To not appreciate Serena using sexism in her arguments against umpire

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Sorry if there is a thread, I did scan four pages to check.

Serena gets coached (which her coach admits) but claims she didn't see it. Then smashes a racquet in separate fit of temper. Then tells the umpire she can't be a cheat because she's a mother(!), he will never referee a match again with her, and he's a thief.

The punishments all seem fine to me and I really felt for Osaka having to apologise in her winners speech. Serena should be saying sorry today IMO.

I thought her behaviour was totally disgusting. She lost control. I have no doubt that the sexism is a minor issue in that a man may not have been given the violation, but that is not the point.
How she handled herself, ie incredibly badly, is the point.

It's really a shame Osaka felt like she had to apologize for her win. And that the attention is now completely on Serena even though Osaka played way better.

"she's never coped with losing as gracefully as, say, Roger Federer has."

Have you ever seen Roger in defeat?! He is one of the most ungratious losers out there!

Its all OK ladies - Andrew Castle and Greg Ruszedski have both piped up to tell us their isn't a problem with racism and sexism in tennis and the fact that John McEnroe was penalised 30 yrs ago proves it.

So that's nice, the white dudes have mansplained, we can all go back to our knitting.

A female tennis player was interviewed on Radio 5 this morning (name escapes me) and she said she thought Serena was out of order, that she'd had a look at the umpire's history and she saw no reason for the suggestion of sexism or anything else.

she'd had a look at the umpire's history and she saw no reason for the suggestion of sexism or anything else.

Have a look at the twitter link I posted earlier.

The fact is that women players and especially black women in sport are penalised for being hysterical and aggressive on a routine basis for behaviours which are excused in men. This isn't unique to tennis either.

Serena did have a meltdown and behaved badly but I look at it in the context of having spent 20 yrs not only having to beat your opponent but to beat the system as well.

*The baby is very relevant though because she desperately wants to resume her career but it may well be over

Because she had a baby

How can that not be out and out sexism?*

She made a decision to have a child and I assume that she considered how this would impact her career as a tennis player. Things change when you have a baby and that’s a fact of life not sexism.

She has more money and support than most people could ever dream of so I really don’t sympathise with the ‘it’s so difficult being a mom and having a career’ rhetoric. It’s actually insulting to those who really struggle with this. Her life is absolutely nothing like the lives of most ordinary working women who actually have real problems with juggling jobs and children in difficult circumstances and with very little money or support.

*C8H I saw that person's Twitter thread. I merely point out what a fellow female tennis player said, based on the fact that the argument is about sexism

www.thecut.com/2018/09/serena-williams-us-open-referee-sexism.html

This article describes the background rather better than I can.

The baby is very relevant though because she desperately wants to resume her career but it may well be over.

Because she had a baby

How can that not be out and out sexism?

Because, I dunno, her body is the tool upon which her career depends? A tool that she chose to use for another purpose, having had enormous success up to this point?

It's kind of like telling a footballer or a gymnast off for ageing. You lose flexibility, agility and stamina as you get older and become worse at playing. When you go into sport you know that your time is finite.

I mean, what do you want, a penalty for the non-mothers competing? Roger Federer has two sets of twins, and though he didn't birth them himself, he's more occupied than Andy Murray, who has (two?). If they're playing each other does Roger get a point to start?

Her coach has confirmed he WAS coaching her so who’s the liar now?

the white dudes

Riiiiight. You feel entitled to write this, do you?

C8H10N4O2 That article is absolute rubbish and has been debunked by many other commentators and players especially "women players and especially black women in sport are penalised for being hysterical and aggressive on a routine basis for behaviours which are excused in men. " Which is absolute rubbish. Just absolute complete rubbish. If it isn't the gender card used, it is the race card. I knew that one would be wheeled out. In fact, Serena has gotten away with a lot that men wouldn't get away with, and other women of lesser ranking wouldn't get away with. Time for some home truths I think instead of this lying and making excuses for her. She has been like teflon for so long. It is more than way overdue for her to be called out for behaviour she has gotten away with in the past due to her race and her gender. Time for Teflon Bully to be called out.

Having just popped back to this thread..it is the ‘white dudes’ rhetoric that’s binned it for me! It’s like some bad smell...seeps in everywhere. Otherwise, there were some sensible interesting points.

Good for her. Why can't she make a point about sexism? She did not say she can't be a cheat because she's a mother. I'm not surprised that her words have been twisted.

Some of the comments on this thread are just the usual crap. Strong, deranged, lost the plot etc. I thought I'd read she's too "uppity" next.

She is one of the greatest consistent athletes out there but because she's a black woman she's blatantly derided. I guess now it'll be she has "attitude". Yet when male players lose their temper they don't have their every word dissected nor are they criticised in the way Serena has been. & that's without experiencing the racist and prejudiced commentary that she has for years.

There's a Jeremy Vine programme on now, next discussion coming up is about Serena's "bad behaviour"". I've turned over, can't be asked to listen to people sticking the boot in

She is one of the reasons I've not much time for feminism. The "Sisterhood" ceases abruptly when it's a black woman who dares to give her view on sexism, they'll attack as quickly as a sexist man would. Hypocrites.

May she continue to speak out and achieve in the face of ongoing prejudice. She is a true great

I am not aware that cheating and yelling abuse are known after effects of parenthood.

Firstly, I can't believe that on a mainly women's site, the word 'hysterical' has been used several times. It's inherently sexist to describe an angry or upset woman as hysterical. This isn't the 1800s

Secondly which one of you here is black, a woman and playing top end sport in a white man's world?
No didn't think so.
The disdain for her radiates from the page and it's not just because she occasionally loses her shit (which in her world anyone of you would).

'sexism is a minor issue's

Can't believe I just read that

She is not a pleasant human being. That is what her pathetic behaviour tells me and the vast majority of those who saw it, by whatever means.

She is the thief. She robbed her worthy opponent of her joy. Nasty.

Yet when male players lose their temper they don't have their every word dissected nor are they criticised in the way

Not sure I'd totally agree with that as certain male players to get a lot of criticism for their behaviour - Krygios being the most obvious example right now. But mostly on the sports reports rather than headline news. I do think that the difference here is that Serena is world number one and probably the best female tennis player there has ever been. If Federer had made an identical outburst in the male final of a grand slam, I think that would have got the same media coverage.

That's not to say there isn't sexism in the game and that some element of umpiring is always going to be a personal call, as of course there is.

However, they do now need to do something about coaches being present if we get the point where a player gets accused of cheating, they deny it, but the coach says "actually I was, even if she wasn't noticing" - the players have to accept they are going to be punished by extension.

Totally agree cat and DeeCee. She's a stupendous athlete and that would be applauded in a man, instead she is derided.

The Womens Tennis Association supports her and says yes it is double standards. And this is from the President of the US Tennis Association, Katrina Adams...

"Adams also claimed there are double standards in terms of how umpires treat women and men. Adams said: “We watch the guys do this all the time, they’re badgering the umpire on the changeovers. Nothing happens. There’s no equality. I think there has to be some consistency across the board. These are conversations that will be imposed in the next weeks."

She is not a pleasant human being

Do you know her personally?

I do worry that she is experiencing ptsd as a result of nearly dying during what apparently was a very traumatic birth and first days of parenthood. When you’re constantly living in fight or flight mode in normal day to day life then add in the adrenaline of playing sport it’s unsurprising she’s gone into fight mode. It took the pressure or PT sessions to finally push me too far with my ptsd that I’d lived with for years (also very easily antagonised and argumentative). She prob needs to have a good break from sport to concentrate on healing the trouble is she is surrounded by people advising no her who have a vested interest in her continuance in professional sports. She’s prob loving her life in constant panic mode

I find bad losers pathetic. As do most regardless of race, sex or sporting ability.