To think some posters live in a weird bubble if they think parents have free choice of schools?

[Treesybreezy]

Whenever there is a poster with a problem with a school, primary or secondary, a rash of people appear declaring 'you knew this when you chose the school you have to abide by it now's

You'd think the mad panic over what schools children are allocated every year, with stories about children not placed every year, would penetrate a bit? We don't have free choice of schools (ignoring fee paying schools - what percentage of the population is that anyway?). We have to apply to schools that are in catchment for our address and then hope that they get a place in what can be the least worst option. And given that not everyone is in a position to be able to effectively homeschool (especially for secondary school) this will regularly mean children attending schools that parents dislike parts of, in order for the children to at least get an education.

I completely agree. There are so many different circumstances that mean you don’t get a choice. Live in a rural area, there may only be one school nearby. Live in an area with lots of faith schools and you might not qualify for lots of local schools. Live in a ‘black hole’ and you may get no choice.

Yanbu

And often when there is a "choice" it's between crap crapper and crapperer.

I often wonder what people in these actual situations of being 104 on a list having a failed appeal or 2 and in schools who have already gone way over PAN just to cover those on catchment let alone those from 15 miles away, would actually do

However true this is, there is still SOME choice. Sending your child to be educated is a decision you make as a parent. You can't insist schools do things your way, because nobody is forcing your child to attend, bar you.

I find It odd too. There is only one secondary my child is eligible for. We live too far from any others. The school is ok. It's near the bottom of the national league tables for results. I dont just have to suck it up and feel perfectly comfortable with challenging any silly rules or ideas if it becomes necessary. Schools are meant to have accountability built into them through governors and local authority electiond although the academy thing has broken that accountability.

You have forgotten to mention that we have the free choice to attend church to get the 'good' school you want. You also have the slightly more expensive choice to move house so you only live 100m from a 'good' school. And lastly there is also the free choice to 'fiddle' the system.

So not quite 'no' choice.

You do however see the odd poster who chose a faith school, then complains about too much religion but by and large you are right of course.

Pengggwn, see how long you can get away with the choice of not educating them

'slightly more expensive' to move. Bwhahahaha

I haven't chosen a faith school, wasn't on any of the 3 options I was allowed to put down. Dd2 got put in a faith school. Had to wait for the place to be available too, we moved around October and no school near us (out of at least 5) had spaces in her year. Took nearly a month to get a school. I'm not happy about the amount of religion!

We have a choice of schools (between three) where we live, but I appreciate it’s not the case for everyone. I think peng meant you could home educate. There is no legal requirement for children to attend school, they just have to be in education. That can be at home or at school.

Completely agree. We live rurally and there is effectively only one option for secondary schooling unless you are in a position to drive your kids backwards and forwards every day. The catchment area is very large so we would have to move a considerable distance to have another viable option. When we moved house a few miles to our current village, my DS was in year 4 and I had assumed he would be able to move to our new village primary, only to find it was completely full (you can’t apply for a transfer until you have actually moved!). I had no choice but to ferry him back to his old school (10 mile round trip) every day for two years!

Given I'd mentioned home ed in my op, I was thinking pengggwn had already read and considered what I'd said.

Smoothsailing, so glad I got a space then! We moved too far to stay at the kids' old schools.

You can't homeschool if you have to go out to work, and many people aren't educated enough themselves to be able to homeschool, so it's not a choice for most people.

I'm guessing that's why my parents specifically chose an area to move to with good schools before trying to conceive. They thought a bit too much about the future but it worked out I guess

Given I'd mentioned home ed in my op, I was thinking pengggwn had already read and considered what I'd said.

Well yes, but she was saying that there is still some choice 🤷‍♀️. There is.

Not to say it’s a nice choice btw. I appreciate that a lot of people wouldn’t ever consider homeschooling for many valid reasons and they don’t like their choice of school.

But there is a choice- most people (ok, not the very poorest) choose where they work and live. We "chose" to remain living somewhere I hate because the schools are good. If I didn't have children to consider, I would have moved away years ago.
But some people have other priorities that for them are more important than education, such as job opportunities, giving support to elderly relatives, living in a certain area because of health needs etc.

It's all very well shrugging your shoulders and saying oh well. Mines been allocated the local catchment and I'm fighting to get him somewhere else. It's looking like he's going to miss the first term of school because SEND services are giving me the run around.

Local catchment has a low uptake, appalling ofsted, a terrible reputation and simply isn't set up to serve the needs of SN kids with ECHPs. Why should I risk the mental health of my child who currently loves school, shove him in mainstream totally unsuited to his needs just because it's our catchment?

In the town where I live a lot of people do get the choice of which lower school they want their child to go to. Every lower school is rated "good" or "outstanding" in the town so the choice isn't available just because of poor ofsted ratings. There are a few over subscribed schools but generally you've got the pick of the bunch. My first choice school was completely out of catchment but we got a place. I then changed my mind due to a change of circumstances, and requested a place in our second choice School which we got. This school was also out of catchment. If I'd wanted my third place School (out of catchment) I would have got a place there also as they were undersubscribed. Maybe the people who make the flippant "well you had a choice" comments all live in the same town as me where there is choice aplenty. Or maybe the good folk of MN do in fact live on another planet.

In a given place, of course there is a limited "choice" of schools.
But parents have 2-3 years (for primary) and 10-11 years (for secondary) to change the place they live in. We live in a place with precisely 1 secondary school we would get into. Our choice was to let our DC go there, or move somewhere else well in advance of school choosing stage. We decided the school was good enough (not amazing) and opted to stay put.

Given I'd mentioned home ed in my op, I was thinking pengggwn had already read and considered what I'd said.

Yes. I did. You said you can't home educate. My point is that that is your problem, not the school's.

Maybe the people who make the flippant "well you had a choice" comments all live in the same town as me where there is choice aplenty

Well, we have a good choice of schools here for primary, but actually we would only have one for secondary. We live near the secondary school and it is not a great school. It’s not the worst in the country, but it’s not great. So we’ll either move before then (if we can) before our dcs reach secondary age, send them there anyway or if absolutely desperate, homeschool. I would homeschool anyway, if there were any serious issues with bullying or anything like that. But appreciate that’s not an option for everyone, and might not be for me either when the time comes.

It’s a choice. Not an easy choice, but a choice all the same.

Having said that, I know how dreadful the SN provision is, particularly in England, where we live. Forcing children into mainstream education when that clearly isn’t suitable is a travesty.

Children going to schools which “parents dislike parts of”? No, I can’t get myself into a huge lather over that personally. It would be lovely if everyone had their pick of fantastic schools. But that isn’t the case and isn’t likely to be. So, sadly, if choice of school is top priority, parents need to live in the catchment for the school they love.

There are generally options but that might include moving home and job.
More importantly perhaps is that in grammar areas like Kent, most children don’t get the choice at all and receive second class education with lesser resourcing and low aspiration.
Then there is parental influence to factor in. Research proves the greatest indicator of academic achievement has very little to do with the school. It is the parents attitude and involvement that are key to success. In London, the highly successful schools tend to have very high percentages of immigrant families who are driven to ensure a better life for their children. They understand education is key to this and support their children through school.
It tends to be the WWC where children are let down and not by the schools necessarily.

Within 90 minutes of where I live there is one school that can meet my child's needs. If we moved elsewhere there is no guarantee that he would get a place in a school that could meet his needs because we would be at the mercy of a different LA.
Alternatively there is a residential placement. Home schooling with his level need would be too difficult and would be detrimental in the long term for him.

If this is a TaT then the school the op has chosen is in the middle of a densely populated inner London area where there is a choice.

Most people surely don't have massive choice over where they live or whether they work or not so talking about moving or homeschooling isn't particularly helpful.

Why would me stating that on this forum, poster's replies tend to ignore reality for a significant portion of parents (that for whatever reason, they may not have the options that these posters are currently kicking them about instead of the actual issue being discussed) translate to; I think it's the schools fault that I can't move,home ed,change school. Please explain because I'd like to improve my writing for next time. This isn't what I meant at all.

And yes, education is the sum of its parts and that includes everyone involved in the process, so parent and child as well as whoever is teaching. Personally, I'd like every child to receive quality teaching regardless of the postcode or type of school but I don't think that our current system delivers this.