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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To delay paying childminder

301 replies

Harmonyrays · 12/09/2018 05:47

On day two of my ds being with his new childminder I receive an invoice for the entire month. Is this normal? I'd expected to get it at the end of the month. I've only just gone back to work and don't get paid until then.

AIBU to delay paying until the 30th?

OP posts:
Original poster
Harmonyrays · 13/09/2018 04:07

Wow I was not expecting such a response! Interesting points though. It seems lots of differences in how CM's work.

So to be clear I have no intention of not paying at all. I just found it odd to receive the whole month so early. I provide all food, nappies, wipes, milk etc. Trips out are funded by cm.

The contract doesn't stipulate one month adance but I can see why some would do this especially if they have been burned in the past. I'm going to pay weekly for two and it will coincide with my pay date and become monthly.

OP posts:
AjasLipstick · 13/09/2018 04:12

zsaz I think you will find that they do all the time. ALL the time. And customers are happy to pay when they can actually afford the service.

It's when you get people who can't really afford the services they think they need that the trouble begins.

AjasLipstick · 13/09/2018 04:14

Harmony The fact that you provide nappies etc isn't relevant. The CM has to live. She has expenses of her own and your payment is her wage.

She can't pay her rent or council tax with nappies and wipes.

MyOtherProfile · 13/09/2018 06:06

I provide all food, nappies, wipes, milk etc
Again this is totally normal. If a cm paid for all this they wouldn't have much left out of their earnings.

LaurieMarlow · 13/09/2018 06:18

I think it’s a bit rich to call me an asshole because I think cm should follow the same rules as everyone else.

As has been pointed out over and over again, lots of services get paid in advance. Or is all the reading a bit beyond you dearie?

Calling someone 'grabby' for wanting to be paid on mutually agreed terms is a shitty thing to do. Are people not entitled to make a living? Hmm

Just to be clear, I'm not a childminder either.

MyOtherProfile · 13/09/2018 06:21

Interestingly I have just been googling sample cm contracts. Most say payment is due in advance and a couple gave the option of advance or arrears with the irrelevant one to be crossed out.

QueenOfCatan · 13/09/2018 06:54

I'd rather be "grabby" than be thousands out of pocket and turn down clients for people who just disappear because parents can be dicks.
I've even switched to advance payments for my nanny and babysitting work as well now because over August I lost over £1k from people cancelling last minute or just disappearing off the face of the earth (for both nanny and cm work) despite turning down other bookings for them. So from the beginning of October it'll be all payments due by Friday the week before, just like my childminding.

SoupDragon · 13/09/2018 07:57

which Wouldn’t be permitted in other industries

What do you think happens when you book a holiday?

zsazsajuju · 13/09/2018 07:58

Cm are offering the same terms (ie payment in advance) so no real competition in the market. It’s a cartel!

It’s pretty grabby to expect to be paid in advance when everyone else is paid in arears. Especially a month in advance. Many small businesses have to deal with clients who don’t pay- again cm not special.

Better more flexible childcare would hugely benefit working women.

As for all the nasty posts claiming they’re not cm, yeah right! Why are you not campaigning for all services to be paid a month in advance. Oh and goods too. Why should poor Tesco wait until you need the groceries! No you should pay them a month in advance.

MyOtherProfile · 13/09/2018 08:01

expect to be paid in advance when everyone else is paid in arears
I think we have established now that not everyone is paid in arrears. Lots of normal examples on this thread.

And I'm not sure cartel means what you think it does.

SoupDragon · 13/09/2018 08:04

I’ve checked a handful of nurseries at random (googling “day nurseries”) and they all require fees in advance.

SoupDragon · 13/09/2018 08:05

when everyone else is paid in arears

You don’t listen do you. You are wrong.

SoyDora · 13/09/2018 08:06

zsazsajuju as I said above I pay for many things in advance. Swimming lessons, gymnastics classes, pre school (a term in advance), dance lessons. DH works for a bank and is paid 2 weeks in arrears, 2 in advance. I pay for holidays in advance, I pay for goods online before they’re shipped to me.
It is normal.

Ellapaella · 13/09/2018 08:08

I've always paid my childminder in advance, I also pay my dog walker and piano teacher in advance. I think it's fairly common practice, they also have bills to pay!

SoyDora · 13/09/2018 08:15

In fact swimming lessons are paid 12 weeks in advance!

BigChocFrenzy · 13/09/2018 08:16

Tesco can (try to) make sure you don't leave the store without paying
A cm can't hold onto your child on the last day of the month until you pay up

Similarly services like airlines etc require payment in advance, or too many people would stiff them
(and airlines generally have more information, e.g. passport numbers, to help track down their customers)

A business that can't hold onto the goods or services you bought, or take them back, is likely to want payment in advance - or go bust, especially small ones without a legal dept

A cartel is when businesses come together to control prices
It is NOT when they all take similar precautions to avoid being stiffed by their customers.

btw, I'm a scientist, not a cm

BigChocFrenzy · 13/09/2018 08:19

If you'd posted that it is really tough returning to work when you are skint and having to pay childcare in advance,
then nearly everyone would agree & sympathise

However, blaming cms for the problem isn't fair

SoyDora · 13/09/2018 08:19

Oh and I’m not a CM. No way I would put myself through the hell that is other people’s children plus the stress of making sure I’m paid on time in order to pay my own bills for such paltry remuneration!

AssignedNorthernAtBirth · 13/09/2018 08:32

I pay my nursery in arears. Most services are paid in arears (electricity, gas, professional services like legal and accounting services).

It has already been explained to you that legal services are frequently paid for upfront. Nobody ever gets to talk to me until they've paid, and we do everything by fixed fee now.

Dobbythesockelf · 13/09/2018 08:44

I love it when people ignore the facts that don't fit their narrative. Glad you've sorted something out OP.

zsazsajuju · 13/09/2018 08:47

Assigned- that’s very rare in the legal industry. But thanks for “already explaining that to me”.

Exception proves the rule. Most things paid in arears as I said. Finding one or two exceptions doesn’t help the argument. No one is disagreeing that some things are paid in advance but the vast majority of services and goods are paid in arears. There’s no reason cm are exceptional and should be paid in advance unlike the vast majority of small businesses.

zsazsajuju · 13/09/2018 08:49

Big choc - a cartel is when a group get together to agree uncompetitive behaviour e.g. agreeing a term for advance payment. It’s not restricted to prices (although in my area cm also collide on prices).

bruffin · 13/09/2018 08:51

zszsajuju
exactly, especially as CM has very little investment, their running costs are their normal running costs of their home. Apart from may be food ( I used to supply my ds food) there are little additional costs.

zsazsajuju · 13/09/2018 08:54

Also big choc - re the Tesco analogy, a cm can’t stop you leaving with your child no. Neither though could a plumber come and rip out work he had done because you didn’t pay him. That would be a crime. Yet I have never paid trades people in advance.

Cm can refuse to look after your child after you’ve paid them in advance and you couldn’t force them or do anything other than taking them to small claims to get the fees back. That’s the nature of the service.

I don’t see any reason in principle it should be paid for a month in advance.

AssignedNorthernAtBirth · 13/09/2018 09:03

No zsazsa it's not very rare or an exception. It's extremely common.

The legal field is very much a mixture of payment upfront, particularly in fixed fee form, and hourly rates which are sometimes in arrears though not always. When I did hourly rates, the client would generally be expected to put us in funds first. Reduces the risk of not being paid.

Thus, lawyers are not an example that helps your argument here.