Attachment parenting just an excuse for letting kids do whatever?

[Bugsymalonemumof2]

Debate on a local mum page over 3 year olds being expected to sit at a table to eat dinner. One half expect their children to sit and eat and will remove the food if the child is up and down until they sit back down. The other is very much of the view that it doesnr matter if they are up and down as they are only little.

I seem to be seeing more and more examples of attachment parenting becoming an excuse for lazy parenting and it has detracted from the whole idea of it. At my daughter's childminders you can tell the two children who have very vocal attachment parenting mothers as they are the onea who wont sit and listen to stories, wont sit and eat lunch with other kids, have zero routines and zero consideration for any of the kids and not always getting what they want.

Surely you can attachment parent without also letting your child rule the roost and only have their feelings and wants considered.

Maybe I am just a dick with firm bed times (illness and certain circumstances excused) and simple boundaries over meal times.

Some parents do attachment parenting and are pure disciplinarians. I'm not laughing. It does exist. What is described there is more bobo parenting with a notch of pseudo millennial Montessori.

I ticked all the attachment parent boxes.

EBF
Babywore
Co-slept until 3.5
Never cried it out.

But.

My daughter knows to never be rude. To listen. To sit nicely at dinner. To say please and thank you.

I never read a rule about AP that said rules don't apply? Just because we don't shout or hit doesn't mean we don't discipline. In fact non-AP friends have said I'm quite strict.

But DD is happy, polite and very kind.

I do have AP friends with really shitty kids though with zero discipline. Just "no Monty, don't poke Timothy in the eye with a stick" (Monty still pokes)

Does this thread remind anyone else about that thread ages ago with the crunchy mom that wore jeans to church and let her dc run around during the sermon?

Oh that crunchy thread

Attachment parenting seems to only work if it is done thoroughly and properly for an only child or a maximum of two children with a large age gap.

OP, why have you decided these people are "attachment parenting" ?

I'm not sure what attatchent parenting is and its not something we are doing purposely but my kids don't have a bedtime, they go to bed when they want and sleep where they want. Also we're not strict about meal times, eat as much or as little as they want and can leave the table if they need to.
That doesnt mean they don't know how to follow rules though, they listen to me and listen to other adults who are looking after them, sit and listen to stories, sit and eat lunch with other kids and are considerate.

That thread inspired my current username (the mother who deemed herself a bit crunchy )

I am not she!!

I’ve never used the term attachment parenting, but I was fairly relaxed about table manners when my three were toddlers. They’re all now lovely, well-behaved children. Honestly, I think table manners can come later.

Small children should stay seated in places like restaurants for good reason. Do the relaxed parenting types manage to stay relaxed when their children get knocked over when waiting staff or other customers don't see them in time?

Why don't you focus on your own parenting OP and not worry about what others are doing.

I have to agree with this. I think attachment parenting lends itself more to permissive parenting than "non-attachment" parenting does, so while these parents aren't practicing attachment parenting by letting their children run feral, their attachment parenting ideologies tend to more easily slide into permissive parenting.

It's just a phrase, there are many books and ideas as to what attachment parenting even is. Having rules and being authoritarian are separate things, as is having very lax rules or no rules with certain aspects, this will be because of personal preference and not because of a parenting dogma. I really liked the dr sears book on AP but in the end you take parts that work for your family, everyone just does what they think is best and what they agree with.

Some things are very much cultural, I would really recommend the book how eskimos keep their babies warm, it describes parenting and how different it is around the world.

Yeah basically

I guess people would describe how I parent as AP. I breastfed until he chose to stop, I coslept on and off and do still sort of at 2.5 in that I go to him if he wakes and I generally fall asleep in his bed. He was in the sling a lot.

Having said that, I can see that ds is a very strong willed child and he already needs very firm boundaries. I’ve worked hard to discipline him in a way that agrees with us both and it is paying off. He responds well to a firm ‘no.’ If he insists on doing it again he is removed from the situation. At the same time, if he has a tantrum 9/10 it’s because of frustration or over tired ness and is fixed with the offer of a cuddle.

There is no reason for children not to have boundaries and routine. Ds has had a bedtime routine since he was 8 weeks old and it works well for him - it was guided by him and therefore works best for all of us.

I refer to it as attachment parenting purely because it is how the wishy washy parenting refer to themselves and how they label their parenting which as others have said it is actually permissive parenting. I just find is frustrating people have stolen the term to describe their non parenting.

Attachment parenting is about nurturing parent-baby bonding in traditional evolutionary ways, basically getting back to what our ancestors have done throughout time to foster strong bonds with their babies (which by the way you can do in lots of different ways, not just breastfeeding and cosleeping). But no one’s bonds are nurtured by not having boundaries. Children thrive with appropriate boundaries and consistent expectations for behaviour. I don’t know anyone who takes an AP approach who lets their kids run riot. That’s just bad parenting. I would say we tend to be pretty AP in how we parent, but ours sit at the table until everyone is finished their meal, are expected to try everything on their plates, don’t get treats or special meals (one family meal, you eat it or you go to bed hungry). But because we have strong, trusting bonds, I do think it’s probably easier to enforce those expectations as our kids listen to us and trust us because of how we parent (and we just don’t put up with any crap and they know it!).

As well I don’t understand why things like bedtimes and sitting together for meals are so important to other people. Surely that all depends on the preferences of that individual family? I kind of hate it that my daughter goes to bed at 7 - I work full time and I only see her for a few hours a day in the week, I’d love it if she stayed up later but she gets up early so needs her sleep. There are other families where say a SAHM has been run ragged all day and desperately needs her time away from the kids, so maybe bedtimes would be super important to them. But who cares how children are sleeping and eating in other people’s houses? As long as they can behave well, or bad behaviour is suitably managed, in your house then what’s your worry?

People are often so convinced their way is the right way, or that there are things kids “should” do, they never stop to think why. One thing having a very strong willed baby has taught me is that, if I want to hold up good boundaries, I should think bloody hard before saying “No” - I’m going to have to stick to that “no”, come what may, and if twenty mins into an epic tantrum even I can’t remember why it ever seemed like a big deal I’ll feel bloody demoralised and stupid doing so. Part of gentle parenting as far as I can see is to have a wider view - so not “child must go to bed at x o’clock” but “child must be kind and civil to their peers and other adults”, ergo “child must be well-nourished and adequately rested so that they can regulate their mood effectively”, ergo “child must get enough sleep” and work from there in the situation and with that individual child. You work backwards from long term goals and the kind of adult you want to bring up - kind, well-liked, confident, happy - and build your boundaries from that, rather than having an arbitrary set of rules that children must adhere to just because.

I often feel posters who are all “bruhahahugh, load of old nonsense, what’s needed is a bit of old fashioned common sense” frankly are a bit hard of thinking and or don’t want to have to invest a great deal of thought into the theory and practice of parenting, i.e. what they are trying to do and how they are most likely to achieve it. They want it to be straightforward and by and large of minimal inconvenience to themselves. Which is fine and fair enough but doesn’t give them the right to piss all over people who are trying to be s bit more thoughtful about it.

the crunchy mom that wore jeans to church and let her dc run around during the sermon?

That was a great thread

Yabu.

That's not attachment parenting. Just shit parenting. Or what might be known as permissive parenting. Not giving the DC any boundaries, so they don't know how to behave.

I guess I am attachment parent-ish. (Clichés of extended bf, sling using, occasional bed sharing)

But mine have never been allowed to get up and down from tables at any age. Either at home or eating out. Kids need firm boundaries.

AwaAnBileYeHeid
I'm in that group! Partly for the occasional useful ideas-mostly for the eye rolls.
I agree that ap/gentle parenting should involve boundaries. I also see a lot of AP/gentle parents being pretty slack about implementing them in reality. Added to which, there seems to be a tenancy to under estimat age appropriate expectations.
If OP had posted this scanario on that Facebook page she would have got a chorus of people telling her that 3 year old can't possibly sit still through a meal.
If she'd have posted asking how to make a child sit through a meal, there would have been suggestions that she not bother.

I wouldn't call that attachment parenting at all, they aren't responding to their kids needs (for firm boundaries).

@Crunchymum I do often like when you pop up on threads and I'm reminded of that thread again

We were the sit and eat it type. Kids weren't allowed to get up and down. I was brought up the same.
I don't care what other parents do/have done.
I don't understand the attachment bit, sorry.

I do what I call 'lazy parenting (TM)'

In their infancy DDs were attachment parented as in; wearing slings, BF, rapid return rather than CIO, co-sleeping. This was 'lazy' in that I could generally comfort a child and get sleep myself.

Now they are primary school aged I still sort of 'attachment' them. If they fall they can run to me for a cuddle immediately. If upset I'll take them for a hug. If ill we'll sleep in the same room. However my version of 'lazy parenting' is to set firm boundaries and issue fair repercussions for if they are ignored. We eat at the table together and they ask to get down. They get off electronic devices after a 5-10 min warning, or they lose it for a week. They go to bed, and get ready for school on time or they lose out on time. 'You waste my time and I'll waste yours' is a mantra here.

It's 'lazy' because I set and keep the rules and we rarely have to battle them. except the leave for school on time one, that's our current battle I attachment parent and am strict. Attachment to me means secure, and secure enough to endure a bollocking if needed.

I don't understand permissive parenting, you have an easy time now by not arguing/setting boundaries. It's not really easier in the short term, but then you have an uphill struggle for the rest of the time. There are children like that in my DD's classes and I despair of the fluffy parenting that results in children that will not do as the teacher asks disturbing the whole class, and who have learned to manipulate their parents people and cause friendship difficulties for all in the playground.

I am a bona fide lentil weaving, cotton wearing attachment parent who will use complimentary therapies as well as good-ole calpol. But my kids are not the ones you're thinking about. Don't get confused by terminology.