To think at some point you have to reign in your personal life to stop it effecting work?

[overagain]

I have a friend, she has a number of health issues and also doesn't seem to handle stress very well but instead of learning techniques to help herself she takes it out on work. It seems to be a cycle that happens about every 3 years:

Gets a new job - likes new job, tries to get a promotion - doesn't get it- her health deteriorates - has time off - has a personal crisis - has time off - gets picked up at work for the deterioration in her work and her absence - goes through disciplinary proceedings - somehow keeps her job - puts in a grievance against a manager - applies for new job.

The first time I was really sympathetic and understanding, offered her advice and supported her through it. Second time I was supportive but gave her a bit of a tough talking to about the need to learn resilience and strategies and helped her with some ideas. Third time I was still supportive but distanced myself a little. She's now just called me again to say she has a disciplinary hearing next week as her boss is picking on her and thinks she should be doing more work than she is. She's been off for 5 weeks earlier this year and had a phased return to work, she was back to her normal hours for 3 weeks then took time off again for personal stress (3 weeks) came back on reduced workload, was then off again for 2 weeks for personal reasons and has been back in work for around 6 weeks now but hasn't increased her workload and isn't fulfilling her responsibilities.

I just don't know what to do. She's very highly strung and takes things very personally and feels attacked if things are brought up with her. She feels work should be more sympathetic to her personal issues and shouldn't be hounding her about getting her job done.

12 years, 4 jobs and 4 disciplinary's. it can't just be bad managers and bad luck can it?

Over again, I actually have to practice certain tasks that I have to do at home, over and over again. So you never know how people can be affected by things.

To the person who said they had a SD, yeah I totally understand that. I have an obvious disability, that does complicate things, but not as much as learning difficulties can. I do very well, as I said, but I have a lot of very good support around me and I have never been one of these people who gives up. But little things can make me so tired. I am studying in Greece at the moment, and the lessons are three hours each, all in Greek, sometimes two lessons back to back. I have done two days and I was crying on the second day. And I’m having to practice actually sitting in a three hour lecture in Greek, at home. People don’t realize the extra work that goes into everything I do. And if I don’t have a very supportive bunch of people around, I fall apart. So really, don’t be so hard on your colleague. You might not have any idea what she is going through. People don’t always say.

LanceStatersGold that was one of my suggestions a previous times, which she took. She's since had a new job and whilst has some flexible working isn't able to do it as much as she would like due to the parameters of the job.

Immigrantsong I don't think being a friend should mean just agreeing with everything, so agreeing her managers are wrong or that she hasn't played a part in this. I think being a friend is about telling people the truth in a kind, loving and supportive way and offering ways to help, or they could help themselves. I don't think low of her. I am however concerned that she isn't always going to keep her job and how she is going to cope if that happens, emotionally and financially. I'd like to help her stop that happening.

This isn't her personal life causing these issues though, is it, so the work/life balance is a bit of a red herring. This is her reacting to not getting promoted. It sounds like her confidence and self esteem is really tied into other people giving her good feedback, she takes it really personally and essentially feels her bubble has burst, so acts out a bit. There's no way she'd see it as anything other than being unfairly treated, so be careful how you support her.

Just about everyone who is able to pull their socks up and get on with the job does. The people who repeatedly get mired in stress-related sick leave, grievances, etc, in job after job generally have problems with their mental health (diagnosed or otherwise) which makes the resilience most of us take for granted very difficult for them to achieve.

It can be draining trying to support someone who struggles to see their own part in situations, particularly if you're more a problem-solver type. Try simply listening rather than trying to fix things and you may find it less frustrating.

When I was a union rep, an awful lot of my time was occupied by "difficult" people who had problems similar to your friend's. There are often underlying issues, whether it's related to MH, ASD, dyspraxia or others.

About the only thing I can suggest is that you gently point out that there is a pattern here and she needs to try and work out what it is (probably with the help of GP/other health professionals).

The only problem is that people like this will usually take umbrage when you suggest that they are part of the problem! Good luck.

hellokittymania she isn't my colleague, she's my friend. I've never worked with her, we work in very different fields so have no idea if she is good at what she does or not - she says she is and at least at first this is reflected in comments from managers.

She certainly doesn't have a diagnosis of ASD but that isn't to say she doesn't have it, I'm not sure she'd accept if I mentioned that though. I am worried that she isn't accepting of a MH diagnosis for fear of stigma, which is impacting on her as she isn't receiving treatment.

It's taken me many years to realise what works for me on a professional level.

I continue to work a 4 day week even though DS is in secondary school , firstly because I'm lucky enough to be well paid enough to afford to, but secondly as I do tend to take things to heart and get easily worked up so having the balance of 3 days off really helps.

Likewise I could probably get a promotion, but I now know that I'm not one of those people who is happy to pick up emails at the weekend or on holiday, or work very long hours over a period of time. It impacts my mental health too much to do that and I am no longer good at my job or home life.

I agree that her circumstances don't sound like a coincidence, but you've tried dispensing tough love to your friend. She doesn't want to hear it. Therefore either stay away or offer distracting things to do like going to the cinema with her to take her mind off things, that mean you don't need to say anything but you are spending time with her.

PawsomePugFancier I think you may be right. She does find criticism hard to take, and I have noticed that if her job role changes slightly to include something she isn't immediately good at then she really struggles. We all have bits of our job we find harder than others, but she does struggle with struggling.

I would bloody love it if my personal life would effect my work. Save me a world of bother.

You don’t have to do anything though do you? It’s her life. If you have had enough then withdraw from the friendship. Maybe you could suggest some counselling.

Sounds like she has a victim complex, there's no helping someone with that until they can face up to it and are willing to change.

I don't think she's had a run of bad luck. It's pretty normal over a twelve year period to have had a miscarriage, moved house, fallen out with family, had some bouts of ill health etc. They are the downs of an average up and down life - common stresses. Is she one of those people who thinks she;s the only one with problems because she talks about them all the time while other people keep quiet and carry on?

4 jobs in 12 years isn't that bad actually. I thought you were going to say she changes jobs every year....

to rein in

There are some people that at the first sign of problems, from minor to major, that will become ill and, perhaps if I use the phrase "give up", trying.

In some people's case that will be that their MH is precarious and what can seem little tips them over.
In other people's case it will be that they are looking to manipulate the situation into them becoming the victim.
And for some people it will be a mixture.

The problem is that working out which a particular person is doing is pretty much impossible for certain.

Adding to it, if they do generally do that, then they see themselves as someone who can't cope with those situations and so don't try.

If I compare two of my dc.
One if she is feeling ill on a school day will start off by getting up and trying to eat something. She'll get dressed and take painkillers and generally once she's up will decide she's going to be okay. If she doesn't think she's going to be okay, then she considers whether she will manage the first lesson etc. She'll go in saying if she's not coping then she'll come home.
My second one, will decide very quickly that she's not okay, and won't get out of bed because she "knows" she won't cope with school.

Now, sometimes I have been telling the first that she isn't up to going. And sometimes I am pretty certain that if the second one had got in then she'd have been fine.
But it perpetuates. Because the first one is more able to assess that actually she coped with the morning last time she felt like that, so she can probably cope again. The other one hasn't tried so assumes she won't cope again.

I think there does come a point where we have to leave our home problems at home, not talking about reasonable accommodation for disabilities or doctor confirmed ill-health but constant wearing home dramas.

I have a coworker like this; the company has bent over backwards to accommodate her various absences, her breakdowns in the workplace and her seeming inability to complete her given tasks or even start them in some cases. She's been moved from department to department because she seems to have problems with all her supervisors who aren't monsters - they just want her to do her bloody job.

Yesterday she spent most of the morning walking up and down the corridor outside the main office glued to her phone arguing and crying with her boyfriend. After lunch she deigned to go back to her workstation and blew up at her supervisor who had asked her for some paperwork he needed to complete an urgent order. She hadn't done it because drama/crisis at home.

She then stormed out because he told her it wasn't acceptable. Whether she'll come in today is anyone's guess but she's about worn out her welcome in all but my department. I'll strenuously resist having her, so will my co-managers, for one thing she has no experience or training in our area and for another her reputation has gone before her and we have neither the time nor the energy to deal with her ongoing issues.

Namechange8471 yes, not bad at all. It's the 4 jobs, 4 disciplinary hearings and 4 grievances that I find concerning.

Aspenfrost indeed. I am not on form today!

Minapaws, yes, I don't think she had any more bad luck than anyone else (I've gone through all of those things in that time too, as have many others) and I do feel for her when she has had low points, try and be supportive etc.

This thread has actually been quite helpful in how I can help her and see things from a different perspective.

I reigned in my work to stop it interfering with my personal life

Exactly! In my experience it's much more likely for work to affect your personal life than the other way round. My personal life hasn't ever made me stressed and depressed, but work certainly has!

" ...but she does struggle with struggling" - you know you wrote that down OP yeah? You didn't just think it?

My teenage DD has developed severe mental health issues, actually I've just got off the phone to one of my parent support group. I resigned from a job in March and got one where they allow me to work from home, just as well I did as my DD now needs someone at home 24/7 and I am usually the person she wants.

I am often on phone calls to health professionals, arguing with the school and local authority etc., thank god my employer is a faith based organisation and value family life otherwise I'd be fucked. This isn't the first time in my life a crisis has happened that affected work, and clearly according to you that's some sort of moral failing on my part. Glad you aren't so weak eh?

I do have friends like you. I don't see or speak to them though.

She sounds like an extreme case, overagain . i've had a colleague like that - bright and on a good day, capable, but has sooo much time off sick through stress, very sensitive to other's remarks.

Her friends would big her up, saying she was so good, such an asset, but I'd think - she wasn't bloody there enough to do the job in anyway efficiently..
I thought she'd be better off picking a more straightforward, stress free job, but maybe there's no such thing.

At the end of the day if you're going to be employed, you kinda have to be useful to that organisation.

Elephant14 I don't see what's wrong with it? No one likes not being good at something but she seems to take it more to heart for some reason. That's all I meant.

I didn't say I'm not weak. I actually have MH issues of my own. My friend denies she has MH issues, sees them as a weakness.

@Elephant14 is there a need to be so aggressive? Of course everyone can have a period or two of having some personal circumstances affecting work - it's part of being a human being as well as an employee.

4 disciplinaries though - all following essentially the same pattern of behaviour? That's a big red flag that the op's friend has some kind of underlying issues she needs to sort out, first step by acknowledging it, then by either treatment or getting a more manageable job. It can't just be coincidence at this point.

At the end of the day if you're going to be employed, you kinda have to be useful to that organisation.

That's the rub imo.

This is a tough one OP. Perhaps she really isn’t fit for work but can’t afford to rely solely on benefits? I went on maternity leave for 3 months (as that was all I would receive full pay for) and went back to work when my son was 14 weeks old because if I didn’t I would have had to repay my maternity pay. 6 weeks after I went back to work I was diagnosed with anxiety and depression and signed off for 6 months, I had to go back after 6 months or stop being paid. I went back for another her 5 months before an almighty breakdown at work where my managers and I agreed I needed to leave and I left with 6 weeks pay. I also in this time had a disciplinary. I’ve never had a disciplinary before, I’ve never even had a detention but my mental state and judgement were impaired.

What I’m trying to say is money may be a major factor (as it was for me) and I’m sure people at work spoke about me being off all the time, but keeping a roof over my head was more important to me than taking on workload at work. Just try and be sympathetic as you may not know everything about her situation. And it doesn’t affect you directly so not sure why you would be so annoyed.

MaryBoBary it isn't money. She considers herself very career driven and her DH earns a shit tonne (her words). She doesn't have to work and could stay at home if she wanted. Like me, I think work gives her a sense of purpose.

I'm not annoyed at her, I'm concerned for her. She's obviously very distressed that she is going through all this again and feels it is very unfair on top of everything else she has going on.

@overagain

How come you know so much about her life, her health, her husband's income, how many disciplinaries she has had at work etc etc, in so much detail? And why are you so heavily invested in her life?

Maybe you should stay out of her business?!

I agree with the posters at the bottom of page 1; you sound like a lousy friend, and this woman would be better off without you in her life.

She seems to piss you off so much, so why are you even friends with her? You don't seem to be bringing anything to her life. Do her a favour and cut her loose!