Child services?

[ETgo]

Not really an AIBU sorry but need some advice, I may be a bit vague to protect people’s identity but the main gist will be there.

Basically we have a 16 yo friend (A) of our DC staying with us and has been for the past month. Doesn’t want to go back home/not welcome at home. A has told mother where they are. We (me, DH, 16 yo, 13 yo) have allowed A to stay but always maintained it was not long term, helped set up bank accounts etc ready for when A gets a job.

Spoke to child services a week in for guidance/advice on where to go from here - thought they would assist in finding somewhere safe for A to live and put support in place for guidance on college/jobs/housing etc. We’re told that if A was safe with us then they wouldn’t be able to help and told us if we couldn’t keep A with us anymore then we should take him to the city homeless shelter . There is no way I could do this to a 16 yo. Since then we’ve plodded along but we cannot keep A here as tensions are building - A not doing anything wrong but is just being a 16 yo and it is too much responsibility for us.

After a trip to a&e with A (nothing serious but A wanted to get injured leg looked at) they are doing a mash referral and explained to A that it cannot be a permanent arrangement and mum can’t just forget she has pr for A. I have phoned child services again and am waiting on a call back from Monday to discuss.

Does anyone know what A’s options will be? I feel the most awful guilt that we are making A homeless and hate to think of A thinking nobody wants them. Also any idea on timescale- we can’t really see us being able to manage for more than another couple of weeks

Are you in England or USA as there’s a mixture of terms there (child services = USA, A&E = UK) as the location will make a difference to the advice given.

You aren’t making him homeless, his own family did, you have him somewhere to stay when he was homeless.

He will hopefully go into supported living. Depends on your area.

Hi - in UK - it is called Child Services in our area. And mash referral = multi agency safeguarding hub

I’m assuming uk becuase mash? Would be useful to know if Scotland, Wales etc as different laws I think.

Shelter website may help. Timescale depends on so many things I couldn’t say. I’d advise being over rather than under dramatic with the conversation with services, if you say you think you can’t cope for much longer they will take the p, if you say you can’t cope any longer they might get it sorted sooner. You can explain to the child why you need to do this, to get them the help needed.

Oh sorry should have clarified England and in the south.

I know in my head that it isn’t us making A homeless but that doesn’t stop me feeling horrendous

MASH should be able to help but a full assessment by them generally will take around 6 weeks probably longer. It will probably involve several home visits and talking to your family and A's family before a decision is made as to what to do

That’s my worry about timescales- we don’t want A to stay here and whilst I have no issues with them visiting us this cannot be A’s home , the stress is making me ill and I don’t think my youngest will be able to handle the school holidays with A here. Also we have a trip away in 3 weeks to family that A cannot come on (staying with family and they will not accommodate A understandably) and don’t want A in our house without us.

I think I may have to tell child services we cannot have A after X date and hope they take us seriously

I had my own council place at 16. most people I know did.

I’ve tried to look into things online and not sure that a council place of A’s own is an option - A won’t be entitled to any benefits as have to stay in education until 18. The only things I’ve seen (if no other family members can help) seems to be ‘foyers’ but from speaking to friends with dealings with these they’re not the nicest of places.

We will have to sit down with A in a day or two then and explain we have to say we cannot house him anymore so that he does get help and A will put on a brave face but I know they’ll be upset- whilst A is a bit lazy as a lot of 16 yo are, A has also said they really enjoy being treated as part of the family and I just wish I was a bit stronger and able to offer them a permanent home

Dont know whether or not these can help

www.emmaus.org.uk/what_we_do/homelessness

@ETgo

I work for our local YMCA, we house 16-25 year olds, in a supported accommodation/foyer scheme.

Have you spoken to the one in your area directly? I know you've heard it's not great, but some people would say that about ours simply because either a. They don't actually know what we do and only spot we're here when there's a major crisis and assume it's blue lights at the door every day or b. They've lived here, expected to do as they please and are sorely disappointed when they can't and we put sanctions against them. You might find it's actually fine!

He should be entitled to Income Support (unless you're an entirely UC area) if he's in education but that doesn't mean a Sixth Form or traditional college necessarily, there are other training providers he can go to which count as education for benefit purposes. He may also get a weekly bursary from them which will increase his income.

Hi - yep we are in UC area for new claims. Haven’t spoken to anyone other than child services at the mo, still waiting for call back- will be phoning every day until something is sorted. Can I ask can A self refer to an organisation like yours or does it have to go through other channels first? I’ll look into local details for near me at the weekend and start making contact with them as well

Well children's services won't just find him somewhere to live. They would try to get him back home. If they really couldn't do that they would advise him to present as homeless at the young people's housing office.
He wouldn't be put in foster care or any other accommodation provided by children's services unless they were sure he had a need for it, ie his family are abusive or he is at risk in going home.

To the PP who said most people got council places at 16 - that was a whole other world. That doesn't happen anymore.

This happened to one of DS friends. The council tried to say he was safe on my sofa, I took him to housing and refused to take him home with me - they found him supported accommodation and sorted out his benefits.

Time is running out but - what about asking his school to raise a safeguarding concern that a 16 year old is 'sofa surfing' and imminently homeless? See what they can arrange? The young person will need some sensitive discussion about best ways forward so that it isn't a shock that school are doing this. You sound really fab and it isn't right that this should become a strain.

Would you consider an arrangement with his family whereby he stays with you one or two nights a week? Is it worth the discussion with them? Or are they completely stonewalling?

fair enough must have changed now. it was around 10 years ago

The YMCA and the local homeless shelter should be reasonably connected services with the local authority. Tell them you have been feeding a 16 yr old who has been made homeless, see what they can do? A 16 yr old is unlikely to be a priority for children's services unless you make a big fuss on his behalf. Thank goodness he has you. If support is offered now, you.might be prepared to offer occasional respite but if it is affecting the family the way you describe, realistically he is going to have nobody as you will burn out. He is essentially imminently at risk of being on the streets. What does he need to do - turn up to childrens social care with a rucksack and sleeping bag and claim to be 15? He is entitled to be in education, employment or training. That's another team worth contacting who might be well enough connected in the Local authority to make some calls for him, a bit later down the line.

he is under 18 - children's services have a duty of care - he will voluntarily go into care

he will probably be offered supported accommodation

or he could stay with you under a private fostering arrangement

do not let them tell you they wont help - they are legally obliged to

this op

section 20 of the Children Act 1989 is about the LA’s duty to provide a child with somewhere to live because the child doesn’t currently have a home, or a safe home:

there isn’t anyone who has parental responsibility for him (for e.g. an asylum seeking child who has come to the UK on his own);
the child has been lost or abandoned;
the person who has been caring for the child can’t provide him with a suitable home, whatever the reason for this and regardless of whether this is short term or long term problem.

@ETgo you seem a very caring person , I wish I had have had a parent like you . My mum and dad made me homeless at 16 , there are special houses exclusively for homeless 16-17 year olds and surprisingly a lot of youngsters go to these places , they are only kept there for u to a year and the LA has to house them within that time . It is a great place of support, they will get support on budgeting , finding a job , emotional issues etc its not at all as bad as you are imagining .However , the children that come in there can be very challenging gong and unstable so advisable for them to be out most of the day and just go back to eat, shower and sleep ... like I did

@ETgo referrals will depend entirely on the scheme. Some take self referrals, others need an agency to refer in. You're best getting in touch with the foyer direct. Quite often they will have a better idea of routes in to accommodation for 16 year olds than social services of the council's housing team.

Thank you everyone - I’m feeling a bit calmer now and have a little bit of hope! I think what I’m going to do is:
a) keep phoning mash everyday
b) speak directly to the homeless dept at the council on Friday
c) sit down and explain to A that in order for him to be able to access help and support etc we ‘have’ to make him homeless in the sense that we cannot have him here anymore - might mean he has to pack his bag (all he has) and we take home to the homeless team

Both myself and husband want to continue helping A as much as we can/they want with things and more than happy for A to spend time with us for a chat and dinner etc but I think A is getting too comfortable here (own room, sky tv, PS4, new clothes/trainers) and so has no incentive to want to try and be pro-active with looking for ways forward.

Fingers crossed 🤞

ghosty section 20 does not apply to every teen who has fallen out with their parents.
They will not offer foster care nor would the op get any support or funding if she was privately fostering him.
The Southwark judgement set out the legal duty of local authorities to carry out a social care assessment of homeless young people but that rarely results in social work support.
The resources are not there to offer accommodation and/or social work support to homeless teens if there are no safety issues preventing them from returning home.

My ex in laws foster kids. They kept on a kid after 16 for no payment because they'd had him since ages 8, asked for support like u but said no unless they didn't want him anymore. Sadly think u need to play the system, evict A but with promise of you friendship and emotional support and hope for best x