In thinking almost 5 grand for a school trip is beyond the joke ??

[BabySharkAteMyHamster]

We live in a town with a massive, rich poor divide. A lot of jobs here are highly skilled so if you can't do those there's little else. It has massive pits of deprivation as well as very wealthy areas.

There are two schools. One being an academy in the middle of one of the poorest areas of the town but also next to an estate where houses sell for upwards of 500k.

Who the hell thinks these trips are a good idea ?? It serves nothing but to highlight the massive rich poor divide and yet again kids who have heard 'no' pretty much from the day they were born will be on the outside looking in whilst the wealthier kids swan off on a month long trip to south America to build schools and lord knows what else . Options are pay half now and half later or pay £60 per week for the next 2 years (( my food bill ))

Why the hell arent these things capped ?? £1000 yes, families could make cutbacks over 2 years and give their kids a chance to experience life outside their barrier but 5 grand is just an impossible task for so many.

Considering so many schools these days obsess over stupid details on school uniforms so that 'every child is equal' isnt it a bit odd they seem to think it's ok to constantly remind them just how unequal they actually are 🤔🤷‍♀️

@MrsJayy, I know right! With the teenagers parents saying "oh, but it's so good for their personal development to meet all these rich white kids"...Honestly, whenever anyone justifies why these trips are good, it's always what THEY gained out of it and what lessons THEY learned. The kids on the other side gain fuck all apart from structurally un-sound buildings that have to be torn down, a revolving door of white faces that get attached to their kids for 2 weeks at a time, and loads of patronising selfies. Let's face it, it was never really about the impoverished kids....because if someone really wanted to help, they would go to their local soup kitchen, wildlife reserve or old peoples home. If you want to go on a fancy holiday then don't dress it up under the guise of altruism - just go on a holiday! You'd contribute a lot more to the local economy just by being a tourist and spending money there.

Also, bad ethics aside, these trips are a complete rip-off for what they are - for 2 grand you could go abroad in June (after A-levels) somewhere "exotic" for about a month, with people you actually like, on your own itinerary. If my kid had that kind of money through a part-time job or savings, I'd encourage them to organise their own exotic trip with their mates than some ripoff organised by World Challenge.

Everything you said @yoloSwaggins this is exactly how I feel about these trips

Ultimately these trips have absolutely no place in state run secondary schools. All trips should be available to all children. If the child wants to go - then the school fund should be paying for children who's parents can't afford it.
Why the hell are 'educational trips' (which I assume are the essence of these trips - or why are they even in offer via the school ?) Only available based on the economic situation of the parents - in a state system that should be available equally for all.

Wrong wrong wrong.
Don't even get me started on school uniform - another method of selection that deters the poorer parents and creates 'posh' secondaries and second class ones..

Think how far that kind of money would go at a local food bank or women's shelter.

You don't have to travel thousands of miles from the UK to find enormous need.

Misses point of post but..

Does anybody know if you can use childcare vouchers to pay for school residential trips?

Oh and uanbu

HMBB unless the rules have changed recently it seems you can't. See here: www.parliament.uk/business/publications/written-questions-answers-statements/written-question/Commons/2016-11-07/52189

Wow and I thought £500 for a Year 6 trip was unreasonable (it still is)Ridiculous. All these trips should be scrapped imo.

I get them if they enrich the curriculum and offer an experience that a family might not afford. I once did a trip to The Globe in London. It was a 2 day trip and students watched a show. It was affordable and we offered financial assistance to relevant families. Ultimately for some students their family could afford sending one child on a readonably priced school trip (think coach and youth hostel) but couldn't have afforded a family trip to London. When it came to teaching Shakespeare the following year for their GCSE text, the studnets who had gone on the trip were able to draw on those experiences.We managed to fit in one of the big museums too that wasn't English based but was educational (and I think had an exhibit linking to topics in some option subjects If I remember correctly, but that was cooincidence) I'd absolutely stand by the merits of that trip. It was an optional trip but one that offered students the chance to see and do things most wouldnt with family.

Maisy - your Globe/museum London trip is, of course, of a shape and size and substance that falls within a reasonable definition of a school trip. Not a disguised status symbol holiday but an educational outing that enriches classroom learning.

I would agree user. It was education, still cost a few hundred but added something. I've also staffed some overseas trips (which some on here would probably argue was me trying to get a jolly paid for my parents). Yes, they cost money. But like the London trip, staff were giving up part of their holiday unpaid to run them. Of course we enjoy trips linked to our subject or chosen extra curricular activities, but none of them were jollies. If I had a choice between a holiday with my DH or staffing a school trip then I'd rather go somewhere with DH than have 30-60 teenagers in Europe. Not all trips that are slightly more expensive are awful. For some it does mean a child can experience things that their family couldn't do for the whole family. Any trip that is about patting middle class western kids on the back and pretending they've saved the oceans, saved the orphans etc should be stopped in my opinion.

I have had dealings with World Challenge and another organisation that do trips and experiences to far flung places for teenagers. The trips sound amazing! However, if you are seriously considering your teenager taking part make sure to ask about the contingency plans if things go wrong. Things do go wrong and I was regularly astounded by the lack of organisation and quite honestly incompetence of some people in the organisation. As a result I would never consider allowing any of my children taking part in those trips.

chilli and factor in that having raised thousands of pounds to go, there's a lot of added extras when you get there if you want to make the most of being overseas (from what I've heard students and staff end up buying most of the expedition outings on top of their fee when they get there). Someoje is getting very wealthy off these sorts of trips.

Chilli21 - why am I not surprised? Travelopia, the owner of World Challenge, is a highly profit driven organisation. Of course it is going to employ people who buy into its fallacious marketing and are hence slightly stupid/naive/inexperienced.

Someone is getting very wealthy.... KKR, the private equity fund that owns Travelopia. I am very shocked the way private equity funds hover like vultures over the education sector.

My old school and had a direct link with a school in uganada and has done for a good 30 years, 6th formers go over every other year and have to raise the money. It is all done independantly of any businesses and some years it may just be decorating and other years the school may need something bigger doing although the students wouldnt be doing the skilled stuff, more just being extra hands to support the skilled locals. Was really good because they have a long term relationship and its a long term ongoing project. Was £3k for 3 weeks

That is cruel. There should be a fund for poorer children to be able to go. And five grand is obscene. My DS is at a school where there are lots of very wealthy families and their trip is 10 days at NASA. And it is much cheaper than five grand. Incidentally, most of his year are not going. The parents can afford it, but don’t want to pay the money.

No, there shouldn’t be a fund for poorer children to go. No child should be going on a trip of that nature/cost.

t is all done independantly of any businesses and some years it may just be decorating and other years the school may need something bigger doing although the students wouldnt be doing the skilled stuff, more just being extra hands to support the skilled locals.. Would be far better though to pay local extra hands if bigger projects need doing that could be a decent couple of weeks jobs for local labourers. I’m not saying the kids shouldn’t go out, yes they should they have long term links with the school and that’s great, go exchange ideas, go and sit in their lessons for a week and plan a group lesson about life in the uk to give etc instead of doing building projects. A tiny portion of that 3k would pay local labourers and would do far better good for the local economy.

I did raise ALL the money myself by hosting parties at our local village hall.

So you didn't raise the money - local villagers chipped in to pay for you to have a holiday. People feel so much pressure to donate to things like this which is fine if a child happens to be part of a community where there is a level of disposable income. But if they are not you are either asking people to give money that could have been used in the electricity meter or for bus fares to work.

Maisy Yes your Globe/Shakespeare trip sounds very educational and beneficial - which is actually why it is so wrong. If a topic is on the curriculum and will form part of an overall assessment there should NEVER be a situation where the school is basically offering more and better opportunities for learning to pupils who can afford it. For curriculum lead learning opportunities it should always be everyone (paid for by school) or no one.

I've just been re-reading Amy's letter on that dreadful Akenkan site, and noticed that among all the other poppycock she mentioned the "unbreakable bonds" forged with Gambian children

What "unbreakable bonds"? Given that nearly all of it is "me me me", is it really likely she'd have the tenacity to maintain these? Frankly, if Akenkan want to attract interest with "my experience" stories, I'd have thought they'd get someone with better insight to write one

Unbreakable bonds hahahaa! Nope Amy the Gambian children do not remember you, you are not that important. Ffs.

in the adult world you 'raise money' for holidays by going to work. Never too early for that lesson!

I'm certain that the fundraising aspect is all part of the marketing for these companies.
a) they (correctly) think that most parents can't/won't pay for the whole thing themselves
b) it makes the charitable aspect appear more authentic, because it is normal to fundraise for charities. Not usually socially acceptable to for middle class kids to beg for money go on a long haul holiday for 3 weeks.

I have (slightly) more respect for the parents I know who just paid the whole lot for their child up front. At least there was no pretence that it was a good cause and it didn't take more charity-money from the local area. I'm genuinely surprised that more people can't see through it though. A close friend was really quite shocked that I refused to buy raffle tickets that were being sold door to door (by the parent of the child supposed to be fundraising ). Loads of local companies had given prizes - essentially to fund a holiday for a girl living in a £1 million house

Call me stingy but I absolutely refuse to contribute funds for a middle class person's exotic holiday. The World Challenge lot at my school (all rich and in million pound houses) did bag packing and cake sales - no thanks. I mean, it's not really WORKING is it - it's begging other people for money they weren't otherwise going to spend!

I'll happily give money to actual causes - you know, actual charities, hospices, animal sanctuaries, local youth or disability charities. But not to fund Tarquin and Petronella's flights to Borneo...

The other week I saw some girls from a leading independent school, which charges £12k per annum fees, "raising money" by bag packing in Sainsbury's for a netball tour to China. I didn't feel particularly compelled to throw a quid in a bucket for that one, and was gobsmacked that anyone would TBH.