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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

MIL asking partner to be executor of will but just expecting him to accept it

78 replies

Charlotte716 · 15/08/2018 19:48

So my MIL has asked my partner to sign some papers to say he will be in charge of what happens on her passing.

No asking or discussing just sign this. He is one of three but probably the most responsibile.

So she will have not assets, no house savings but she does have debts, does anyone know what will happen to those and if he will be responsible for them?

I’m really annoyed at he expectation, I understand it’s a morbid subject but there is no discussion at all and the relationship is already strained.

OP posts:
FrayedHem · 15/08/2018 21:15

I really don't want to be Executor for my mum. She is leaving everything to my sons and she thinks it will just be really easy for me to deal with. I'm not so sure. I need to look into this again, really.

THEsonofaBITCH · 15/08/2018 21:16

skimmed the thread but not read in detail. The executor is in charge of wrapping up the estate and is free to consult (and charge the estate for the fees) an attorney. Unsecured debts are unsecured and not payable by the estate and the inheritors USUALLY but the creditors will often demand and act like the debts must be paid from the estate (credit cards, payday loans, etc) but they don't. Secured debts must come from the estate and then whatever is left over is distributed to the heirs according to the instructions. particular bequeaths to heirs can be made up front but if not enough assets in the estate may need to be bought from the estate if desired. If there aren't enough assets to pay the secured debts (ie mortgage) then the estate is insolvent and there is no obligation on the part of the executor to pay anything remaining.

jasjas1973 · 15/08/2018 21:25

I reckon i put in about 60 hours for a pretty ordinary estate, a few pensions, a house, bank accounts, IHT, selling property c/w estate agents etc distribution of the estate and your time cannot be claimed back.
The Will was contested which dragged things out somewhat but either way, if the testator has significant assets it will take time to do it properly.

If i find myself asked again, it ll be a big fat NO!

Original poster
Charlotte716 · 15/08/2018 21:46

QueenoftheNights wow calm down with the posts. There really isn’t a need to be rude

OP posts:
Original poster
Charlotte716 · 15/08/2018 21:47

Hi thanks all. We’ll sit down and have a chat together and then make sure we understand what it is then take it from there.

OP posts:
Namechangeforthiscancershit · 15/08/2018 22:24

Unsecured debts are unsecured and not payable by the estate and the inheritors USUALLY but the creditors will often demand and act like the debts must be paid from the estate (credit cards, payday loans, etc) but they don't

Say what? Unsecured debts are definitely payable by the estate. That’s not the creditors trying it on. I’m not sure what you’re getting at here.

THEsonofaBITCH · 15/08/2018 22:41

Unsecured debts are ... unsecured and have no claim to the assets/security of the estate

Namechangeforthiscancershit · 15/08/2018 23:04

No. That’s just not true.

The executor can not distribute anything while there are outstanding unsecured debts. Secured debts rank above unsecured debts in an insolvent estate, but beneficiaries will never receive anything above an unsecured debt.

QueenoftheNights · 16/08/2018 07:16

@Charlotte716 I'm not being rude :) I'm simply saying you don't seem sure if this is about a will or POA. No one can give you advice if you don't know. I asked your age and that of your partner's mum simply because it's relevant. If it's for POA there is plenty of time because this usually only kicks in when someone is old or likely to have mental incapacity (my parents did theirs in their 80s.) Obviously it's sensible to do it sooner but assume there is no panic for this woman. The point about her not being your MIL is relevant because it means you personally won't be liable for any of her debts(even if her son was) and also that you could witness his signatures which you can't if you are married.

PeakPants · 16/08/2018 07:25

Namechange is entirely correct re the debts. They have to be paid whether secured or unsecured. Secured ones are simply secured against a specific asset eg a house whereas unsecured creditors run the risk that the debtor will die without any assets. However, if there is money there, they must be paid. I am a solicitor by the way- not just making this stuff up.

Osirus · 16/08/2018 07:31

I work in probate. Only the deceased’s estate is responsible for their debts. Their family won’t have to pay.

What has he actually signed? Executors don’t have to sign an agreement, they are just named in the Will, and often aren’t aware until the person has died. Also, you can refuse the appointment if you won’t want to do it.

Are you sure he hasn’t signed a power of attorney, to look after her affairs whilst she is ALIVE?

QueenoftheNights · 16/08/2018 08:23

he cannot sign a POA unless it is witnessed. I completed both POAs for parents last year ( downloaded forms online, filled in, printed off) and I am an attorney. I had to ask a neighbour to witness my signature.
POA needs discussion because the donor has to choose either one or more than one and whether they act together or separately. It is far better to choose more than one, because only having one leaves it open to abuse if an attorney was dishonest.

Having POA is a responsibility but more so for the person (the donor) who appoints attorneys. What they are doing is handing over all their rights to another person to act on their behalf which includes their finances, social and medical care /decisions.

There has to be a lot of trust but also a discussion because the forms ask for choices around end of life care (Option A and Option B) on who will make decisions around medical treatment (the doctors or the attorneys.)

This all needs family discussion.

Severide08 · 16/08/2018 08:29

I was excutor for my dad along with my sibling. My dad left a property to us which was sold.We had to make sure that any money he owed was paid out of the estate soon as the house was sold we were not personally responsible. If he had no estate we would not have been able to pay .There was only one very small secured one and when I paid they did ask me to confirm that it was out of my dad's estate and not my own personal finances as they would not have been allowed to be paid if it was not out of the proceeds of the sale .

Severide08 · 16/08/2018 08:37

Just to add the Solictor did also put active in the the local paper and the Gazette so that anyone with a claim on the estate had 3 mths to come foward. It does cost but we did it so that we then knew there was no debts we could have missed or didn't know about. No one ever did but we felt it was worth it .

senua · 16/08/2018 08:38

FryedHem: I really don't want to be Executor for my mum. She is leaving everything to my sons and she thinks it will just be really easy for me to deal with. I'm not so sure. I need to look into this again, really.

It is easy. If you are up to it, do it yourself. If not, you are allowed to delegate the task to someone who can (eg solicitor).

Severide08 · 16/08/2018 08:38

A notice not an active .

cptartapp · 16/08/2018 08:42

FIL has DH, SIL and a solicitor named as executors. A straightforward estate with no re-marriages, step children etc. I was executor after my DM died and although time consuming, found it all relatively straightforward. Can DH and SIL request the solicitor's services aren't needed on FIL passing to avoid fees?

TheLionRoars1110 · 16/08/2018 08:59

Glad you're trying to work out what the document is. Probably best to start a new thread once you know. At the moment you're getting advice relevant to LPAs and Executorships which are not the same things. Probably best to post in legal once you know exactly what the document is.

Bluelady · 16/08/2018 09:04

Yes they can, whether or not there will be a battle is another matter because they make shedloads of money out of it.

I was executor for both my parents' wills and while the probate forms were quite daunting, especially the first time, I did all the work myself and saved thousands. Dad, who hated spending money unnecessarily, would have been proud of me!

Namechangeforthiscancershit · 16/08/2018 09:24

Can DH and SIL request the solicitor's services aren't needed on FIL passing to avoid fees?

Yes unless there is a serious family disputes and reason to stay in place. I’m a solicitor and I can count on one hand the number of times it was more of an ethical problem to renounce than stay in place.

Once the solicitor has renounced they can shop around if they still want help and the fees for just advising will be much lower.

The Law Society have a really good practice note on this that would be good to read before having the awkward convo!

Namechangeforthiscancershit · 16/08/2018 09:26

Probate is not tax neutral though so unless you are a gazillion percent sure that no IHT on second death and no CGT issues it’s worth getting a few hours of advice. I have so many depressing consultations where people didn’t and they’ve paid tax of up to £50k they didn’t need to

Bluelady · 16/08/2018 09:31

It's pretty damn easy to see whether a total estate is worth £325k or less. I took no advice, used my common sense and spent time checking and double checking the figures. On a straightforward estate anyone of reasonable intelligence can do it.

Elephant14 · 16/08/2018 09:32

just to echo what others are saying, executors do not sign wills. So signing "page 5" would mean he could be signing anything!

Namechangeforthiscancershit · 16/08/2018 09:55

It's pretty damn easy to see whether a total estate is worth £325k or less

If you were working on those figures it was a couple of years ago and it’s more complicated now with the residence nil rate band.

The bigger thing is usually CGT actually when everyone thinks that the surviving spouse will definitely not leave the house etc, does almost immediately but house isn’t sold, is rented etc and suddenly the low value which the surveyor gives you to be helpful isn’t at all.

lanbury · 16/08/2018 09:58

No, as an executor he is not personally liable for her debts. He can renounce himself of duties anyway if there are other executors listed.

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