To ask a question about what a Catholic would do in a certain scenario for a piece of fiction I'm writing?

[AjasLipstick]

So...the setting is 1890. If an Irish Catholic had to bury a fellow Catholic in a very remote place where there were no churches or priests...how would they go about it?

What things would they be certain to ensure were done? What would they say?

I know it did happen in the American frontier, but I don't know what they did
Settlers to Jamestown would have been Protestant so presumably different requirements to Catholics in terms of burial.
OP, who are the protagonists? Did they know that they might end up in this situation? They might have considered it and taken a small Reliquary with them on their journey. This could then be buried with them.

At Irish funerals in Ireland we always say a decade of the rosary around the grave at a catholic funeral. In 1890 it probably would have been the same but said in Irish.

Do they have a prayer book ? A bible. Anything religious ? It's olden days Pre Vatican II, very traditional. I don't think people would be doing things by themselves outside of their prerogatives. So the feeling would be utter despair as it cannot be right. Whatever you are going to do it will not be right. Not catholic but interested.

If it was known the person would or could then everything possible would be done to find a priest before they died.

If they can't be buried in consecrated ground then I think they would try to mark the grave so that at a later date someone could find them and have them re-interred in consecrated ground.

If they can read then they may have a prayer book or a missal with them (book with the mas set out in Latin and the local language when mass was still said in Latin).

I would imagine they would have made a visit tot heir local priest before undertaking their trip to the middle of nowhere

The deceased would not be able to enter heaven, but on the next All Soul's day the renaming family may obtain a special plenary indulgence ie get the family member out of purgatory and into heaven.

The link is to the modern form, it may have changed at Vatican 2 along with loads of other things.

www.thoughtco.com/indulgence-for-all-souls-day-542495

Thanks everyone, so much. So many useful comments. Sashh that's great thank you!

they don’t queue...how does that work?

They just all gathered round the priest, basically mobbed him (respectfully).

I remember that! Mobbing the priest round the altar rails. The mammies were always good at pushing in!

Settlers to Jamestown would have been Protestant so presumably different requirements to Catholics in terms of burial.

I was referring to the American Western frontier. There were Catholic settlers, including Irish Catholics, in the American West in the 19th century. Some of these areas were very remote and not always served by churches of any kind.

The earliest colonisers of the Americas were all Catholics ... Columbus and then the conquistadors. I'd guess the latter would have priests as a necessary part of their entourage?

Have you read Secret River? It's about the beginning of Australia and the author has loads of bits in it where people had to adapt their trsditions and beliefs.

Also Phillipa Gregory wrote a book set in early America where similar iasues arose. Sorry, can't remember the title.

Hmm, interesting one. They would only have ever attended mass in Latin, so the bits of the mass that modern Catholics are recalling in English, they would have been trying to recall by rote in Latin. And some prayers/hymns in English...or, actually, possibly in the Gaelic.

So, imaging being back in 1890...

I'd probably try to stumble through the Credo, but mumbling the bits where I can't remember the Latin. I suspect I might dredge up something about ashes to ashes and dust to dust, and probably something about man that is of woman born.

Possibly manage Yeah though I walk in the shadow of the valley of death, yet shall I fear no evil etc. And probably struggle through an Ave Maria and a Pater Noster (Hail Mary and Our Father in Latin).

I reckon they'd say the rosary (the sorrowful mysteries), sprinkle holy water on the grave and say "eternal rest grant unto him/her, oh lord and may perpetual light shine upon him/her and may he/she rest in peace, amen. May his/her soul and the souls of all the faithful departed through the mercy of God, rest in peace, amen"

Thinking about it, with all this "depending on how much they can remember" from the various Catholic incantations and rites, you could work a bit of light humour in there.

In a lovely novel I was recently reading, a young girl with SEN was performing a "funeral" for a much-loved pet. She ad-libbed beautifully with the things she said. "Ashes to ashes, funk to funky, we know Major Tom's a junkie" came out at one point. It was a lovely touch because the girl's character was very endearing and warm.

Not that your protagonist is the same type of person, but he could make a slightly amusing mistake in his prayers.

Or not! Your book...

And of course your character predates David Bowie, I realise that.

They would say the rosary - that is what a good Catholic would say as someone died or is dying. Doesn't matter how long ago.

There would not be any other prayers, they would mark it with a cross if they could.

Catholics would not be upset about unconsecrated ground - they have already left Ireland!! Also, Irish Catholics were a lot less "Catholic" in the 1800's.

I am an Irish Catholic, living in Ireland.

If they had left Ireland they wouldn't speak Irish so they would say the Rosary in English.

I work in a Catholic school and know the Eternal Rest by heart as we say it every time there is a death affecting the school. So this is what came into my head in terms of prayer.

You should consider contacting the Catholic History Society, or the Diocese of Westminster Press Office and asking them if there is any info available about this. Maybe even the military might know.

Might one of them have brought a small bottle of holy water?

There is always this odd choir boy who's grown up and knows the prayers, he might be even able to cantillate (french old movies). The main character is very religious knows his prayers but mumbles, too upset. I remember clearly this type of dynamic when I was a kid.

I would imagine that the live person would try to dig a grave, or cover the body with stones like a cairn, then say the Our Father and pray over the body.

If it could be managed before they died they could write a letter to a loved one. They would be buried with a Bible and/or rosary beads if available and prayers said over the body. Perhaps a token of jewellery or item of personal use taken to give to the family. When civilisation was reached, they would contact the local priest who would have a mass said for their soul.
I am a long long lapsed Catholic but this is what I imagine would happen

Probably depends on the character's level of education. If educated, able to read and understand Latin, they might use prayers from the Missal. It would be a pre-1962 missal. I have one with prayers for the dying/just died in the back. If less educated, then more basic prayers - Pater Noster, Ave Maria x 3, Gloria Patri, Requiem Aeternam. Maybe a Rosary. Possibly a prayer to St Joseph, who is (I think) patron saint of the dying - you would need to check when he was formalised as such, however, as his cult is a more recent one. Don't forget the kneeling and crossing!

One more thing, unless the dead person was clearly very holy, the assumption would have been purgatory in the next world, so the character doing the burial might want to seek an indulgence for them, so they get time off.