Children "starting school"?

[Jinglesplodge]

So I need to know if I ABU - this one is really petty but it's starting to annoy me...

AIBU to find it irritating when people talk about their children going to school when they're talking about 2 or 3 year olds and they mean nursery or preschool? I can't even put my finger on why it bothers me but I just think kids spend enough years in school without telling them that's what they're doing at 2. Twice this weekend I've been chatting to friends who have said something along the lines of "oh, we wanted to do swimming lessons but Quentin is in school" or "I can't believe Susan is starting school next week".

I think I'm just tired and grumpy but I'd love to hear I'm not the only one!

Er preSCHOOL!
Play group is different, that's toys in a church hall with coffee and parents stay with them.
Nursery or Montessori would also be acceptable terms, but there's nothing wrong with school.

As an aside, here in Ireland we don't use the word nursery at all. It's crèche if it's all day or they're too young for the free two ECCE years we have here. Then it's called Montessori (if it is one) or preschool.

kenandbarbie Play group is different, that's toys in a church hall with coffee and parents stay with them.
Not necessarily. Playgroup and preschool are both terms used for funded early education provision. I worked for many years as an early years adviser and visited all settings that were funded to provide early education. Their titles ranged from nursery to playgroup to preschool to kindergarten ......

My Almost three year old goes to pre-school, we call it pre-school as it's called [name of village] Pre-School. She sometimes calls it school too as She is desperate to be like her big cousin who is at school!
She also wears a uniform t-shirt and sweatshirt, I love it as it means her own clothes don't get trashed!

My just turned 4 year old is in the foundation year at school, in the same classroom as reception and with the same teacher and TA that he will be having when he starts reception next September. His sibling is in year 2 at the same school. Of course we're going to call it school! He used to go to pre-school until, like many village preschools, it closed down.
I get the impression that teacher aims to have them all reading by the time they start reception though. Fine for ds who has a September birthday and whose July/August birthday friends have started properly already, but I'm not sure I'd be particularly pleased about 'work' if my DS had turned 3 in the summer.

This annoys me too. Its not school

I think there’s plenty more shit to get your knickers in a knot over tbh

captain proton yes of course I realise not all private schools assess and are also not in Grammar areas. My argument (and incredulity) is not at the decision to privately educate - that is personal choice.. but at the moral values held by a school that assess (and thus must have a criteria that rejects) 3 yr olds !

However I do accept that this is a definitely 'off topic'.. but couldn't let the casual acceptance of such an awful practice pass without comment!

I would assume that if one chooses Private education and there is a space at the school. The only correct 'selection' is that the parents or guardians can pay. ! Not that 'little Chloe' behave or exhibit any particular characteristic worthy of assessment at 3 yrs old !

Playgroup sounds like some old fashioned mothers’ meeting and is so different to nursery or school.

Playgroup the parents stay with the child.

Nursery (private) kids get dropped off and don’t always have to wear a uniform, some do. Nursery practitioners are not teachers in most settings.

School nursery, feels more like a school. Wears a uniform, calls the teachers “miss or mr”, they are fully qualified teachers. There’s a difference, but it doesn’t bother me what it is called either!

I wouldn't call it school to another adult as it would be confusing. My DC both felt like they started school when they started nursery though. It was in the same building as reception they played on the field with reception children, went to lunch with the school children had the same uniform, had a similar day to reception children. Both just saw the move from nursery to reception as the first of many year group moves.

Er preSCHOOL!

Not sure which angle you're coming at this from - I would go for the opposite emphasis - PRE-school - as in its where you go before you start actual school! That's what the "pre-" prefix means, surely??

Re: labels - I don't think it's anything like as straightforward as some posters are suggesting. I would also at first glance assume 'playgroup' was the sort of thing that happens in a church hall and parents stay at, but I know of many (private) nurseries which use it as their name. Likewise I think there's huge overlap in the sorts of settings which call themselves nurseries or pre schools. I'm not sure whether 'nursery school' as a title requires that they have teachers on their staff? (All the ones I know do, but so do a lot of the nurseries I know - its outright untrue to say that "nurseries" are only staffed by nursery nurses.)

Likewise - being attached to a school doesn't imply one standard level of integration with the school proper, or carry all the same purported signifiers of 'school', as different experiences show. My son's nursery (with teachers!) involved no assemblies and no uniforms, and the staff were all addressed by their first names, unlike at the school it was attached to. The nursery class at his primary school wear the uniform (optional, but it looks like almost all do), but have limited involvement with the rest of the school. Most of the EYFS/KS1 teachers use first names, as do some of the KS2 ones. OTOH, I know schools locally where the nursery and reception classes function as a single unit.

I hope nobody would be dickish enough to correct a 3yo proudly telling them they go to school now, and of course a parent dropping a 6yo and a 3yo at the same place in the morning is being perfectly reasonable to describe that as the school run etc. But I would find it a bit odd tbh to see "first day at school" photos on fb of a child who has just joined the nursery class, even in a school, and if someone I knew talked about 'school' I would be a bit surprised if a year later they were talking about their kid starting reception etc. Because whilst I know people use the different terms 'nursery/ preschool/ daycare/ playgroup/ nursery school/ nursery class/ kindergarten/ Montessori (this one a bit more specific obvs)' to describe the institutions their PRE-school age children attend, I think it is broadly understood that 'starting school' in this country is something that happens at age 4-5 when they start reception class.

I'm not familiar with the practice of (some?) private schools starting 'school' at age three. I don't really interact socially with anyone who sends their child to private school so this doesn't cross my radar. I am saddened at the thought of three year olds following the reception curriculum tbh - it was a hard enough thing for my 4yo at a very gentle play-based reception class - but that's personal preference I guess. Agree with what others have said about 'selection' at such an age - horrible.

Playgroup the parents stay with the child.
Not if it's a fully funded early education provision they don't. Having "playgroup" in the title doesn't automatically make it a parent coffee morning group.

Every single one of the types setting for education for the year(s) before reception (in England) that have been mentioned on this thread are following the same guidance for a play based learning environment.
What makes me sad is the way some settings (largely schools both independent but also some maintained schools) choose to formalise the provision contrary to the spirit and intention of the EYFS.
Why are parents happy that their 2/3 year olds are sitting in school lunch halls or attending assemblies or having PE lessons they have to have yet another uniform for etc. etc.

When these young children should be being encouraged to develop their imagination and creativity through extended periods of play. Supported and encouraged by adults who guide their learning based on their individual interests and personalities.

They have got years ahead of them to be sat in assemblies and homogenized by the school system.

Playgroup sounds like some old fashioned mothers’ meeting and is so different to nursery or school.

Playgroup the parents stay with the child.

My kids went to playgroup. It was funded early years education, following exactly the same curriculum as nursery schools. The only difference was that it was delivered by early years specialists rather than qualified teachers.

It wasn't a mother and toddler group where parents played along, it was a formal educational setting with uniforms and rigid hours etc.

My son is in the pre-school at his sister’s school.
They wear the same uniform, have the same head teacher, their classrooms are right next to each other, they eat lunch in the same hall and share the playground.
DS has teachers and structured lessons, as well as free play.

They call the nursery class YrN, reception is YrR, Yr1 and so on.

We just call it school because that’s what it is - except I pay for him to go there as opposed to getting it free like the older kids.
It is for all intents and purposes the same as being at school except he’s 3 and it’s non compulsory unlike school (which isn’t even compulsory when most children start at aged 4 anyway)

Heater, just because they wear uniform and go to the odd assembly doesn't mean they aren't following the FP, which in Wales goes all the way up to the end of KS1.

HEster - my DT’s attended school from age 3. Uniform, PE etc. They loved it. The uniform - joggers, a polo shirt and sweatshirt - they were proud of being the same as their older friends and it cut out any hassle in the morning as to what to wear. Their day was play based and age appropriate. My DT’s gained a huge amount from being there and the school was particularly good at helping with their language development. English is their third language and not spoken at home. I’m sure their day was very similar to other children in full time childcare arrangements.

We have such a narrow view of what we want for our youngest children in this country. Actually for all our children.

There is this constant drive to the next target, the next stage of education. Targets for grades and targets for numbers of young people at university (whether or not a degree is the right path for all those young people) .

A view that vocational training/education is lesser than academic achievement.

Childhood and education could and should be so much more.

I'm not for a second saying every child that goes into a formal early education setting is going to be unhappy. They're not - young children are remarkably flexible and resilient. Their default tends to be "happy". But year upon year of not getting it right as they go through the system takes it toll on too many children.

We have a mental health crisis in this country and there is not going to be a simple solution. Its not all due to education but that plays a massive part. Other countries have a much more balanced view.

I realise that this is a digression from the OP so I'll leave it there.

My DD went to playgroup, it ran from 9-12 every morning, parents didn’t stay and they followed the early years curriculum. I suppose the difference between it and nursery was that it wasn’t a childcare facility (although it was housed in the same building as a nursery it was a different entity), it was mornings only and the children didn’t eat meals there.

I can't get worked up about it. DD has just started at pre-school. She has been going to a private nursery since she was one and I do think there is a difference, it certainly feels more 'school' like than the private nursery. She thinks she's going to school, I'm not about to correct her as she is happy with it and loves getting her uniform on and taking her packed lunch. When asked I say she's at the school nursery though but really wouldn't be bothered if people said it was school.

In Wales it's unusual not to send your child to a nursery attached to a school, where your child wears uniform etc. We probably refer to it as starting school here as it's the school they'll attend for 8 years. Also children in school nurseries are taught by qualified teachers so I think that's why it's referred to as "real" school. My mother was a school Nursery teacher for 30 years before becoming a primary head teacher.

Nursery or pre-school. It's not school.

Have you not read the thread, RangeRider? In some cases, yes. It is.

Err the thread has a variety of opinions ProfessorMoody including those who don't regard a child attending a school nursery as being "at school" or having "started school".