Aibu to think that receiving unsolicited advice is pretty normal for mothers?

[dolorsit]

There's an article on the BBC where a gay father is discussing the everyday sexism he gets for being a sahd.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-44718727
(sorry don't know how to do clicky links)

I agree that some of the stuff is sexist (and possibly homaphobic) eg naming everything for "mums and babies" which may be regional as in my northern town it was rare 10 years ago.

However I was struck by his description of what happened in baby massage class when his baby wouldn't stop crying. He was hoping for support but instead got a list of questions and an offer to hold the baby. He found this condescending but I thought it sounded pretty standard. I've had a similar experience and from the questions asked was shown how to rub my baby's tummy in case she was constipated and of course she stopped screaming as soon as someone else held her.

I've had unsolicited advice from all directions and I suspect that younger mums get it even more.

I read the article and thought he was an entitled,self absorbed show off. He seemed surprised that other parents didn't realise that he knew it all already.

Only the arrogant think that no one else could possibly have good advice and may even want to help. You know, that bit about it taking a village to raise a child, an' all.

But when you've got your baby via a surrogate in America,doubtless via another woman's ovum, you possibly aren't into sharing.

Completely agree with you OP. It's complete male privilege- he doesn't realise that all mums get irritating unasked for advice from all and sundry. What does he want- a medal for being a SAHD??

That was my first thought when I read it too.

So many mums post on here about unsolicited advice/comments/questions/people wanting to hold the baby it really really really isn’t just because you’re a man! It’s just par for the course.

It does sound like he expects negativity and homophobia so interprets everything through that expectation.

The names of groups are a valid point, “parent and baby” or just bloody “baby classes” would work for everyone. But if he turned up to the “Mum and baby” classes, would he really have been turned away?

I put a thread on chat about this too, and everyone felt like PPs.

It did surprise me the thing about names for baby activities.

My husband used to take the babies out he would get annoyed that the baby change was in the ladies.

He was also considered fantastic for doing the majority of toddler parties. Ok I admit that I thought he was fantastic for doing that too!

I’m a mum and I don’t appreciate unsolicited advice. I was disgusted at how the mums responded to that male parent, they sounded very cliquey and unkind. Personally I advice groups like those mums like the plague, I can’t think of anything more oppressive. I would never try to hold someone else’s baby either by asking or just taking (I’ve seen that done) although I would feel honoured if someone asks me if I’d like to hold their baby and give it a cuddle. That man’s baby is going to grow up into a far more broad minded individual than the offspring of the cliquey mums brigade.

I also thought that it was normal but the man in question didn't realise it was normal and will never realise because he can only experience it as a man. I still get it happen to me now but I genuinely don't think these people realise that their unsolicited "help" comes across as a criticism. I used to think it was because they saw something in me that said I was shit at doing my job as a parent, that used to hurt more than any sexism could.

Just read that article. Testy much?!
Some people seem to want it all RIGHT NOW! Like Verucca Salt.
Has anyone noticed that we have come so very far in the last couple of decades? Women lost their children, suffered abuse and died so we have the vote (1918) it was illegal to even be gay in this country until 1967 and same sex marriage came about in 2013.
WHY is it so difficult for a man to accept that it might take a little while to be accepted, unconditionally, as the main child carer?
Bloody hell! I’m all for families in all shapes and sizes, men, women, trans, gay, as long as love is there. But get a bloody grip here!

The only Mum and Baby classes I’ve seen have been exercise classes aimed at post-partum women. He mentioned yoga, if he has been trying to crash Mum and Baby yoga (which IME deals with things like pelvic floor recovery) I am not surprised he has got short shrift.

I recognise his description of the music class as Hartbeeps. We have two dads and a pair of grandparents in our class of eight. Hardly exclusionary.

Anyway I used to like sharing tips and war stories at baby classes - I found it was a great way to bond with other parents. I often asked for advice about things that I knew perfectly well how to do, just to see how other people did things. It was really interesting to hear other perspectives. He sounds very tense.

I was dismayed to find even children's songs are misandrous. Take the song Wheels on the Bus - while the gentle, caring mummies on the bus go "Shhhhh", the callous daddies go "What's that noise?"

Just reading whatever he likes into anything, isn't he? And ah, 'misandrous', it's like Guardian bingo. Good for a few k shares on social media at least, eh.

'The impatient, intolerant mums go 'Shhhh', while the concerned, adoring dads go 'What's that noise?'

Hunt out things to make you feel shit if you like mate but being bitter won't make you any more popular at the school gate...
SAHDs are not demonised, I get the impression they are rather worshipped. Of course men and dads face certain sexism. But couldn't they have got someone credible to write this.

Yes, that was my thought too. He wasn't being treated differently because he's a man; he was being treated just like all the other women. Perhaps that's different to what he's used to?

I agree with his dislike of the "Mum and baby" groups. How hard would it be to call them "Parent and baby" groups?

And I hate wheels on the bus - the grannies going "nag nag nag", and the women going "chatter chatter chatter" always wind me up.

I also noticed where he didn't like being put into the "mummy role".

I thought that at least people were asking before they made assumptions. Try being part of a hetero couple where the woman wants to be in the provider role - people don't even bother with the asking bit, they just jump straight to the assumptions!

Man gets treated like a woman and doesn’t like it!

My brother is a stay at home dad and he accepted some time ago that the default position from many women is that he is a career failure who does not know what he is doing so obviously needs all sorts of unsolicited advice on how to look after his two sons.

Yes, he's unaware that mothers are ALL always bombarded with advice.

All children are entitled to a mummy whether he 'likes being put into that role' or not.

I'm so glad to see this thread as I read that article last night and found it really annoying? Did he not think some of the women at the group might also hate the traditional words to Wheels on the Bus? Why didn't he say something and they could have had a chat, got to know each other, come up with their own words and then he would have had some familiar faces next time he went and he might have found the groups a bit more friendly.
Unfortunately, I expect he will encounter some surprise and some prejudice but he did seem to have a chip on his shoulder - a chip which could have been created with good reason from other experiences to date but still a chip.

I'm not even a mother and I found him incredibly irritating. Yes, he is being treated like a woman and doesn't like it.

Presumably up until now people have assumed he's all-knowing and he's been allowed to get on with his job without being told what to do... I bet he worked in a male-dominated industry.

Being gay and a father means he is incredibly special and unique!

Of course the other women and men in the groups he goes to should treat him as a special and highly valuable individual, he is more valuable than the rest of them put together!

/end sarcasm

Sorry, but he is determined to relate it all to homophobia, when it is much more simple, it relates to being a parent!

This bloke is a total doughnut

Also I'm not sure that drawing in breath and saying Oh is disapproving or homophobic. More likely to be simple surprise, since his family set up is uncommon. I think it's reasonable for people to be surprised when they come across something they have no experience of.

I disagree slightly. Assuming he isn’t exaggerating I can’t see that another woman would say to a mother with a crying baby ‘maybe I should hold her’. Unless you wanted to pop to the loo or something. I don’t think I’ve ever had unsolicited advice but I must have just been lucky!

In the versions of wheels in the bus I know the mummies either go “chatter chatter chatter” or “yakity yakity yak” .

He is quite self absorbed as if he is a cut above mothers what you described is perfectly natural and normal he probably saw it as clucking women.

The waitress was rude and sexist, that's for sure. Can't comment on the health visitors he saw but from experience you get some very lovely and some very judgemental. He could have had the latter or could have mistaken their embarrassment for their ignorance for homophobia.

Out here in the sticks the only mum and baby classes are post body and pelvic floor recovery ones. I can imagine for any SAHD that would be irritating.

It's hard to imagine a woman in the same situation being offered an idiot's guide to parenting or being asked to hand over her child to a total stranger

Why do we have no 'pissing self laughing' icon? A small amount of research using google or any parenting website would have corrected his ignorance there. I once was asked if i had considered teething when my baby, sobbed, drooled and i offered a teethy.