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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to want my money back for this car?

94 replies

flamingofridays · 05/10/2018 14:26

sorry, posting in AIBU as I thought it would get more traffic no pun intended than legal.

I bought a car 6 days ago from a dealer, not a main one like ford or citroen but an independent garage. test drove it, seemed fine, no lights on etc.

We part ex'd my partners car, which was worth more and so we ended up with the new car and some cash (this might be relevant)

anyway, yesterday it broke down. Its an auto and it had a gearbox fault in which it just couldn't select a gear, less than ideal as I got stuck on a junction at rush hour. I pulled over as far as I could roll, and had a look at the manual which basically said get it to a garage. I started it again and it ran so drove it home.

I spoke to the garage this morning who didn't give a shit, and said to speak to their warranty people, now to me a gearbox is a massive issue, and on googling is a common fault for this car, and is v expensive to fix. I told them I didn't want it fixing, I wanted to return it for a refund as per my rights. They said no, as the manager wasn't in until next Thursday. I did however ring the warranty people who said I was well within my rights to return It, but If I want it fixing, get a quote for it and they will pay out up to £500.

I spoke to citizens advice and they told me write a letter to the garage with what I want and my rights, so I have done that and will send it later today.

AIBU to think that they will have to accept this and give me my money back, or am I going to end up in small claims court and having to pull another however many grand out my arse for a new car in the mean time?

has anyone had any experience of this?

thanks!

OP posts:
Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:08

blue yes I would rather go back to him and pay for a print out.

I spoke to the garage they wanted me to take it to and he giggled at me and said why have they told you to speak to us, we don't deal with automatics. The thing is though - they did the MOT and service apparently, so that cant have been entirely thorough can it?

wee I did ask that but they said it was irrelevant which I suppose it kind of it. If it comes to it ill take our old car back and then trade it in for something else. I would just rather have the value of the car for ease, but whatever happens I just want rid of this bag of shit they've sold me!

bus its really not more complicated than having 30 days, its an 11 plate, the gearbox shouldn't be failing! They sold me a working car, its not working!

thenightsky yes I have just spoken to a colleague who said he had the same car a couple of years ago, exactly same issues as mine and they ended up selling it for parts (they had bought it from a private seller so no rights!)

makes note to self not to replace with a honda jazz!

OP posts:
rockchickchickyrock · 09/10/2018 11:13

We recently rejected a car but it was brand new off the forecourt and broke down on day 30 of us owning it. Up to 30 days you have a right to reject the vehicle and return for a full refund without the garage having a chance to fix it. Over 30 days and up to 6 months I think the garage can have up to two chances to fix it (if is breaks down again) my friend is a solicitor and advised me to email the garage before midnight on that first day to advise that pending the outcome of the initial investigation we reserved the right to reject the vehicle. (So we had it recorded and documented at that time and date as a record) the car was fixed and returned to us but broke down again 3 days later, so we then rejected it outright which the garage accepted. It might be an idea to have a solicitor give you some advice? We didn’t need to use my friends services in the end but would have paid for her to get involved legally if we had needed to. Of course the law may be slightly different in regards to new car sales Vs used car sales but at the end of the day the car is not fit for the purpose it was sold. I would make a diary/timeline of events (include any phone calls/conversations and who said what) to help your case too (advised by my friend) and also email the garage the timeline and what you wish to do/your intentions so all communication is on record where possible.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:13

maverick yes warranty limit of £500 in total.
I am really trying my best to return it and know all my rights, but they are trying to convince me they have the right for them to diagnose the faults and fix them but I don't want that. ive read several horror stories on the fiat forum where people have payed £1500 plus for a whole new gearbox and its lasted 2 years and gone again.

I do not need this stress in my life! We are also moving in aprox 3 weeks (which is why we need the car as I will have to drive to work!) so this isn't something that can drag on.

if it comes to it I will have to take them to small claims court and buy another car out my own pocket which is less than ideal! but needs must! I am hoping it will not come to that!

OP posts:
buscaution · 09/10/2018 11:19

Age and mileage are absolutely relevant in second have car sales.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:21

rock thank you for that, I have just written down everything that has happened so far and when it happened and what the garage have said.

I have sent them a letter as per citizens advice, but they don't deal with emails (or have an email address they are willing to give me!)

I will send them another letter, I think, and a copy of the pictures with the fault codes and what their garage said about them not dealing with autos and ask them to refund me, again!

might speak to citizens advice again first though see if they have any advice on how to word it etc

OP posts:
buscaution · 09/10/2018 11:23

For for purpose takes into consideration age and mileage on second hand vehicles.

I wish it were as simple as 30 days to return, but it's not.

We have had fleet vehicles pass MOT (council test centre) and break down the same day. It's not because of a dodgy MOT, it's just because cars suffer wear and tear.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:23

bus we obviously new the age and milage, but they still sold us it as a working car, MOT's and serviced the day before we collected it.

It has major faults! that to me is not a working car, no matter how many miles its done or how old it is.

Fair enough if I spent £500 quid on something with a short MOT and no service I might think fair enough, but I didn't I spent 3 grand on something that was apparently in good condition and most importantly working!!

OP posts:
Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:24

but they clearly sold me it not working!

OP posts:
buscaution · 09/10/2018 11:24

Cross posted, but still.

Example - 3 year old car, high mileage. MOT council test centre. Shock absorber goes on the way out. Dodgy MOT? No, bad luck!

buscaution · 09/10/2018 11:25

But it did work, it broke down after you took it away?

I'm not arguing against you, it's shit, but in terms of second hand car sales, that will be their angle.

Celebelly · 09/10/2018 11:29

I wouldn't get hung up on the MOT/service thing. Those are only checking specific things. There's lots that can go wrong that aren't in the remit of either.

We took our car to be MOT'd recently knowing it wasn't working properly but it passed the MOT as it wasn't something that would have been an MOT fail.

Still, they should be taking it more seriously if it broke down within a week, even if just from a customer service point of view.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 09/10/2018 11:29

Also remember that, as a dealer, they have a higher responsibility to ensure the car is fit for purpose... many will try to caveat emptor you, but that was changed, years ago with care dealers!

For those not sure

www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/your-rights-if-something-is-wrong-with-your-car

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:30

but its not something like that bus its a major fault, an electrical fault which hasn't just occurred after we bought it, but obviously it didn't break down on the test drive so we thought there was nothing wrong.

yes it broke down 6 days late.

this is what the Money advice service website says

The Act states the car must be “of a satisfactory quality”, “fit for purpose” and “as described”. (For a used car, “satisfactory quality” takes into account the car’s age and mileage.)
You have a right to reject something faulty and you are entitled to a full refund within 30 days of purchase in most cases.

its not as described because it doesn't work! its not of satisfactory quality either (because it doesn't bloody work!) and to be fair its only 7 years old so taking that into account, i would say they should take it back!

OP posts:
notapizzaeater · 09/10/2018 11:31

Hve you legal insurance on your house insurance, a letter from a Solicitor reminding them of your rights might make them pay attention

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:31

they to be fair, haven't mentioned the words wear and tear, and also haven't said tough shit its 7 years old that's what happens.

they just want to make me jump through hoops!

OP posts:
Chocolatedeficitdisorder · 09/10/2018 11:31

I wouldn't be so keen to part with this car as you seem to be. An automatic gearbox is a big repair and I had to scrap a car that needed one as it was an unviable repair.

If this car suits you (and it must do as you bought it), then why not get the gearbox replaced under warranty? At least you know that it's done and you won't be doing it again. If you can get them to repair the issues then you benefit now, rather than having to do similar repairs a year down the line.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:32

pizza ooh i have! i did not know it covered that. i will look into that now thank you!

OP posts:
araiwa · 09/10/2018 11:36

Im surprised a 7 year old fiat made it 6 days tbh

Why didnt you google it before you bought it.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:36

chocolate the warranty only covers £500 and the repair would be about 3 times that! i have also seen several stories about the same make and model of car going again even with a new gearbox.

the garage that "don't deal with automatics" have called me back and now want to look at it! he said it sounds like they will refund me but they want to make sure there really is a fault. hmmm.

i cant go tomorrow as im at work but DP will take it and have strict instructions to oversee what the machine says and not take any shit! he is sometimes too passive for his own good.

OP posts:
Original poster
flamingofridays · 09/10/2018 11:37

araiwa i did but i clearly didn't read thoroughly enough :(

OP posts:
MaverickSnoopy · 09/10/2018 11:57

As an aside if you want to email them then get a willing friend to phone them as an interested customer who needs their email address for some reason or other. Perhaps friend wants them to email her some details about a car....

Judashascomeintosomemoney · 09/10/2018 12:03

Under the consumer rights act, if you’re rejecting this car within the 30 day period it is very important you stop using it immediately, that’s clearly stated in the terms of the act. IE you shouldn’t be driving it around getting garages to look at it (yours or theirs) because this could give the seller a reason to claim you have caused/worsened the issue. The seller can get their garage to look at it if they want after you have rejected it but that’s got nothing to do with you, they should arrange collection of it.

Judashascomeintosomemoney · 09/10/2018 12:05

Completely agree with everyone saying put it in writing/email btw, I’ve had to rely on this in the past and having clear chronological evidence really helped.

JeanPagett · 09/10/2018 12:06

It sounds like the garage are trying delaying tactics in the hope you'll go over the 1 month limit.

Personally I'd go to the garage, with the relevant legislation on hand, and insist that they refund you. I assume given your partner's previous car was traded in, that you will get to keep the extra cash provided the traded in car isn't also returned to you (iyswim).

Very sadly if it was me I'd take my DH or dad with me to the garage as I think they might get taken more seriously. Angry

1tisILeClerc · 09/10/2018 12:09

A MOT only really covers safety issues (that it can stop safely, lights etc are working and the suspension won't fail so you could end up veering off the road). Pollution levels are also recorded.
In many respects making it GO isn't covered.
It also only claims the vehicle was fit at the moment they tested it, so 10 minutes later it could not be although if items in their experience MIGHT fail are recorded.