Me or childminder?

[Bbbbbbbb2017]

Oldest DD has has a rash for a week, looks like heat/allergy rash. Took her to gp yesterday to have a look who werent sure, they think most likely an allergy rash but also raised scabies as an alternative possibility but was very much a "long shot". Gave her a cream to help. I asked about younger ds and they said at this stage treatment was unnecessary.

Informed childminders about what the gp said (as they asked me to take her) and they seem to have heard scabies, ignored the likely allergy, done 2 + 2 and immediately banned DS from attending today until he also received treatment.

The gp were quite clear it was only a possibility and werent concerned enough to say to treat him or myself too.

Were the childminders being unreasonable for saying he cant go until i treat him? Im so frustrated with it all!

Scabies is pretty distinctive if you know what to look for - there's a trail leading away from the "dot" as the parasite burrows under the skin.

I got it at a hostel as a teen - was itchy as hell. Doctor didn't have a clue, however my Gran was a nurse who trained in a very poor part of Glasgow in the 50s and recognised it immediately and knew how to treat it.

Can you not just tell your CM a version of the truth? For example: "Our doctor thought that her rash was most likely an allergic reaction. However, to cover all the bases, he also gave her a cream to treat scabies just in case. I've been using it on DD since x date and time. Scabies is typically not contagious after 1-2 applications of the cream, though it can take up to 4 weeks for the rash to completely clear. Her doctor told us it would be safe to attend childcare tomorrow. See you at 8 am!"

If you google "scabies + contagious" you will see the medical sources that back up your claims on how infectious scabies is. If your CM protests your child's return to childcare, send her to the medical websites that back up your claim.

NotTaken - cms don't even have to have a written policy, let alone one checked by the LA.

I assume it is different in England.

In Northern Ireland my childminder had to adhere to a series of policies.

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I think you should be annoyed at your doctor, not your CM. You'd be furious if she took a chance on another child and yours was infected with scabies as a result, so you can't blame her for being cautious about a very infectious condition.

If it is an allergy or hives it should clear up very soon. If not, return to the doctor and get a more definitive diagnosis.

That doesn't look like scabies... it it possibly a sunburn from cream getting wiped off without realising?

Scabies is nasty, incredibly itchy and painful, it comes up in blisters and raw skin, I would think for scabies you would really know about it.

Frankly, would pay extra for a CM that was strict about bringing poorly or possibly contagious children!

You should be mad at your GP for mentioning it. Not your CM. Get a note from your GP saying it isn’t scabies/ contagious.

Next time don’t mention a word like scabies to your cm. Of course she will ban your DC after hearing that. You should just have told her what the most likely cause was.

I agree with trying Piriton - it doesn't look like scabies with those central bites or hives.

The provider must promote the good health of children attending the setting. They
must have a procedure, discussed with parents and/or carers, for responding to
children who are ill or infectious, take necessary steps to prevent the spread of
infection, and take appropriate action if children are ill.

So essentially it's up to the Cm to decide how she prevents the spread of infection. It's up to her to determine her own procedures.

It’s bit about ‘winning an argument’, it’s all the comments in this thread which profess to be The Law when the writers don’t know what they are talking about, aren’t childminders, and just spout rubbish because they think it should be true.

That doesnt look like scabies for one thing. Also - do you have dogs? Does the CM. That would be the source of infection and even then its hard to catch.

Look like flea bites actually or gnat bites

PS - the childminder was right - if scabies hadn't been ruled out by GP then she has to protect other children - shame you mention scabies - because that is NOT scabies.

*it’s not

NotTaken Our policies don't even have to be written down as long as we can explain them if asked (there are a couple of exceptions to this but IIRC that doesn't include exclusion!)

OP as a CM I categorically would not risk a child potentially having scabies being in my setting. I had a parent not give me the whole truth last week about a sickness bug their child had and if I had any other children here apart from my own I probably would have seriously considered terminating the contract had any of them fallen ill TBH. If a parent knowingly sent their child in with suspected scabies and it turned out to be actual scabies I would have to close my setting for at least a day to disinfect and clean everything.

Nottakenusername Those are minimum standards from 2013 and are certainly not for English childminders, whatever they may be to NI.
Nor do they prove your point so I’m not sure why you posted it.

Childminders, and other early years settings do have exclusion policies that they themselves write.

Most LAs now have had their funding so drastically cut that they struggle to support nurseries, let alone childminders. My own LA scrapped nearly the whole department, with just a handful of skeleton staff left to serve the entire Early Years across the whole county.
The above posters are right: contacting the LA is a complete waste of time, even if you get hold of anyone they’re unlikely to know what you’re talking about.

Still, look on the bright side. You all got your free 30 hours, didn’t you?

Am I right in thinking that the child with the rash is not the one the cm is minding? It’s his sister?

It’s ridiculous! So if she had chicken pox then the cm wouldn’t take the child as he’d been exposed to it, so he would effectively be without a childcare setting for 4 weeks?
What are working parents supposed to do in that situation?

Exposure to an illness doesn’t necessarily mean you will catch it.

(I don’t think it looks like scabies either - more like hives)

That doesn't look like scabies at all. Dd2 had it as a baby. One of the pictures on that link is my DD!!!!!! The doctor took a picture of her because she'd never seen it in a baby of 6 months before, and asked my permission to put it on the web.

We had to go back to the doctor 4 times over a 2 week period to get diagnosed, but as soon as we were, we had to treat everyone in the household asap, and deep clean the house.

It’s bit about ‘winning an argument’, it’s all the comments in this thread which profess to be The Law when the writers don’t know what they are talking about, aren’t childminders, and just spout rubbish because they think it should be true.

Would you like my Ofsted registration number? Not working at the moment due to circumstances but I'm still registered as a CM and have been since 2014.

It’s ridiculous! So if she had chicken pox then the cm wouldn’t take the child as he’d been exposed to it, so he would effectively be without a childcare setting for 4 weeks?

Chickenpox only becomes contagious 24-48hrs before spots appear. In a situation like that, which has happened in my setting, I would obviously exclude the child with pox. The other parents would be told there has been a case of chickenpox (but not which child) and they should monitor their DC for symptoms which are......, that if they do get it then they will be excluded until it's fully scabbed, and that if they have any concerns they should see a GP, etc (I used an email template for these sort of things). Usually when a sibling has chicken pox the parent keeps the other child(ren) home too anyway, if mum/dad/gran/friend is off work to provide alternative care then it makes sense to leave all of their children with that person. If the parent still wanted to send in the non-pox sibling then that's fine but I would be monitoring them for signs of infection and excluding at the first sign of illness as a precautionary measure.

Scabies on the other hand is incredibly contagious and I would exclude siblings in that situation as part of the treatment is treating the entire family. 24hrs after the first application of treatment they would be welcomed back.

mother you and I have the same point....

Tanith You sound really bitter about it all. Maybe you should change jobs? Cm like to moan and complain but at the end of the day it’s good money for not too much work from the comfort of your own home. Many cm also raise their own children alongside it.

If it was so terrible no one would do it. It’s much better than plenty of alternatives.

And you get paid for the 30 free hours so I don’t know why you wouldn’t be grateful for them too.

NotTaken

The money is not that good when offset against overheads and, like lots of self-employment, it can be unreliable and is dependent on getting the business in. There is no sick pay and no holiday pay and it lacks the security of employment. There are benefits like working from home, not needing to find childcare, etc but it's not the money fountain you make it sound like. I charge £4 an hour per child and my own children count towards my ratios so I need a minimum of two mindees at all times to even make NMW, by the time overheads are deducted it's less then NMW.

I dispute your statement that it's not too much work. It is a lot of fucking work. We don't just arse about with playdoh and paint all day, you know. We have to deliver the EYFS portion of the National Curriculum, this includes planning, observations, and progress tracking as well as record keeping, staying up to date with training, meeting all legal and Ofsted requirements then business admin, book keeping, accounts, advertising. I use to start work a good hour before any children arrived and didn't finish until around two hours after they all left again.

I didn't (and won't when I start working again) accept funded mindees as the rate paid by the local council is less than my hourly rate and why should I work at a loss? I'm not alone in this, many providers are offered less than their hourly rate by the council.

But MotherforkingShirtballs, if it is so terrible, why not put your own children in childcare and get a better job?

I love my job, earn decent money and get to pick up my own children from school. That doesn’t mean there aren’t downsides to the job, funded hours and parents being the worst of them.

YABU, the childminder has a duty to safe guard other children and herself from catching something potentially contagious