AIBU to think that even if you are staying in a holiday home for free, you should still look after it a bit?

[TheKitchenWitch]

I've posted about this before, so really just need to rant a bit (this is going to be long, sorry), but FFS.

I own a small flat in a very popular holiday destination. I inherited it from my parents, who only let us and a couple of other people use it (apart from themselves). I've been more of the opinion that if I'm not using it (we go down once a year in summer) then it's a shame for it to be sitting empty, so I have offered it to a number of friends, plus a few friends of my parents who helped me out with various things after my parents passed away (so as a sort of thank-you as they'd never accept money from me).

Anyway, this is the 3rd year that I've let other people use it. I don't make any money from it whatsoever - i calculated what the utilities cost per week, and charge that, plus I have organised someone to come in and clean after each guest so that it's lovely for everyone who comes. Altogether I've asked for €30 per week, plus a €15 cleaning charge (it will all go up slightly next year as all the costs have gone up).
The friends who helped with my parents' stuff I don't charge anything at all, because as I said, it's my way of saying thank you.

So this year we went down last, as always, and I met with the cleaner/person who looks after it for me and she said that the cleaning costs were going to have to go up a bit because some of the guests were really messy. I could already tell though because there were stains on some of the furnishings (we've even had to buy a new rug as the old one was ruined), and things had been broken and not mentioned/replaced.

I realise that the more people use the place, the more wear and tear there'll be - of course there will, I'm not stupid. But if you spilt wine on a cushion, wouldn't you bung it in the washing machine? Or at least tell me so that I can instruct the cleaner to do it (she normally doesn't do washing, everyone brings their own bedding and towels). There's only 3 wine glasses left out of the 6 that I put in there last year. Again, of course they can break, and I only get cheap IKEA ones, but still, why not mention it so that at least I can bring down replacements?

The loo was broken too - my dh's niece went down before us and messaged me to say that it wouldn't stop running, but she and her boyfriend had managed to do some sort of provisional repair on it. DH fixed it when we went down, but it had been running and running. So a complete waste of water. And no-one mentioned it.

(Last year it was the air conditioning which I'd asked guests not use because it leaked and ruined our wall and the neighbour's. Someone ignored my request and used it anyway causing quite a bit of damage. We extra put in ceiling fans which are really good - we use only them and they are more than enough!).

It seems that just because it's essentially free, and belongs to a friend, some people think they don't have to look after it at all.

I'm annoyed because I'm not at all a precious sort of person - everyone is welcome with their kids and dogs too! But to ruin things and not even mention it seems really taking the piss.
Or maybe I'm being unreasonable? Do people want to go on holiday and just not give a shit about anything?

I think house rules are a great idea. My family has a home in a popular holiday spot, and so is often used by various relatives and their friends.
We have left a laminated sheet in the kitchen outlining exactly how the property should be left each time, with very clear instructions. In our case, there is no cleaner coming in, so it very important that everyone the place exactly how they found it. No one seems to have a problem with it once it's spelled out.

You wouldn't be "charging more" if you ask for a refundable deposit, unless you need to use it to cover damage costs, which is entirely reasonable.

Of course it's fine to put house rules in place.

People can be freeloading arses. We had quite a gap between buying our house and moving in so let people stay there rent-free rather than leaving it empty over winter. The house was fine when they left but the garden, which was beautiful when they moved in, was an overgrown wasteland when they left.
Given that this saved them about £10k in rent I don't think it would BU to expect them to pay someone to come in and keep the grass cut

I would either start charging a LOT more and let them know it is to cover the insurance because of previous issues with misuse and lack of communication, etc...
Or... simply say NO! and keep it for yourself from now on.

We have a mates rate for our holiday home but don’t market it. We only allow people we know and trust to use it. We do charge a lot more than your charges though. We have clear instructions and and a check list enitiled “On Departure”. People have varied in how much notice they have taken of our requests which basically amount to leaving the place as they found it. There are a few who will find the place “fully booked” if they ever ask to use it again! Others have left it immaculate. People vary. I think you’re very generous. Don’t let people abuse that.

Just stop letting people use it. I often think that the less people pay for something, the less they value it.

I have a holiday house and only a couple of people know I even own it. I just let people think I rent the same place every time I go. It's my place and no one has any rights to a cheap holiday at my expense.

I would suggest a mates rates deal rather than just covering costs. The mentailty will change then, of your guests.

If a lot of people are using the flat, then perhaps each group are only responsible for one minor mishap but they obviously all add up to lots of wear and tear. If I broke one wine glass, I don't know if I would report it.
If I made a mess of the cushion or rug though, I would definitely make every effort to thoroughly clean it. Maybe if accidents happen on the last day of the stay, there isn't time to do a machine wash. Or maybe children mess something up and don't tell their parents?
Running toilet- if it was like that when your guests arrived, they might just think that's how it is.
My sister was kind enough to lend us her holiday home this summer. We were so grateful and made a real effort to look after it. However, I can see that minor incidents of wear and tear can add up over the years.... but it's not one person responsible for them all. Add a little extra to your charge and then you won't feel so used.

@CSIblonde why should OP change her ways for a non profit making property? Surely the onus is on her guests to have respect for the property?

I use a friend's caravan annually. She does charge to cover costs but it's only £120 for a week. I clean it to within an inch of its life when leaving. And I buy cheap wine glasses and mugs to use when I'm there.

Some people will leave the place in a mess if they know a cleaner is coming in and might assume they'd deal with stains etc as well.

That's absolutely awful. I'd take extra care of it if I got it for free! I wouldn't want to continue to be friends with people who wouldn't own up tbh, it's fucking rude. Yes accidents happen but you tell the owners surely?

I just wouldn't let anyone use it,

Or - put it out for proper letting and charge money.

We are leaving a holiday cottage today (that we have paid for) and are going to be cleaning for an hour or so before we leave -

Let the CFs pay for somewhere.

That’s a complete abuse of your generosity and I’d either stop people going or charge them the going rate with proper T&C’s.

My IL’s have a second property in a very popular beach based, tourist destination in Southern mainland Europe and they very kindly allow us to go there for our Summer holiday every year. We pay them a day rate to cover utilities and ensure the beds are changed, all laundry washed & dried and that the place is spotless before we leave.

Anything that gets broken or damaged is replaced straight away.

Your guests are taking the piss, they really are!

OP my parents have a holiday home in a very popular part of the balearics but don't rent it out as they're there of the year and its their second home. If they did let it out it would be approx €1000 a week.

I've had two bad experiences of letting friends stay there free of charge so that's it now, no more favours. It's sad because I thought I was doing a nice thing but I've learnt people will take the piss no matter how good a friendship you thibk you have.

YANBU. I agree with the PP that suggested you have the cleaner email you after each person has stayed to explain what sort of a mess it was left in, maybe including photos. That way you can just stop inviting the people who make a mess. May seem harsh but they are absolutely taking the piss out of your generosity. Even the paying guests who are clearly getting a bargain.

If it were me I wouldn't bother anymore unless you were going to make some money to make the hassle worth it.

Apart from anything else, I don't know where you stand with tax if you are allowing people to stay but then 'charging' for cleaning, even if that is at cost. You don't want to be in a situation where you're unknowingly looking like you're evading tax because you're doing people a really nice favour. I would probably check if you haven't already.

But if you do continue I would be charging at least £50 per guest staying just to have a kitty to cover breakages / overall maintenance.

I would also ask for a refundable deposit and do the house rules.

But if it were me I'd not bother any more, it's a shame for people who have been good guests but it's your time and money you're wasting and I don't think people appreciate it enough. It's probably why your parents didn't allow anyone else to use it.

Apologies if it's been said already, but now you know why your parents restricted its use.

I would pay the cleaner a bit extra to do an inventory. You are doing a kind and generous thing. And people who have holiday homes and leave them empty most of the time are very selfish and damage the local economy.

Take a deposit specifying what it's for. People will be much more careful. If They dont like it they can stay at home.

Take a hefty deposit from them up-front. If people think they will lose money, they will be more careful. When you return the deposit, do not be over-generous. Yes, a few breakages are to be expected as part of wear-and-tear, but the person who got holiday accommodation for free and wasn't bothered when they broke a wine-glass won't worry about being careful next time, when they break a toilet.

What shits!!! This is upsetting on a few levels I imagine...

There’s several studies that show people do not value things that cost them little/nothing.

I would not be letting them stay but if you do....You should charge more £200 per week is still a bargain and I would pay the cleaner more to do a detailed report I’d also if you continue letting people use it send a standard “dos and donts” list

Id send all of them an email saying that due to some guests taking the piss, damages, breakages and general wear and tear and extra cleaning with dogs etc you are actually going to charge £X per week to cover everything from now on. Express your sadness at having to do this, but explain that some of your guests have really taken the piss - and give examples of the air con that has damaged neighbours wall, the stained cushions that need to be replaced, the broken glasses, the ruined rug - and this has meant you are out of pocket for being a good friend and offering the house effectively for free - not to mention the loss of goodwill from your neighbour.

The ones that are decent guests will be supportive. The ones that have taken the piss will know. EIther way, they still get a cut price holiday, and if they dont like it, they can go elsewhere.

Thanks for all your responses.
The deposit would only work if I had an inventory of everything and then got the cleaner to come in and check it properly before cleaning - and then I'd have to pay her more, because that would obviously take time (assessing "damage" etc).
I really do only let a few people use it - last year it was 6 families over the holidays, this year it was only 4, so it's not really seeing a huge turnover of guests.

But I think I am going to have to charge a bit more altogether, partly because actual costs have gone up (cleaner, utilities etc) but also to cover breakages and repairs. It's still a bargain though, and I really do enjoy sharing this wonderful place with friends and family.

So the plan is:

• write a list of general house rules and send them to everyone, stating that any problems or breakages should be reported to me asap
• get cleaner to either take photos or give me a quick report back on the state of the place after each guest; those that leave it really messed up (not just needing a clean) won't get to use it again
• increase the charges to include something towards general wear and tear

and then reassess again next year after summer.

I have a holiday house too, and similar problems.

I’ve done a great deal of thinking (probably over-analysing) and have come to the conclusion that some people just cannot completely hide their jealously. It over-rides their manners, their common sense, everything.

They fundamentally wish THEY had a holiday house, and subconsciously compute that somehow because I do, I am one-up on them and they feel ‘lorded over’. The more generous you are, the more patronised and ‘lesser than’ they feel and then next they turn a blind eye to the contraventions, breakages, extra expenses that they commit. They are either pretending they are rich & entitled, or paying me back because they assume I am.

It’s really horrible to think this of friends, but I can’t see any other explanation for how they act. It happens over and over, with many quite diverse personality types. There’s something more going on here than a bit of holiday domestic blindness.