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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Heartbroken that I'm being forced to sell mum's house, she worked hard for it and paid her national insurance

999 replies

Jkoakham · 25/07/2018 09:28

And now her savings are running out I will need to sell her house to carry on funding it.

It all seems to very unfair, her house was supposed to be passed to me but instead it's affectively passed to government and private companies.

I thought the dimentia tax had been can cancelled?

OP posts:
fieryginger · 25/07/2018 17:45

I understand your annoyance, there are people who never contribute anything, whilst your DM has worked all her life.

Anyone in your shoes would be pissed off. I call bullshit on anyone being happy to sell a family home for care. Yes, in theory she should, but when it comes to actually doing it, I don't believe anyone would be "oooh here you go £££££".

AutoFilled · 25/07/2018 17:50

Not read pass the first page. But that’s how it is. If you don’t own anything then the state pays for it. The IL did this and is doing massively well. MIL is in a council flat with pension credits and no private income. I don’t think there will be funding for our generation however. There isn’t any left in NZ where they were. MIL moved back to the UK and is entitled to everything. She commented how good it is here!

SheSparkles · 25/07/2018 17:50

YANBU, have you investigated other ways of raising money from the house-such as renting it out.
And for all the people saying that no one’s entitled to an inheritance, I’d bet a lot of money that they’d be equally pissed off in your position, but it’s not very MN to say so

MeltingPregnantLady · 25/07/2018 17:53

How long was your mum an expat for autofilled? Because legally after a certain amount of time they are classed as an immigrant and subject to the same terms and conditions for funding of health and social care

MeltingPregnantLady · 25/07/2018 17:54

shesparkles I don't want an inheritance. I want happy healthy well cared for relatives. There are more of us like this than you may think

scaryteacher · 25/07/2018 17:55

@PinkSparklyPussyCat 'Twas in the Telegraph either yesterday or the day before. There was the thought that a charge could be taken over the property to cover it.

greatbigwho · 25/07/2018 17:56

This thread is really showing up an "us and them" attitude.

Bully for the ones of you lucky enough to own property, lucky enough to be upset about the potential loss of inheritance.

My mother is at a very high risk of developing dementia and doesn't have any assets to pay for care. So the likelihood is she'll end up in a council run home, receiving the bare minimum care they can afford.

I would sell her house, my house and whatever I could to ensure she could receive the top notch care that would be possible if she had a house to sell.

(And before anyone accuses her of being being reckless and not planning for her old age, she did own a house before she had a huge stroke and was forced to sell as she couldn't stay in the job she was in that paid her mortgage. So she planned and it was for nothing.)

noselimit · 25/07/2018 17:58

Anyone in your shoes would be pissed off. I call bullshit on anyone being happy to sell a family home for care. Yes, in theory she should, but when it comes to actually doing it, I don't believe anyone would be "oooh here you go £££££"

But it's not a family home. It's the parents home we are talking about.

Call bullshit all you want but I am quite happy to see my parents money pay for my parents living costs. That's kind of how things are supposed to work. It doesn't change after a certain age. They still have responsibilities to themselves.

I don't give a flying fuck about their house. My concern is their health and well-being. I have my own house, my own job, my own savings. So yes of the house needs sold to pay for what is essentially a new home, then so be it.

HariboIsMyCrack · 25/07/2018 17:59

This reply has been withdrawn

Message from MNHQ: This post has been withdrawn

pinook · 25/07/2018 18:02

leftcentreright,, I wasn’t asking whether you are a Labour fan I was talking about one of their suggestions (which they didn’t go through with) was to set up a national care fund funded by a small percentage on a person’s estate at death. It’s a suggestion I would support. As you point out you don’t want to pay anymore taxes on your earnings. This system is a fixed percentage on the estate at death for all people, not just those over a certain amount. There can either be the present situation where those unfortunate to get very ill in their last few years of life can have all their estate wiped out (won’t effect the wealthy as they will still have enough to leave some estate) whilst others don’t and leave any estate intact. I personally support sharing the risk. Of course I appreciate not everyone would choose this option, but it would get my vote.

A tri party system for national healthcare, state, employee, care still means some people will not be able to pay if they become chronically ill and unable to work and pay into it. Thankfully, people support that.

@HariboisMyCrack, yes, I would support Labour’s suggestion of a 10% levy on everybody’s estate.

Beardedlobster · 25/07/2018 18:02

Is she in a nursing home receiving nursing care or in a residential setting. If she is in need of nursing care then she should have had a CHC assessment by your CCG in line with a social care assessment by the local authority and that can ascertain a contribution to care. If your mum is in a residential home so does not require care from a registered nurse you are still entitled to social care funding however this is means tested and unfortunately property is an asset so should be used in this case to pay for care. I understand it is frustrating and in an ideal world we would be able to take care of the elderly who have paid into the system for so long but that is completely unattainable and unsustainable and would bankrupt the health and social care service. Be thankful that you have the means to pay and therefore some choice over your mums care. I’ve worked with families where they are only entitled to minimal funding and there loved ones end up in absolute hell holes but there is no other choice.

Honflyr · 25/07/2018 18:04

My concern is their health and well-being. I have my own house, my own job, my own savings

My kids wouldn't have their own house or savings. I wouldn't want to leave them like that.

Tortycat · 25/07/2018 18:08

YANBU. I have a lot of sympathy, but i saw my df spend 150k on nursing home fees before he died so I'm biased. Dm now also has dementia so I'll probably be in the same position as you some day.

i accept that there's not enough money to pay for everyone , but it seems so unfair that physical illness is funded but dementia isnt. Df was in a wheelchair, doubly incontinent, unable to speak or respond to anyone, unable to feed himself, pressure sores etc but was not 'ill enough' to qualify for continuing health care. He died before he was ill enough. A cap should be introduced and the inequity stopped.

Alconleigh · 25/07/2018 18:09

All those saying "well I will spend up and get the State to pay for everything"..... as well as being selfish, are you paying any attention to what is happening in this country? We are poised to fall off a cliff into a massive recession that will likely destroy what is left of the social contract and the welfare state (a position the elderly actually mostly voted for but let's not go there)......decent state run care homes? We"ll be lucky if we're not eating the elderly soon........

pinook · 25/07/2018 18:16

@Tortycat, I am sorry about your parents. I agree it is unfair dementia is not funded like other physical illnesses. Fair enough if everyone has to pay living costs (though I still support levy on everyone’s estate) but the present system for having to fund nursing care for dementia is very unfair.

ADastardlyThing · 25/07/2018 18:21

Yanbu and the stinger is having money doesn't always guarantee a better standard of care, it all depends on needs, availability, area....... I wish people wouldn't suggest more money = better quality, it's not always the case.

runningkeenster · 25/07/2018 18:25

You do get a contribution towards nursing care as opposed to care home care (ie dressing/feeding/cooking/cleaning etc) but it was only about £110 a week. My father's nursing home fees were £1200 a week, £1000 of which came out of his pocket. He had Parkinsons rather than dementia and would only have qualified for the full nursing care in his last few weeks, I didn't bother to apply. My uncle had dementia and did get it for the last few months I think, it is very very difficult to get.

My issue is simply if I get Parkinsons I'll end up having to pay for my own care . If I have cancer, I won't. Why should there be a difference? Both are medical conditions.

Simply needing help in your later years due to old age is one thing. When people talk about looking after people yourselves to save your inheritance, this is actually the situation they mean - your relatives may need you to cook and clean for them.

It is very different from caring for someone who cannot walk and where it needs two people and a hoist to take them to the loo. And that is without all the issues that come from having dementia.

MeltingPregnantLady · 25/07/2018 18:30

The difference is the difference between medical and social care. Long term chronic illnesses such as Parkinson's and arthritis and dementia are slow burning and plateau for years meaning people with them often don't need medical treatment beyond a few tablets (simplifying it here I know!) And perhaps continence care.

Cancer requires nursing, invasive treatments, therapies that break the skin and need expert care to manage etc once someone with a long term illness requires this level of intervention they may be eligible for health care funding

mostdays · 25/07/2018 18:32

It does seem horribly unfair that our dcs will be living in a world where some will be enjoying g a massive grandparental bonanza and others will be getting nada

That's always been the case and probably always will until we have the revolution

ElementalHalfLife · 25/07/2018 18:32

Question - who are "all these people who have contributed nothing" who are getting all this free stuff in their old age? Come on, someone explain this to me because I'm not understanding how all these terrible freeloaders are getting away with reaching the age of 65 not having paid a penny in tax or NI contributions or ever having worked. I I mean going by the way they are villified in threads like this, we can't be talking about people who worked all their lives but didn't have high-paying jobs and therefore couldn't afford to save from their earnings can we? My mum couldn't tell me who these people were when I asked her, so maybe some of you can enlighten me.

52FestiveRoad · 25/07/2018 18:34

If it wasn't dementia, if she just couldn't cope with stairs, would you think that because she needs flat, should she get that for free so she didn't need to sell her house?

In this example the DM could sell her house and buy a flat, so she still had a property. Rather than the OPs mother's situation where her property is being seized and sold to pay her care needs. It is the loss of the asset that makes this situation incomparable with the one you are citing.

MeltingPregnantLady · 25/07/2018 18:36

It's not being seized Hmm she has moved home to one that meets her needs. She still has to pay rent, water, council tax, utilities, food etc and then she happens to have a care Bill on top.

jasjas1973 · 25/07/2018 18:40

I understand it is frustrating and in an ideal world we would be able to take care of the elderly who have paid into the system for so long but that is completely unattainable and unsustainable and would bankrupt the health and social care service

Load of bollox.
We ve plenty of money to fight wars in foreign lands or buy a nuclear deterrent, 100s of Lockheed Martin jets at a cost of billions or even a fucking railway @ 43 billion.
Let alone fund brexit at billions before we even leave!

Most people do not spend decades in a nursing home, the vast majority of care is provided in the home at reasonable cost to the state... if they funded it.

We as a society decided not to fund elderly care, that is all there is to it.

LeftRightCentre · 25/07/2018 18:40

My kids wouldn't have their own house or savings. I wouldn't want to leave them like that.

Then give them, to the best of their abilities, the tools to create their own savings. Why is it up to someone else to protect their inheritance via higher taxes?

noselimit · 25/07/2018 18:41

My kids wouldn't have their own house or savings. I wouldn't want to leave them like that.

Well why not?

I worked hard for what I have, why can't your children?