Should I be firing the cleaner?

[dairymilkisevil]

Hi
I've had the same cleaner for the past 18 months. I think I am nice employer, it's all pretty tidy and my last two cleaners before I moved areas were with me for eight years and seven years respectively and they always had great time keeping and cleaning. I have poor health so can't do it myself.

I have noticed several times that she does not do the hours we agreed but takes the money and leaves early (when I am out).
After a few weeks of this at the start I asked her about it, and she replied that now she knew the house better she was faster and that she was "going to tell me she now needed to do two hours not three hours". I noticed though that she had done this for a few weeks and hadn't mentioned it until I mentioned it.

Now it's happening again, I am often out when she arrives - she has the keys - but she often trips the alarm when she arrives and it's a wireless system that sends me a message with "alarm in kitchen at 12:03". And she takes the money for the whole clean but she's left before I get back ....it's 20-40 mins each time that she isn't doing. I've let it go because the house is cleaned well and I've left money around and it's not been touched but I was getting peeved off because she could always clean the oven or I side of fridge or windows or skirting boards with that 20-40 mins I am paying for but she's going home early.

This week she trips the alarm again at 12:03 and because she changed the day without telling me and I was out, I had to text her to ask if it was her. She eventually replied to say yes it was and she had done three hours. I asked her for the timings and she said she had done 1120-1420. But I know from the alarm settings when she came in and when she reset it: 1203-1340. Just over ninety mins, so I asked her if she was sure of the timings and she said "oh yes , now I think about it, it was actually two hours , 1220-1420. Sorry, my head is all over the place !" But I know she is about two hours. And she would have invoiced me for three hours.

I have had enough now, but how do you sack her? Am I honest to her and tell her why? If so, how?
Also, she has my house keys and I want them back in case she is very pissed off at being fired and cuts a copy! (Which I know is v paranoid and U of me). And I need to get back off holidays to change the alarm code.

But I know getting a decent hardworking honest punctual cleaner is difficult. Sigh. Help!

Clarify the contract. Many cleaners are being paid for jobs done rather than actual time so they do x amount of cleaning which roughly takes x amount of time so if they take longer or do it quicker, the pay is still the same.

My cleaners are paid for the job bit their hours

Also I'd tell her if you finish early can you do XYZ too please

If she's good I wouldn't get rid

*not their hours

In fact they often bring a team in and do the whole thing really quickly!

Pay her the money tell her EXACTLY what needs cleaning every week. Therefore if she takes an hour and works like a dynamo you are both happy.
Another MNer runs her business on a per job rather than hour model. I'm now doing this with my clients. So say 30 for whole house clean not including interiors of units/white goods. That way she can't miss your skirting boards etc.

She's untrustworthy so you should sack her
Maybe consider using an agency next time as you can address these issues better

I would say if she is doing a good job just let her know you can see when she arrives and leaves via the alarm system and ajust her wages accordingly, you obviously trust her with money etc being left about and cleaners this trustworthy are well worth keeping.

If you are generally happy with the standard of cleaning, I would reduce the job to two hours only, and either tell her, or write a list of, extra smallish jobs she can do it she has time left over.
I had my own cleaning business for 10 years, and I often found that once a house was up together, it took less time to clean it (with the exception of some noticeably dirty families!) In these cases I used to reduce the time, but obviously also the money. If she continues to take the mick I would find someone else. Have you told her you can tell what time she arrives and leaves from your alarm? I would. That would probably be sufficient to stop her doing it

I would let her go. She's trying to take advantage and pull a fast one. I too however would be wary about how to do it, so I'd do it 'nicely' rather than 'fire' her as such.

Give her a list of extra tasks she can do some from if she finishes the main stuff early. I think that given you are in poor health you need to feel a bit more entitled to a decent service from the cleaner and have less middle class guilt about it. You physically need it more and may be in less of a position to afford it. If you do need to sack her, I would tell her that unlike some families, you don't have the ability/energy to do these things yourself so you really need a reliable cleaner.

You may be better with a large firm so they can send replacement cleaners easily. (However I know that if you have any very specific instructions it can be an issue if random different cleaners don't understand or don't follow them.)

I'd sack her. You've caught her lying to you on more than one occasion. She isn't professional and she is cheating you if she can.

And as to how, I would just say we will no longer be requiring your services as of X date; please return the keys by X date. Thanks.

If she’s doing a good job, take Flumpybear’s advice. Good cleaners are hard to come by.

I don’t think I could get past the lying even if she was a good cleaner.....

If you're happy with her work jus leave a list of extra jobs.

See what happens and take it from there. I would be unhappy with the lying but I would be even more unhappy with a sloppy job. Tricky, isn't it.

Oh this is a tough call.

Could you add a few more jobs, like you said she could clean the skirting boards or maybe empty and wipe out one of your food cupboards.

I’d be really upset at the lying, she’s trying to get paid for three hours work but only do 90minutes.

Really it’s up to you as to whether you say “seeing as you can whizz through so quick, would you clean the grill pan on Tuesday and the airing cupboard needs emptying and hoovering out on Friday.” and just always add her a few extra jobs each visit, or you say “if you only want to do the basic dusting, wiping, floor routine and you manage that in 90 minutes, let’s reduce your pay”

Myself, I’d be glad to find a good, trustworthy cleaner. But lying about hours worked sort of makes her less trustworthy.
That said, if I could nip of early and come in late I would.

I’d add more to the workload. But it’s really your call.

I would try to make a list of needs doing and clarify the contract with her.
Or you could mention that, as she seems to only need 1h30 to only pay her for that?
If she is still leaving early, then I would ask for the keys back (after you’ve found someone to replace her!)

If she is expecting to do 3 hours work in half that by going quickly, because she is thinking in terms of jobs done, and you are expecting 3 hours work at that rate, there’s potentially going to be a problem when you ask her to fill the time with extra jobs.

I do think if you’re paying by time you should get that time though - just be careful how you manage it when discussing with her - she seems keen to work by time when she can abuse it; she might not if she can’t.

Alternatively offer to pay her a combination of time worked as per alarm log so long as she does an agreed set of tasks.

Thanks for all your replies, it is a tricky one as she does a good job but continually takes the money for a certain amount of hours that she doesn't actually work. But as many of you have pointed out, she does a good job while she is here.

How about this:
" I have noticed that you often whizz through the standard cleaning and ironing very quickly ; i think it's time to discuss the contracted hours and reduce them.Alternatively I can leave a list of extra tasks to be done to ensure that the full three hours that I have agreed to pay for are fully used each week."

Trouble is I did that sort of message before and now she is taking the mick again

You could try that if you want to keep her. It sounds perfectly reasonable. This issue I’d have is that yes you’ve tried that before and also when pulled up on the fact she’s worked less hours she lied.. I couldn’t have someone working for me who lied like that.

Does she know about the alarm timer now?

Don't reduce the hours, just leave more tasks or ironing.

Does she know you know what hours she does?

If she is a very good cleaner, gets everything done, and you like her as a person, I would overlook this.

I’d be annoyed and I would get rid of her. Just say you don’t need her services anymore then find someone else. You say she’s good but by not completing her hours and still taking money she is effectively stealing from you.

But she's not a good cleaner - she's dishonest.

Taking money for hours not worked is stealing in my book.

Be in the day you tell her she is no longer needed and get your keys back straight away.

My cleaner uses up any spare time ironing. I don’t mind if she goes up to 20 minutes early though (3 hour clean) because the traffic gets bad where we are after a certain time and she works really hard.

How many hours a week does she work and what is she paid?

Do the maths and see how much she's effectively stolen from you.

Just because it isn't cash left lying around doesn't alter what she's doing.

I can't believe the number of posters accepting this situation. Do you all overpay for services?