aged females were a bit on the round side but younger were certainly slim. I have some clothes from the 70s marked size 12. There is no way they would be classed as that nowadays. Female I work with wanted something a bit retro for a special night. Offered for her to try them to see if anything she like. My discription of the girl is that she is so thin it's a wonder she has room for all her bits inside. Came to try on and they wouldn't zip up, far too small - she is size 10 now. We have increased in size overall and the sizing has kept pace too. Colleague said the dresses etc were definitely like a size 8 to her.
As for smoking, not many females smoked then, mainly men. It's the diet, portion sizes and all of the takeaway type food we eat that is our problem. Thermal dynamics, we put far too much energy in for what we need.

about the French comparison. There was an interesting article in the Spectator recently saying that the French has less of an obesity problem because more people smoke, and a lot of fat shaming goes on.
I also think that there is a lot of projecting going on in this thread. I haven't seen any comments saying that things used to be better, just that they were different.
Could the posters who think that most posters here are nostalgic and/or delusional (or even - gasp - prone to vote for Brexit. That's how bad we are) please explain why the UK has an obersity problem?

Manic People are generally bigger taller etc. Clothes that are cut too short will be too small also - so I can wear a 10 in XL jeans but would need a 12 in normal L for example as they are slightly too short. And why is it about females I despair I really do.

My Grandad died in 1977 from weight related conditions (diabetes/ heart attack). He was decidedly 'round' too.

As I've said before. And lots of other posters. Yes, we're taller, and have bigger feet. But I have dozens of old sewing patterns from the 1940s onwards and the size 10 patterns, when made up, will not fit today's size 10. In fact there's a big difference.
And, given that I guess that most of the posters here are women, it's hardly surprising that we're talking about women's experience, is it?

Have babies birth weights changed? I was about to suggest that being taller or having bigger feet was a reference to frame size, and that I could never have my grandmother's bust measurement because my ribcage is bigger. But presumably my pelvis is proportionately bigger too? So were babies smaller in granny's day or is pelvis size less variable than height or frame size?

Eppursimuove

I haven't seen any comments suggesting that things used to be better

But I presume you're aware of the concept of tone, of the subtle connotations of language choices? I've tried to explain this many times.

As for why we have an obesity crisis - well, if you haven't managed to pick that up from this thread, you're not too good at reading what's on the lines let alone between the lines.

I'm one of the posters who has found the tone, with all its rose-tinted nostalgia and judgemental othering, distasteful. But I haven't attempted to deny any of the key facts about food being cheaper, more readily available etc.

It's all so obvious. The only mystery is why we need 20 pages about it. Could it possibly be that people enjoy revelling in the whole "this country's going to the dogs" mindset...? Which, of course, brings us right back to Brexit.

And, given that I guess that most of the posters here are women, it's hardly surprising that we're talking about women's experience, is it?

If you say so, it is also because no one is as bothered about the weight of men and fat shaming is far more frequently aimed at women. We may well have to agree to differ on this.

It's all so obvious. The only mystery is why we need 20 pages about it. Could it possibly be that people enjoy revelling in the whole "this country's going to the dogs" mindset...? Which, of course, brings us right back to Brexit.

Or perhaps people just enjoy chatting about their experiences and remembering what life was like when they were younger .

Well, it could be that, Mason - but since this is such a loaded and emotive topic, I highly doubt it. We don't tend to get cheerful, neutral chats about weight-related issues on MN...

we'll have to agree to disagree. I've been on this all the way, and have seen no nostalgia or othering. In fact, the only judging and othering was when a poster claimed that the general thinking on the thread was what had led to Brexit.
I'm finding this thread interesting - bringing back memories of godawful Energen rolls for a start. I, and, I think, other posters would not want to go back to that period. I challenge you to give me an example of nostalgia. Reminiscence is not nostalgia.

We don't tend to get cheerful, neutral chats about weight-related issues on MN..
I actually think that it was, until a few judgemental posters arrived.
Funny how some people are allowed to judge...

Here you go, from a post this morning. All the nostalgia you can handle. The numbered notes are mine.

The upper classes were still at it (1). We didn’t have smartphones. A computer was operated with punched cards that you had to codify. People went to church. There was littltle tv. We played outside. At school the teachers used to beat the students up and not the other way around. There was knife crime (2)

(1) At what??? I feel that we should be told.

(2) I think this was intended to be “there was NO knife crime”.

There was a big story on knife crime in the 50s so I assumed the comment referred to that!

Tiny how we interpret things differently.

Funny not tiny!

I'm not really talking about nostalgia as such. No one has made it sound particularly attractive or suggested that they wish they were back there. It's more the implication that people were better because life was harder and they were resilient, strong and just morally superior to today's fatties.

You're extremely naive if you think this thread was all neutral chat before my "judgemental" comments and others like them! But, you'll find, everyone is allowed to judge, within the guidelines

Or do you think describing people today as "stuffing themselves" is a neutral statement of fact? Really? And that's just one example.

I totally stand by my comments about Brexit. The "everything is going to the dogs" mindset is a documented phenomenon that has been around since the dawn of time. On this thread, some posters have applied this mindset to the obesity generation. It's very much the style of thinking that brought us Brexit. I'm always amazed by the number of people who refuse to see the bigger picture and seem to be allergic to critical thinking.

Spot on, Cressida!

Critical thinking of your way of thinking?

or not of!

I'm not convinced that "critical thinking" = "shoehorning Brexit into everything."

I mentioned France bacause people were complaining about people sounding judgemental and my point was that maybe we are entitled to be judgemental as other western countries (not USA) are not as unhealthy. Recent figures on increase in t2 diabetes are horrendous imv.
But the thread has on the whole been fun- perhaps some debate on weight but mostly light hearted, saying we walked everywhere in the 60s isn't a condemnation of the modern lifestyle it could b a pproval for modern plastics and design that means more people can afford cars now!

I'm sure there was very little knife crime. I do remember a young man was stabbed near Clapham Common in the late50s, and how shocking it was, because it was so rare.

There were horrible gang wars including knives in Glasgow in the 50s.

My Mum lived and worked as a nurse in London in the 50s. She said, on reflection, it was the Krays that kept her safe - knife a nurse/lose your life.

Cressida try some analysis of your own tone, sweeping generalisations, snide labelling and judgementalism.

It's a fairly classic pot and kettle situation.