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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Dad Lives In Ireland - SHould I be paying for flights for my child to see him?

65 replies

Mommy273 · 15/10/2018 18:25

Hello, just need advice on what I should do.

My child is 3, 4 in Jan. His dad has lived in Ireland since he was 1 and a bit. He sees him a few times a year but every time he takes him over to see his family I have to pay for return flights and they can be expensive ! This time I really cant afford to... I've booked a holiday for his birthday so that's my priority but his dad is saying that seeing him is more important

He also told me that it's the law that I should go and return him back, is this true?

What should I do? I don't think it's fair for my son to miss out on going on holiday for his birthday.

Thanks x

OP posts:
muchalover · 15/10/2018 19:46

Let him take you to court and let them decide. I doubt it would come down in his favour particularly if he doesn't pay regular CM.

Original poster
Mommy273 · 15/10/2018 19:51

I don't think I can get a court order because he doesn't live in U.K.

I know I tried to get an arrangement for CM but they couldn't because

OP posts:
Original poster
Mommy273 · 15/10/2018 19:51

... he lived in Ireland

OP posts:
Alsonification · 15/10/2018 19:52

A little while after myself & my exh split, he moved to Scotland (I’m in Ireland). He lived there for a few years & never once in that time did he ask me to pay anything towards travel costs. He used to pay flights for the kids & his Mam to visit him every 6 weeks or so.
Once when I was going to Edinburgh on a girlie weekend I asked if he wanted me to bring the kids so he could have them an extra weekend but I paid for that as I had offered.

Dollymixture22 · 15/10/2018 19:53

Have I got this right - your ex pays for himself to fly over and visit, but if he chooses to take your son back to Ireland for a visit he expects you to pay??

And he pays limited child support but misses some months?

I think he is being unreasonable. The child wasn’t born in Ireland, you lived together in both countries, therefore if he wants to take he child to Ireland for a visit he should pay -particularly as he isn’t paying proper child support,

Hospitaldramafamily · 15/10/2018 19:55

There's a reciprocal arrangement between Ireland and UK in terms of court orders and maintenance etc. There's no law that says you are responsible for all transport costs

LilMy33 · 15/10/2018 19:56

There’s no law that says you have to cover costs unless it’s beeb written into a court agreement. You can’t afford it because you’re treating your child to what sounds like a holiday he will love. Don’t let anyone make you feel guilty. If his dad and the rest of the family wants to see him that badly I’m sure they will make it possible one way or another. And I’m sure his dad has plenty of spare cash around as it doesn’t sound like he’s paying much in the way of child support.

Hospitaldramafamily · 15/10/2018 19:56

I'm in Ireland and my child's father is in UK

OlennasWimple · 15/10/2018 19:58

There's no law that says that anyone has to pay anything IRO their children. Maybe there shoudl be, but even failing to put food on the table and clothes on their back is neglect rather than "didn't pay the money when they should have", legally speaking

Your ex is talking out of his backside

Siun · 15/10/2018 20:00

Court orders to do with access and maintenance are legally enforceable in Ireland if issued in the uk and vice versa due to the Reciprocal Enforcement Maintenance Orders Act

Siun · 15/10/2018 20:01

Which is EU law so actually now that brexit is here Confused

perfectstorm · 15/10/2018 20:02

As has been said, reciprocal arrangement for child maintenance. He has to pay: www.gov.uk/child-maintenance-if-one-parent-lives-abroad

Unless a court order says you have to pay towards travel, he can sing for it. You don't have to pay and he is bullshitting you in claiming otherwise.

bruce43mydog · 15/10/2018 20:02

He's his dad and as a dad he has a duty to bring your son home. If he wants to live a distance away it's he's choice. Tell him if he doesn't want to pay. Its he's problem you have other things to pay. Tell him that unless he pays then he will have to FaceTime till he can afford the transport fees. I am all for dads seeing there children. but to try and land you financially footing the transport bill isn't right. If you want to be a bit more lenient you could both go 50 50

Missingstreetlife · 15/10/2018 20:02

I think you should get legal advice, what are the chances of him not bringing him back if you don't pay or collect? Can't he sometimes visit here, it's a long way to go regularly. Doesn't sound like he is very consistent about visits, you should have an idea of what is happening when

Siun · 15/10/2018 20:09

@perfectstorm, is brexit going to mean that a uk citzen isnt bound by an irish/ eu law? Do you think ireland and britain will continue to enforce each other's laws when it comes to children or will the co operation disappear post brexit. Im worried now!

dazzlingdeborahrose · 15/10/2018 20:17

The uk and Ireland have had reciprocal arrangements in place for decades and these are outside of EU membership and laws. So the right to reside, work, claim benefits, passport free travel will all remain in place. So an order for child maintenance made in the uk will be enforced in Ireland and vice versa.

slimjemima · 15/10/2018 20:17

So when you split up with DC's dad you were the one who moved away?
I kind of think in that case you should pay

kitkatsky · 15/10/2018 20:25

@Mommy273 it's v easy to get a court order for him to have to pay regular maintenance. It'll cost you about £30. Look into it

ferrier · 15/10/2018 20:33

OP and family lived in England first though. Then moved to Ireland which didn't work out so moved back.
If ex is not paying child maintenance then talk to him about enforcing that via CMS and reciprocal arrangements and including the visitation costs as part of that.

Cailindeas35 · 15/10/2018 20:40

Hi
I have this but the other way round. My ex lives in the uk. He pays all his own flights, his decision to.move country. He comes back once a month to see the kids. Flights can be cheap in or around €100,if you book far enough in advance.
No way I would be paying.

CantWaitToRetire · 15/10/2018 20:41

I would also insist he plan further ahead for visits as you need to be able to budget for them. It's not fair he give you such short notice.

NailsNeedDoing · 15/10/2018 20:45

If you chose to move away, I think 50/50 is more than fair.

pencilpot99 · 15/10/2018 21:14

As PP have said, there is no law (UK, EU or otherwise) that says you have to pay anything - he’s talking rubbish. He would need a court order, which is different (and you would be well aware if he had one).

perfectstorm · 15/10/2018 21:54

@siun the maintenance agreement arrangements started back in 1920. There are quite a few Acts of Parliament involved, and while the EU makes it easier to enforce all sorts of civil contracts and responsibilities across the EU, that reciprocal arrangements deal involves Hague Convention (child abduction) signatories - you can enforce maintenance in Australia and the United States, using it. An Act of Parliament applies unless repealed and I can't see this one being so. Leaving the EU will mean a lot of directives from there suddenly not applying, but it won't repeal domestic legislation. I can't see this affecting you at all - it's not in the interests of the exchequer for parents to be impoverished. In any country.

I'm not a lawyer, but I seriously doubt this is an issue as it is not an EU deal. I think people are confusing it with reciprocal healthcare, which is.

perfectstorm · 15/10/2018 21:56

As PP have said, there is no law (UK, EU or otherwise) that says you have to pay anything - he’s talking rubbish. He would need a court order, which is different (and you would be well aware if he had one).

This.

Incidentally, if he had a child arrangements order you could ask that it include enforceable child maintenance, so he'd be giving you a lot more than you'd be paying out - plus he couldn't just announce a date a couple of weeks in advance, and expect you to pay. So you'd be better off if he did get one, frankly.