9mo and waking throughout the night

[NomsQualityStreets]

Posting for traffic as I never get much on the Sleep topic.

Nearly 9mo DS is waking up pretty much every 2 hours on the dot to BF at night and I'm really tired.
He goes to bed at 7pm and is quite good at going down.
I BF him and then put him in his cot awake with his comfort blanket and dummy and read a book in the corner of the room. Only go to him if he starts crying and that's when I lay him back down if he's sat up and put his dummy back in with no picking up/cuddling/talking. Usually takes anything between 5-25mins.

He's then awake at 10pm for a feed and from then on usually wakes at 12am, 2am, and so on all to BF until he's up for the day around 7am. Last night he was up at 10pm, 12am, 2am, 3.20am, 5am, 6.15am and then slept until 8 but during all occasions wanted to BF and I'm tired and sore.

I know he can't be hungry so many times as he can happily go 4+ hours between feeds through the day if we're busy.

Does anyone have any advice on how I can get him to sleep longer and drop the feeds?
TIA

Excuse all the typos in my last posts. in a past life, I did a lot of work with families with sleep problems so I have some history. Although I do not advocate interventions before a year, this is a classic history of the children I actively worked with. Quite apart from the damage to your health from sleep deprivation I would suggest you do at least try some of the good suggestions on this thread, and please don't just take it as something normal that you put up with and it will sort itself. You will hear stories from other families that they just grew out of it. I can tell you tales of families very stressed with non-sleepers, 2 to 6 years. The older they get the harder it is to change. I would ask you to have one aim only, to reduce the night breast or any other feeding

@Yura

Sounds normal. Side Information: i used to work in infant research. Most people who say their children sleep through, are not exactly telling the truth. There is a lot of bragging, some overfeeding, some overheating (“they sleep through if they are really warm “ yes, but also at risk of SIDS), and a minority of children actually sleeps through (which is defined as more than 6 hours in one go). Take what you are told with a massive grain of salt

My 7 month old sleeps from 7:30pm-8am. At her worst she sleeps 7:30-6am.

Lazy I’d say you’re all really lucky then . And I’m sure I said I think it’s half by 12 months.

Lazy Just had another look at the studies and it’s only 16%who sleep through at 6 months, so I think you’re all very lucky indeed

Yura Obviously not everyone fibs, bends the truth or outright lies about their babies sleep but we’ve experienced this first hand. DMIL & DSIL used to brag constantly about DN sleeping through. Turns out she didn’t actually sleep through for several years. I BF and DSIL ff, DSIL & DMIL are both pro-ffing and didn’t want us to know that DN was waking and the formula wasn’t actually a magic formula.

if you talk to people and observe them, you realise that most people are actually convinced their kids sleep through the night. except they don't. there are always special circumstances why the don't sleep through a particular night, and they make up about 7 nights a week (wind, teething, exciting day, ...). it's peoples way to deal, the problem is the expectation it creates in others!

Mine was like this at 7 months though wake ups were more like 90 min. We did the disappearing chair technique - well my husband did it for the first 3 nights. 3 nights chair next to bed doing what you describe then 3 nights chair middle of room then 3 nights in doorway then remove it. Respond to wake ups 3 min first night then 4 then 5 etc. By night 10 put down awake then check every 10 min of crying if not asleep. She still hates going to bed but actually slept through on the second night!

DS1 slept through at that age according to DH... who was the one sleeping through DS1 waking/ crying/ feeding. In my exhausted state, he was lucky he survived when I heard him bragging a complete load of baloney.

In DS's case, he had unidentified food allergies and fed to soothe his digestive system. He was genuinely feeding as well as eating heartily through the day. He still has a hearty appetite and seems to burn it off rapidly.

You know if it is just messing around for comfort or a proper feed.

It is normal for sleep to be disrupted around that age for multiple reasons, some shorter term, some longer term. I found the hardest bit was the general expectation that babies should sleep through at that age when I was bloody knacked after over a year of fragmented sleep (because heavily pregnant sleep was even worse than newborn sleep)

My DD only started sleeping through the night (or with one or two wake ups due to noisy neighbors) when I stopped breastfeeding at 21 months. We tried everything else we could possibly think of, I spent hours and hours online reading about baby sleep cycles etc. I think it is fairly normal for bf babies to wake frequently, it's bloody tough for us mums though I sympathise OP

OP your situation sounds very similar to what we had with DC2. Waking constantly and having to BF to get him back to sleep. We cracked when he was 11 months, started some gentle-ish sleep training. Within a week he was sleeping from 7:30 till 6:30 with just one wake + decent BF. Kept that one night feed for a further 6 months or so.

Wish we'd done the sleep training earlier TBH. Everyone was happier with more sleep.

@Whammy what was your sleep training you used? I’m in a similar situation at the moment. Was hoping it would resolve it self but would be good to know what other options are available

Same as a few previous posters, my DD didn't start sleeping through til I stopped bf her at 16 months.

She still occasionally wakes but can get herself back to sleep in under 5 mins the majority of the time.

When she was bf she usually woke 2-3 times per night at least, and would only go back after a feed.

Dear Noms,
There is an easy solution out of your baby's frequent breast-feeding sessions at night.

As a Baby FEED & SLEEP specialist Midwife, please rest assured that your query is one of the most regular queries we problem-solve in our Newborn support classes.

1. Your baby's feeding frequency at night is because babies at his age easily burn off the calories from your breast milk at this stage.

1. Therefore, the key is in ensuring that each of his day time solid meals are adequate to compliment your baby's breast-feeding intake?

1. Otherwise, if your baby is not full and satisfied throughout their day time feeds and solid food intake - they will wake up naturally from midnight to make up for it

1. Solution

BREAKFAST
When you start the day , start your baby's 7AM breakfast with baby solid food first - not with a breast feed.

That is with a home-made baby fruit puree combo of bananas, sultanas, apples, pears, mangoes and dried apricots - mixed with some baby rice / quinoa / semolina for carbs.

Wash down that puree with only 2oz of warm boiled water. Babies love this puree plus it's great for their bone development and immune system

1. Two and half hours later at 9.30am , your little one will begin to get tired and ready for a much needed snooze.

Plus feel very thirsty as the solid puree will cause that natural effect.

1. That is when you offer your baby their breakfast breast feed to feed as much as the y want on both sides. Your baby would feed avidly and then be ready for a good 2hr deep sleep from 10am - 12pm.

1. LUNCH

Once again, if your baby is not awake at this time , please wake them at 12pm and start their lunch with a vegetable and protein based puree of your choice. PS: We do run Baby weaning group sessions all over London

Then same as before, at 1.30pm.when your baby is ready for a sleep, offer them your breast for as much as needed on both sides. Then a nap at 2- 4pm

SUPPER
Then if your baby is not awake at 4pm, please do wake them up at this time for play time.

Then at 4.30pm an OAT meal based puree mixed with either the breakfast fruit puree combo - OR - a savoury chicken / meat puree .

1. Using Baby oats like the Heinz creamy porridge for your baby's supper is one of the best ways to guarantee a good night's sleep - if the above day time baby feeding plan is incorporated as best as you can.

There is so much but I hope this would provide some much needed answers...

Lets me know

BABY FOOD ALLERGIES
Please be Aware of your family / baby food allergies?

Our BABY-FEED post to Noms query is for for GLUTON & ANIMAL protein TOLERANT babies...

ConfusedBeetle, Very well said!
Parents should not put up with sleepless nights because in our 20 plus years work with postnatal families globally, we have sadly found out that Prolonged Parental Sleep-deprivation PSD has been found to be one of the main triggers for both marital conflict and postnatal depression PND

Some shocking advice on this thread! Night wearing is not recommended so young. Daytime calories will likely have no effect on nighttime wake ups.

Cheekybaby- it's schedules /posts like yours that made me feel shit as a first time mum. Desperately googling to help with sleepless nights I'd come across similar things telling me that my child's 7am breakfast should be this (they'd been awake since 5am- should I not feed them till then?!), that at 9:30 my child WILL be feeling sleepy (tell that to her!), that I should wake the after 2 hours (hollow laughter as she napped on me for precisely 37 minutes for the first 10 months) and that porridge would make them sleep through (all it did was trigger a 10pm poo that led to being awake for 2 hours!) Not all babies are the same I know that isn't convenient to say though, as you can't make money off that.

Op- babies sleep through when they are ready. I tried all sorts of sleep techniques, some with temporary good effects, most with none at all. At 21 months, with no effort on my part, she started sleeping for 10 hours. With DS I didn't stress and knew he'd get there eventually- he just hasn't got there yet! Definitely try to get partner more involved to get as much rest as you can. And good luck!

Ditching my DC had nightweaned themselves long before 9mo. Should I have told them that they were wrong and forcefed them?

Philomena... obviously I meant actively trying to night wean as discussed on previous posts

Ditching my point is that my DC weren't starved because they didn't bf at night. Amazingly, they slept for around 10 hours without needing a feed. DD2 actually slept through the night before we started weaning.

That's great, Philomena, I'm glad you don't starve your children. Night weaning still isn't recommended at that young age. So either that is what you are suggesting or you comments are irrelevant and unhelpful to the discussion.

2b1c51 you and I are entitled to our individual opinion.

However, would you spare a mo to really digest what numerous like Norms are going through..

When one's career involves living-in with f Parents on the verge of a psycho-social breakdown caused by chronic sleep deprivation - PERHAPS - you may find sympathy for these families???

I have had first hand professional experience of what am talking about.

Therefore, shall we Respect every one's opinion - instead of tearing it down without any hard evidence to back it up...

PLEASE Typo is families and parents..

Depends whether you want to carry on breastfeeding. I know someone who’s baby is 2 1/2 and she’s up 2/3 times a night every night. I decided that was not for me and my baby was reverse cycling (feeding more at night) as was distracted in the day. So I express and give bottles in the day, this has got baby in a good routine and seems less distracted with bottles as the feed is generally over quicker, I obviously find a nice quiet space. At night he has 8 oz bottle and tops up with boob. He now wakes once and the other night when he woke, I ignored him and he went back to sleep. So slept through for the first time ever. That was two nights before we went on holiday- so gone back to one wake up again. Feel like we are getting there finally. When I get home I will be night weaning and giving him a bottle at night if he wakes and reducing the amount each time

@DitchingTheDye

Nonsense, totally disagree! You are not starving the baby at all, babies just need to unlearn the habit that they eat at night and need help with it. My baby wakes up so much happier when he hasn’t had multiple night wakings. In fact the night wakings were making him miserable as he wasn’t getting enough sleep.

You don't have to give up breastfeeding - I night weaned both of mine at about 9 months but carried on with day feeds for another 4 months. For me, the key was getting them to sleep without feeding them to sleep and getting lots of calories in during the day. They were chubby so no worries about weight gain and much happier during the day once they slept all night.