Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Is food poverty real?

999 replies

Leapfrog44 · 18/09/2018 20:00

Provocative title, sorry I know food poverty is real. I'm just not convinced about the extent of it.

I've cooked half a packet of dried chickpeas 50p which we eat fried with garlic, salt and olive oil. They're also delicious with pasta or with potatoes as a curry. Braised Puy lentils (60p) cooked with onions, celery and the bendy carrots left in the fridge.

And to really push the boat out an aubergine stew with onions and tomatoes. The 3 big aubergines cost £1.50. Tomatoes and parsley came from the garden.

I spent an hour cooking today including making a loaf of bread. With some rice or couscous, and some salad, what I've made will feed us for 4 nights.

We have apples too, foraged at the weekend. The windfall ones I cut the bad off and stewed them, the rest are good for eating. There are also elderberries, plums and a few late blackberries dotted around the margins of the city for anyone who can be bothered to go out and pick them.

I know not everyone has a garden but a very small space can be used to grow quite a lot. In pots I grew enough tomatoes, green beans and lettuce to feed us all summer. If I was less lazy or more skint, I'd also seed save, to ensure I can grow them for free next year. Many allotment holders would totally give up some produce in exchange for labour too.

So I guess I'm wondering if the increasing number of people who are in financial dire staits and find themselves needing to use food banks are in fact suffering from a lack of food education as much as lack of money? Our grandparents in the same situation would have cultivated every bit of earth with home grown vegetables and I'm sure would have been more resourceful and more capable of making do on very little.

Obviously there are very vulnerable people without the means to cook or to grow but surely not everyone experiencing 'food poverty' is in this category? I often wonder why at food banks they don't ask if recipients have access to a bit of ground (or a few pots) and give them seeds? Pulses and in season veggies are incredibly cheap and with a few quid you can feed your family really well if you know how to cook them. It's far better to cook a simple vegetable curry or dhal and eat it all week than have to exist on the pot noodles, tinned sludge, sugary cereals and biscuits that they're giving out.

Times are going to get MUCH tougher. Climate change and environmental destruction will soon jeopardise our food security and food banks will not be able to help everyone.

So AIBU? As a society are we actually getting poorer and hungrier or have we just raised a couple of generations lacking general resourcefulness, cooking skills and horticultural know how? Times are tough for increasing numbers but I can't help feeling that many of these people just don't have a clue how to help themselves.

OP posts:
CognitiveDissonance · 18/09/2018 22:29

Those countries all have wonderful food cultures which are based on pretty cheap ingredients that are cooked well.

Does it not occur to you that it might have something to do with the fact the the ingredients used to flavour and create those meals are grown locally and therefore far more cheaper to acquire?

Leighhalfpennysthigh · 18/09/2018 22:30

This UK poverty fashion really puzzles me.

There is a group of people for whom poverty is a fashion, but it is not the people who suffer from poverty. When people are starving, scared, worried about making it through to the end of the month and feed their kids, pay their bills, heat their house and get to work don't tell them not to worry because it isn't as bad as some other countries. People die through poverty in this country. Here. Now. In 2018. As citizens of this country that should make us angry. Only when you have enough money to manage your own life do you have the luxury to care about other countries. Sorry.

I haven't experienced poverty. I've had times when I've been more financially stretched than others, but those times have been brief and I knew that if I needed to I could have gone to my parents for help. Like George Orwell could have in Down and Out in Paris and London; and like the people for whom poverty (or more accurately, frugality) is a life choice.

One family I know do seem to live on lentils and chickpeas. They are perfectly happy and it's their choice. The man has a good job in the NHS and the woman is a SAHM. The kids are all in school all day and she spends several hours a day prepping for the evening meal. All from scratch. Often foraged. Home baked cakes and bread etc. She grows a lot of their food and has an allotment as well as a large garden. They have a negligible mortgage and live close to his work so he can walk to work. They are close to a lovely village with lots of artisan shops that seem to sell different varieties of veg and pulses. She can walk to the shops. The childrens' school is a short walk. They can therefore use their (new and very economical, no tax) car for going out at weekends where they do forage, but also take the children for adventures in woods, beaches, National Trust properties etc. They also go to the theatre a lot and have a "hobby" of making their own gin. The children go on lots of school trips and they have at least one holiday as a family a year, and at least one holiday as a couple. The man can also afford hideously expensive private physio for his cruciate ligament problem that he got playing cricket.
Strangely the nice life, no money worries, ability to buy treats, time to cook from scratch everyday, hobbies and trips seem to make up for the lentil based diet.

Bimgy85 · 18/09/2018 22:30

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER ME:
Can you give me an excuse as to why someone can't work/better their career to at least make life affordable for them? And if they cannot work, why not? If there's no disability or mental illness why aren't you working/ trying to make a better life? Like we all have to? Or were they just brought up thinking it's ok to just get money from the government and live day to day?

I don't feel sorry for somebody that claims to be living in poverty however doesn't seem to do anything to try better their life themselves if they're fully capable

Benjaminbuttonschild · 18/09/2018 22:30

This thread is disingenuous and frankly it is fucking insulting.

Away with you OP, you're a goady and YABVVVVVVVVU!!!

HTH Angry

SlothSlothSloth · 18/09/2018 22:31

OP you sound awful. Just awful. Insufferably smug and just absolutely ignorant beyond belief. Totally lacking in common sense and empathy. I’m so grateful I don’t have to know you in real life.

All these people telling you you’re wrong and you still won’t shift.

notwhitedee · 18/09/2018 22:32

I'm not working as for a personal reason it is not a choice atm. Hopefully I will be able to in a few months I have worked my whole life I have been to uni I have only been out of work this past year. Do not tar everyone as not being able to improve there situation when you know nothing how dare you.

CognitiveDissonance · 18/09/2018 22:34
  • CAN SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER ME: Can you give me an excuse as to why someone can't work/better their career to at least make life affordable for them? And if they cannot work, why not? If there's no disability or mental illness why aren't you working/ trying to make a better life? Like we all have to? Or were they just brought up thinking it's ok to just get money from the government and live day to day?

I don't feel sorry for somebody that claims to be living in poverty however doesn't seem to do anything to try better their life themselves if they're fully capable*

Then don't feel sorry for people. Nobody is forcing you to. You might find the comments section of the daily fail online closer to your intellect for discussion than here.

Bimgy85 · 18/09/2018 22:34

I do agree though we don't know true poverty. Someone in real poverty would not be on this website. There are some shocking cases out there beyond our imagination. So let's not insult them by claiming to be on the same level or understand their situation because we've struggled to do the food shop quite a few times.

Borisdaspide · 18/09/2018 22:34

Hiphopfrog: how do you make a decent curry without any spices? I'd love to know.

Bimgy85: a thousand fucking reasons, as people have outlined in this thread.

user1473878824 · 18/09/2018 22:34

I am a massive one for growing your own and cooking and blah blah but for fuck’s sake. Also if you cooked a loaf of edible bread from scratch in an hour you clearly must be able the feed the five thousand. You know what also costs 60p? A two week’s worth of frozen chicken nuggets. If you can afford a freezer. I am no where near struggling and don’t have to worry about this stuff but just fucking hell

BertrandRussell · 18/09/2018 22:35

I disagree with Jack Munroe on many things, but fuck me she's sound on this stuff. OP- have you heard of the poverty premium?

Boodapoo · 18/09/2018 22:36

YANBU. Most poor people here have no idea what poverty is. It's insulting. Live in a third world country where the government doesn't give you any penny at all, where you have to live under the bridge when you're a little girl and have men prey after you, and you eat whatever you can scrape in the bin, that's real poverty.

Bimgy85 · 18/09/2018 22:36

Ok but then most of them have no one to blame but themselves? If it's a case of being fit to work and choosing not to Hmm if someone spends their lives on benefits out of their own choice I would Expect them to be living in poverty... benefits are suppose to help you... not earn you a living

5Yearplan4000 · 18/09/2018 22:36

Op you will get flamed and your intentions are probably good. Food poverty is often as a result of other types of poverty , poverty of education, fincancial choices or mistakes, and disorganisation. People access food banks or are in food poverty as they have got themselves into debt sometimes recklessly, sometimes through no fault of their own. Some people aren’t educated enough to make the choices you do. Or they are disorganised. Few people neeed to be in food poverty in the uk but our society is set up in such a way that it happens. People usually have no money for food as they have got themselves into debt in some way.

CognitiveDissonance · 18/09/2018 22:37

I do agree though we don't know true poverty. Someone in real poverty would not be on this website. There are some shocking cases out there beyond our imagination. So let's not insult them by claiming to be on the same level or understand their situation because we've struggled to do the food shop quite a few times.

I would remove we from that first sentence. You don't speak for me or anyone else for that matter. You can say you don't know what true poverty is. You have no idea what anyone else here has been through and you are clearly unwilling to try to understand.

Boodapoo · 18/09/2018 22:37

Then don't feel sorry for people. Nobody is forcing you to. You might find the comments section of the daily fail online closer to your intellect for discussion than here.

You don't speak for me.

Leapfrog44 · 18/09/2018 22:37

@notwhitedee of course you can't grow food in a tower block. There are a few community gardens around my city and a community orchard which have been created on unused space. But there is definitely tons of wasteland around that could be turned into productive growing space with some volunteer help. The council could free up some allotments. I know there are massive queues for them in some places but not all. I think that community kitchens providing cheap cooked meals that people could take away, cooking lessons for people that want them and community gardens where you can come and help out if you have time would be a more sustainable way to help people with food poverty than handing out baked beans to everyone.

Food poverty is going to get worse, we need to be doing more to equip people than just giving out low quality, sugar loaded food.

OP posts:
CognitiveDissonance · 18/09/2018 22:37

You don't speak for me.*

At what point did I say I did?

longwayoff · 18/09/2018 22:38

OP you should be ashamed to own the level of ignorance you have happily displayed here. I'm sick and tired of people with this opinion. Do you believe food banks have needlessly materialised over recent years simply to give the virtuous middle classes something to do with their spare time and money? Do you think some people are lucky to be able to work a full week, pay their rent and bills and then be unable to afford food? I hope you never find your self in the position of thousands of people in this country today.

Bimgy85 · 18/09/2018 22:38

@Boodapoo exactly. My boss was an asylum seeker and used to tell me the stories of growing up in Afghanistan where they would never have enough to eat. And how they used to make a huge meal last a week for the family. That's poverty. Like everything we are a spoiled nation and the minute we don't get what we are used to or fail to provide something we start to pity ourselves.

Myself included. I wish I was not brought up in this nation as we all sound like spoilt brats. 'Poverty' we don't know it!

Boodapoo · 18/09/2018 22:40

CognitiveDissonance

Maybe you're thick but I'll spell it out for you. I agree with the OP, and I am a MNer whether you like it or not. I am not a Daily Mail reader.

glintandglide · 18/09/2018 22:40

I agree OP and bimgy85 should be utterly ashamed of themselves. What an utter lack of empathy, understanding and political intelligence you are showing.

Borisdaspide · 18/09/2018 22:40

Ah right, your asylum seeker boss wins top trumps, so no one else ever suffers. He sounds fucking riveting.

Benjaminbuttonschild · 18/09/2018 22:40

@Bimgy85 you're making ridiculous assumptions that people actively choose to live in poverty.

Even with a degree, many jobs are low wage at least where I live. It's not easy to a) retrain or go for higher education when you have a family to support. It is not cheap and costs in time and effort which a lot of people don't have the luxury of. It's not easy to b) find work that pays a 'Living wage' especially if your education status is limited. So mostly you end up taking low wage/zero hours/long anti-social hours to get by. It is not easy to c) uproot your family and your whole life to get to where you need/want to be. Especially if you rely on family help for things like childcare.

Christ alive @Bimgy85 anyone would think you are deliberately blaming people for not getting better jobs!!! Haven't you realised from your ivory tower that wages haven't kept up with the cost of living I.e. food, gas prices, electric prices, water rates, council tax rates, petrol hikes etc.

Not to mention cuts to services left right and centre. Austerity, austerity, austerity! We have NHS nurses who rely on using food banks in the day and age ffs! It sounds almost Dickensian when you think about it.

Wages do not keep up with inflation and cost of living, and in case you hadn't noticed we are still living in the aftermath of a global recession! Employers are closing down/ downsizing and making people redundant.

I'm fairly certain you didn't need some random on the internet to explain life in modern Britain to you!!

Jog on with you!

Borisdaspide · 18/09/2018 22:41

we need to be doing more to equip people than just giving out low quality, sugar loaded food.

Let them eat spice racks

Swipe left for the next trending thread