To ask what happens if you can't afford to do jury service?

[AvocadosBeforeMortgages]

Let me start off by saying that I always thought I'd like to do jury service one day.

Now I've discovered that not only do my employers not pay you when you're on jury service, the rates courts pay you for loss of earnings are paltry - the sum I'd get for the first 10 days would be less than half what I'd actually lose, and rates from day 11 are still less than my wages so I couldn't actually afford to do it www.gov.uk/jury-service/what-you-can-claim

Can you refuse to do jury service on the grounds that you can't afford the loss of earnings? I'm single and have rent to pay, for context.

pitapizzapie

Yes, I can take PLANNED holiday. Months in advance with all clients being made aware of it. And I only take 5 days.

No if I got proper sick I couldn’t work and I would have to close my practise down. Fine to get a cold and rearrange people for a few days time.

But the nature of trials is that they could last months and you get very little notice. If I was called and not excused then it would be disastrous.

There is no insurance for psychotherapists (or sole traders where YOU are the business) for this. I know, I checked.

Also remember the nature of my work is that I work with people who are vulnerable, who I can’t just leave for 2 weeks (or 18 months like the fraud trial mentioned above)

For those saying you have to just use childcare.... No.
I work 3 days a week and can't afford childcare for 3 little ones. Also, i don't believe my children should go to nursery or a childminder, it doesn't fit with beliefs, so I would absolutely not do it. It would have to wait till they started school.

@BarbaraofSevillle

Thanks!

laurie I’m in exactly the same boat as you. I have to plan my holidays 6-12 months in advance, I work extra days before and after holidays to fit everybody in, luckily I’m rarely ill, I even worked through a miscarriage where I was bleeding heavily enough to have to be admitted to hospital (luckily over a bank holiday weekend).
I’ve just returned to work after a 13 week maternity leave and my business is struggling because I haven’t been able to work.
A lengthy jury service would probably be the final nail in the coffin.
Some people simply don’t get what it is to run a business alone.

PolkerrisBeach your maths is appalling! Really????a £23000 a year earner gets paid £65 a day??? 😂😂😂😂😂

@PolkerrisBeach your maths is appalling! Really????a £23000 a year earner gets paid £65 a day??? 😂😂😂😂😂

Its probably about £20k a year after tax and NI has been taken into account, maybe someone will come on and do the proper maths. gross pay wise its just under £17k, whatever way you look at it it is probably someone who gets paid about £10ph. So not a lot.

It’s worth reading up on disqualifications as well for example if you were blind you wouldn’t be able to serve due to not being able to see visual evidence. If you were deaf you couldn’t serve due to no one else being allowed in the jury room ect there are a few rules around not being able to do it at all here’s a SS of the official disqualifications.

Also for those of you saying work
Would have a problem they understand that and have a deferral system in place where they work with you to get dates you can do! Also they summone 15 people and only 12 sit on the jury so you may do jury duty and not actually sit in on the trial! If you’re really worried about pay you could defer and put in holiday for the deferral dates.

Years ago i was asked to do it didn't have to citing young children.However April 2017 husband was asked his dad was in a hospice so emailed to defer a year to the day April 2018 he had to do it.The money is crud 30p a mile £5 food allowance he was lucky his firm paid him a weekly wage but im sure thats not the norm.Then you might get a judge that wants a complete 12 innocent or guilty verdict leading to more time at court arguing the toss.Most of his fellow jurors were at least 60 years old too.

I did Jury Service last year and it was a great experience, my employer continued to pay me and deducted the court expenses so I was no worse off. I claimed for my travel expenses (petrol) and the car park was free, we were able to claim for daily subsistence ( approx £5 per day for coffees/lunch).

Fair enough, but then we should bring in conscription for the police, army, school teachers, and other areas of life where a diversity of opinions and types of people would be beneficial.

Because that’s exactly the same as doing a couple of weeks Jury Service?

Because that’s exactly the same as doing a couple of weeks Jury Service?

If anything, surely it's even more important to enforce diversity in things like the police and education than in the judicial service since it's a full-time job and they can't pick and choose from volunteers.

On the whole the current system works quite well. Those peopole whose lives means they simply cannot do it tend to be excused.

Threads like this do illustrate how some of those in work don't understand what being self employed is like however. I agree with the self employed above. I find it very hard to take a week off a year and even then I reply to work emails every few hours on holiday and do an hour's work a day at least. If I were called the sums are so very much lower than my business expenses and costs and life expenses it would be a massive financial loss even for 2 weeks and I would probably have to get home at 7pm erach night after seving and do about 6 hours of work into the early hours, not get enough sleep and do that every evening whilst I was serving just to ensure my business is not destroyed whilst I was gone from it (and no I haven't had even 2 whole weeks off together for years).

I've just worked out that it's only very slightly less than my salary. I'm sure my employers would have no problem with me being away from the office for a couple of weeks but I don't know what they'd do after that as I'm the only one here who does my job.

I would like to do it.

I used to work in the court service many years ago and I still see a lot of the names in the local press. If I was called up and the defendant was someone whose name I recognised through work I presume I would be excused from that particular case? There's no way I could be impartial!

Holidays are precious for most people. Why should they spend them doing jury service? If the system caught up with the 21st century and adequately reimbursed people for attending, then most people wouldn’t have a problem. So glad I’ll never have to worry about this.

If the system caught up with the 20th century the juries would be abolished (they only benefit the guilty imo). If I was innocent - then the last people I would want to decide my fate would be 12 people to stupid to get out of jury service!

Oops 21st century ! Sorry, in my defence, the old line about a jury is from the 20th century (and yes I know the rules have changed - though not by much!)

with a sensible cap e.g. £150 instead of £65/day, not £1k/day

What if the person earns £1000 a day though? .

Indeed. We had a few mumsnetters on a thread who earn that. Even though about half goes in tax that still leaves you out of pocket and perhaps not even being able to pay your massive mortgage.

I get your point dora and have often seen it said that the guilty choose to be tried by jury (Ken Dodd anyone?!) and the innocent by judge (where there’s a choice) but ultimately for the failings I do think juries are less prone to things like bribery/corruption than a judge only system would be

Indeed. We had a few mumsnetters on a thread who earn that. Even though about half goes in tax that still leaves you out of pocket and perhaps not even being able to pay your massive mortgage.

I find it hard to believe someone on £365k a year wouldn’t have sufficient savings or investments to tide them over for a few weeks

Baked Beans 47
The more you have the more it costs to keep. sometimes it takes a whole change in lifestyle to discover you can survive on very little

I appreciate that but someone on £365k a year is by virtue of that alone extremely wealthy.