To think this is the fair and kind way to fund social care crisis

[BarnabyBungle]

So two people each have £325k in assets.... one dies of a heart attack suddenly and leaves inheritance for family (and/or anyone else they so choose), the other gets severe dementia and spends years in an expensive home, and spends all but the £14k threshold left when they die.

Hardly fair is it?..... But then it’s unreasonable to increase general taxes to fund care as it would mean those without substantial assets would be paying for enabling those that did....

Surely lowering inheritance tax threshold and/or increasing the rate would be fair. If the limit were, say, £125k, and the rate was, say, 40% on inheritance above to the current £325k threshold, both imdividuals would pay £80k inheritance tax, enabling both to pass on £245k, rather than one passing on £325k and the other £14k.

Not only would this be far fairer it would help alleviate the anxiety of those with dementia knowing their condition means they will mean their assets will be dramatically reduced as their disease progresses.

Neither is assisted suicide which is fucking horrifying in the expectations it would place on disabled people.

Assisted suicide puts an expectation on disabled people.

What expectation then? If not for them to kill themselves and relieve their carer of the burden. Seems to be its pretty clear that's what your saying. That disabled people will be expected to kill themselves.

We’ve been to a solicitor and split our assets 50:50 as tenants in common. When the first dies the 50% goes into trust so is protected from care fees. 50% is better than nothing. Obviously doesn’t work if we’re both still alive and need care at the same time.

Tessliketrees

Essential services would be military and A&E

Education, police and fire, would be paid for at a county level from council tax (the only tax I would keep)

Toll roads would replace car tax so the cost to the user would probably be similar.

Radardetector

It's completely the same thing. I raise a legitimate concern, which is shared by disability rights groups, and you decided to take it as me accusing you (somebody I have never met) of doing something to your child. It's weird.

This is a thread that was started about the cost of social care and assisted suicide has been raised as a solution. Multiple times. I don't think assisted suicide is a solution to the funding crisis in social care. I think saying that assisted suicide is a solution to the cost of looking after disabled people is a train of thought that inevitably will lead to people feeling like they are a burden.

Toll roads would replace car tax so the cost to the user would probably be similar

But business? Manufacturing especially, would the cost be the same for them do you think (I honestly don't know). What about the courts?

Ah, but remember Redneck is a Brit in the US where everything is so much better.

ShatnersWig

Not everything, is better,

Not read everything but I think you need to be careful about assisted suicide. My MIL has dementia and requires 24 hour care and my expectation is that all her assets will be spent providing this. She has spent most of her life miserable and depressed and I'm sure would have favoured suicide. But now, with dementia, she is happy for the first time in her life. And assisted suicide would not be what she wants now.

Tessliketrees

Not sure on the court system.

I haven’t calculated anything for manufacturing, but I would expect it to be similar

Really Redneck - I can barely recall a thread where you weren't extolling how much better things are over there

RedneckStumpy

Court system is pretty essential to businesses who would be the ones now in charge of the country. Your kind of idea basically means the government would exist to provide businesses with what they need to make profit and let them redistribute the wealth. Which is exactly what happens in some parts of the world. Can you guess how well it works?

ShatnersWig

No country is perfect, all have bad points, on the whole I fee I made a positive move.

Tessliketrees

I guess it works better than socialism. In all reality there is no perfect system.

Personally I if I had a choice I would opt out of society completely and do my own thing.

I guess it works better than socialism

It depends how you are defining socialism. It also depends on what you define as better.

Personally I if I had a choice I would opt out of society completely and do my own thing

Why don't you? There's loads of places you would be left alone off the grid.

Use better accountants and forward planning. Plus I’m assuming my bike will kill me long before old age does

RedneckStumpy

Your system is pretty much what existed during the industrial revolution in the UK. You'd have loved it.

I favour some sort of insurance policy to cover care costs in the future. With more people becoming lifelong renters it’s probably going to be the only option. My parents have scrimped and saved all their lives because they wanted to leave us something (think this is ingrained in their generation). I wish they had released the money in their house and lived life before they both became so ill. And yes to assisted suicide. They both have said they just want the pain to be over and will end it all if they need to go in a home. They both have DNR orders in place. Medical intervention has kept them alive for years but it struggles to help with the quality of life they have leading both to have major depression

Tessliketrees

We are actively working towards off grid living, unfortunately it takes time to make the switch.

Yes insurance scheme would be good, Gov backed and along the lines of the state pension scheme,with a min safety net but the ability to top up.
We d all pay in and it would be a shared enterprise, just like a pension, die at 65 and get nothing or live 'til 102 and get years of pension.

The over riding issue is that there isn't enough carers or homes available at the mo, no matter how much money you've got.

Funny that despite the country having "no money" for adult social care, we ve 10s of billions to spend on brexit, whether or not you believe its good or bad, its hardly a priority over elderly care of any of our parents.

if you work with the elderly like my sister does financial abuse of the elderly is common families are usually involved

not wanting to pay for extra care as it reduces inheritance, reluctance to put them in 24 hour care as it reduces inheritance, abuse of financial powers of attorney, I think the people who already do this to their elderly relatives could equally well apply pressure towards euthanasia, this risk is known and it is a great concern to groups working with elderly and the disabled

with assisted suicide there has to be a way of telling whether " I don't want to be a burden" is a genuine wish or something they are being blackmailed or threatened towards or even suggesting they are being selfish by being such a burden on their families or society or the state, there are a few people who already say such things to parents who chose not to have an abortion when baby diagnosed with disabilities so it is completely conceivable that they would say such things to the elderly vulnerable

The adult vulnerable person has less protection than a vulnerable child

As others have said - I think it's disgusting already that in this country we penalise the frugal and the caution whilst rewarding the opposite without increasing that further.

My mother and father worked hard all their lives but barely get anything from the government in their retirement whereas my uncle who drank his money away gets everything paid for.

It's frankly disgusting.

but imkait that is the same with a lot of things in this country. we've just had a tenant who owes us 9k - we have no way of getting that money back and the courts exasperated the amount because the process is so long. i would love to have given that money to my kids who are just leaving home. there will always be the spongers and the workers who do the right thing

What expectation then? If not for them to kill themselves and relieve their carer of the burden. Seems to be its pretty clear that's what your saying. That disabled people will be expected to kill themselves

The pressure would come from society, from the same dickheads that bleat about their taxes being used for disability benefits, the people who have no care or consideration for anyone with a disability, the ones who marginalise disabled people and then talk about inclusion as if they’re doing us a favour instead of understanding that we are part of society, no invitation required.

The potential for misuse/abuse of any assisted suicide legislation would need to be considered and loopholes closed before it was even drafted.

But there are also people that can't look after an elderly relative, whether that's financial, geographical or because of their own health or existing responsibilities.

I would only agree with not caring due to their own health .
We could all move away from our home town, finances aren't an excuse, as some manage on hardly anything to care for an ageing or ill relative, and you have to manage responsibilities to fit in, just like previous generations did.

If you don't want to do this/choose not to do your duty, then you have to be prepared to pay for relatives care or lose inheritance.

romanyroots - sorry but i really disagree with your comments. have ever looked after an ill relative, I did it for about a month and couldnt have coped for longer. I would have had to give up work which would have had a massive impact on our family finances, and future plans. Everyone's sleep was being affected - not good when several people have life changing exams and a husband who had to drive early in the morning for miles...ie dangerous with limited sleep. I think a whole families wellbeing has to be taken into account and the older person's cant trump everyone else's