to think you should pay Mountain Rescue expenses?

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If you are dense enough to head off into the Cairngorms without a map, compass and with only an app on your phone to navigate with?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-45963727

Mountain rescuers spent 6 hours searching for these numpties who were 17 miles from where they should have been.

Tbf you are going to get reluctant people who call for ambulances usually I don't want to be a bother brigade

Who won't call, (sorry)

Why is using a paper map any more likely to stop you getting lost?

Well for a start you don't lose the signal to the map when you're in the mountains.

You wouldn't on a phone map either... GPS doesn't use mobile signals

Maybe Mountain Rescue could put together a statement of how much it cost to rescue you in terms of training the team, fuel, vehicles, equipment etc. Then stick it on social media. You'd hope most people would make hefty donations towards the cost but many won't.

YANBU but I would also like drug addicts & pissheads charged everytime they call an ambulance.

An ambulance that drags them out of the gutter every Friday night because they are vomiting or have smashed their head open, while the 94 year old who has broken her hip lays on the cold bathroom floor until her carers come, as she didnt want to waste anyones time at 2 a.m by pressing her lifeline pendant.

Anyway - again YANBU.

Dont get me started on dog walkers that think its a great idea to let their beloved pet off the lead on the coastpath.

Yes they should pay. They were deliberately reckless

The problem is that it sets a precedent and it is near-impossible to then draw a line. Like, should we make people pay for ambulances and hospital treatment if they crash their car because they made a stupid mistake that could have been avoided? What if someone is drunk and falls over and breaks their leg? Or if someone leaves a candle burning at night and their house burns down, should they pay the fire brigade?

As a society we have agreed to cover these expenses as a whole through taxes, including for the stupid idiots who brought it on themselves. It's just simpler and more humane that way, I think.

The smugness from some on this thread is a bit vomit-inducing. Always the same ones too.

Thank goodness that most aren't so self-satisfied.

for the volunteers and those who put themselves out for other people.

I once saw woman at top of Scarfell Pike in flip flops. How????

I think you ought to have to take out insurance before doing this kind of activity to cover any mountain rescue fees
How would you even begin to enforce that. Would it include going up Catbells? What if you decided to carry on and go up Maiden Moor and then carried on to Fleetwith Pike or Haystacks. At what point are you going to start wanting insurance cover? What about the person who is hugely expiereienced, has all the gear and knows what they are doing but takes a fall or becomes a little disoriented?
So when does a stroll on a the fells become something that needs insurance. Are you going to ask for insurance from a family who want to go walking together for the first time and go up Moel Siabod?

Mountain Rescure covers area that are quite low and not mountainous such as the West Pennine Moors. Families take their kids up to Rivington Pike for a Sunday stroll. They could just as easily need a rescureing if they have an accident. How's the insurance plan going to work then?

I would say the better option is raising awareness and teaching people so they don't do stupid things in the first place. Rather than punishing them financially after the fact.

OP, some people do actually support these charities, quietly, without fanfare or need to tell everybody.

The OS app downloaded to a phone is very useful. Even with good map skills it can be hard to be 100% sure of your location on the map somewhere quite featureless like the cairngorm plateau and almost impossible in poor visibility.

Most people are already very reluctant to call mountain rescue and wait till dark or people get hypothermic rather than calling earlier when they could have been walked out without a helicopter.

I think you ought to have to take out insurance before doing this kind of activity to cover any mountain rescue fees

This wouldn’t work precisely because the people in this report didn’t think they were embarking on a risky activity. People who do appreciate the risk and would insure are least likely to need to call help. Those who are unprepared and don’t realise wouldn’t buy insurance precisely because they don’t realise.

Raising awareness is fine - but this is a case of stating the bleeding obvious.

"Mountains are dangerous places and shouldn't be climbed in your flip flops" is such a obvious statement to 99.99% of the population. Kind of like "don't stick your hand in the fire or you may get burned".

I've often thought the same, but don't think it would work as it would then open the floodgates to other such charges for stupid actions etc. Perhaps when these charities advertise they should emphasise just how much it costs to rescue someone/run their team.

So what do you do if someone won't or can't pay? Refuse to rescue them?
I understand where you are coming from, but unless you are prepared to let people die, it is unworkable.

NEVER rely on a phone to navigate in the mountains. An increasing number of people are having to be rescued when they lose a signal and get lost.

I donate to RNLI. People of all ages, experience levels and abilities run into trouble at sea, not to mention people with varying degrees of income. The service should remain free. Far better that people aren't frightened to call and get a stern telling off for silly behaviour than people die from an accident because people were too afraid to call the coast guard or fear that they can't afford to pay.

Open door policy- and education to try and prevent some of the sillier, avoidable situations.

I think providing a "bill" to these people to show how much their stupidity cost wouldn't be a bad idea. Even if they couldn't cover the full cost of their stupidity it would educate them to be better prepared next time and maybe make a charitable donation to help the people who helped them.

We used a RNLI lifeguard station one summer because DD1 cut her leg open on some rocks when paddling in the sea. Their assistance was only to clean the wound and pop a large plaster on but they were better equipped for a random child injury than I was. I donated £20 to the RNLI as a thank you. It probably didn't cover the cost of the lifeguard and medical supplies but was all I could afford at the time.

I honestly think it's the only decent thing to do if a charity helps you and you're in a position to help them continue to help others.

NEVER rely on a phone to navigate in the mountains. An increasing number of people are having to be rescued when they lose a signal and get lost.

I suppose it depends on the app, but in general, why would you need a signal for an app to work? (Not sure what navigation apps are available, don't thing google maps would be much help. I would assume one designed for wilderness or sea areas would be designed not to rely on a signal.)

I know there was a time when Google navigation didn't work on roads where there was no signal, which was a big problem in the US, but nowadays you can download maps. I permanently have the whole of South-East england installed on my phone.

And when the battery runs out?

The other advantage to a paper map is that it doesn't have a battery which runs out. But of course you need to be able to read and interpret the information on a map, and relate that to what you can see to work out where you are. This is a skill which many people don't have.