To wonder why people think working class rasicts are any issues

[Metoodear]

Speaking to dh today and haveing a conversation about race dh is white I am black and both agree that people focus to much on the daily mail type rasict tbh I am frankly not worried about them as they pretty much effect nothing

Now your middle class rasict who can effect my ability to get a job
Can effect my university admission
And is teaching my children in school (we know their is bias in education)
They can effect my health outcome

It’s not the people who rage on the comments section of the daily mail or chat about jobs being stolen on building sites it’s the ones who hide behind the veneer of Libralism but put the rasicsim in to active practice

To be a true rasict you need power on the whole poor whites have non and are only a smidge more respected than blacks in the U.K.

You had a point until the last paragraph.

YABU. The acutal meaning of racism is believing you are superior to others. Check the dictionary mentions nothing of power and I am Black woman telling you this.

“Working class racists” may not effect what you mention, but they can still effect you mentally and physically if they assault you if you live in their community. So to say they are not an issue is wrong as they would be committing hate crimes.

I have finally joined Mumsnet after reading this and I have to say that I have had more White people show me respect than Black people. How can we demand White people to respect us more when we as Black people don’t even show that amomgst ourselves? It really makes me sad and angry that black people seem to care more about things like the lack of diversity on love island rather than the 50 odd young people that have died due to gun and knife crime.

Tell me as a fellow Black parent how you are going to try and break this cycle? It is about time we do this.

All racism is bad, we should confront it no matter the social class.

Power has nothing to do with being a true racist. You are a "true racist" the second you feel superior than somebody else and discriminate against them based on their race.

Lower class racists may not teach your children , treat them in an hospital or affect their ability to get a job but can sure beat them up if they want to. They are as much of a nuisance as racists folks from other social class and potentially more dangerous because they have less to lose so are potentially more likely to be a threat/nuisance than someone higher up the "social scale".

In other words, racism should be fought on all front and no racist is better than the other.

@FissionChips exactly!

Working class people can be educators and influencers. Look at Tommy Robinson. I think you're confusing 'working class' with 'stupid'. I think you are right though in that very few people listen or take notice of Daily Mail type racist.

I have finally joined Mumsnet after reading this and I have to say that I have had more White people show me respect than Black people. How can we demand White people to respect us more when we as Black people don’t even show that amomgst ourselves? It really makes me sad and angry that black people seem to care more about things like the lack of diversity on love island rather than the 50 odd young people that have died due to gun and knife crime

There's always one - although not usually on MN🙄 this isn't Reddit or Quora

Eternal Life - People are people if you deserve respect you get it. Unless they are biased for a specific reason. If people YOU know don't respect you then ask yourself why. I can't imagine that you get more respect from white people. Why would you? People like you or they don't. Are you Special Black Woman so they're somehow in awe of you?

I have both black and white friends. I can't imagine we'd ever even have a conversation re "colour coded respect". Too ridiculous for words I think we'd all cringe..

How do you know what "black people" are worried about? If you believe we are one homogenous mass then you are culturally bereft and deluded that you are somehow the thought police.

There are numerous continental Africans. Numerous Diaspora Africans. But - you know what "black people think". Okay..

I wouldn't scorn anyone who is concerned about knife crime - they may have lost a family member or friend. Or not, actually. But there is nothing wrong with being concerned about violence. It's crass and insensitive to generalise in the way you have.

As if every black person is included in your "We". I've time for anybody who has time for me. Black, white, in between, whatever.

Culturally, now - where I'm from we support our fellow countryman/woman's shops and other businesses and initiatives, and we get that back likewise. We do that back home and when we move - eg to UK - we maintain that habit. It doesn't mean we don't shop elsewhere. But we know where 1st port of call is.

The rest of you sitting on the outside moaning don't do that. You can't, as you're so suspicious of each other you can't get off the ground. Then you start talking about "We". Every single time. Normally futilely on YT or FB.

Not all of us are in your brand of "We".

Anyway.

OP I agree with most of what you're saying about Liberal racists as I find them to be the most insidious kind. Especially where they believe they can't be seen;.

Doing "good works" abroad is an example - men who do that regularly aren't to be trusted. They are also surrounded by people who are just as complicit in that they turn a blind eye. But to all intents and purposes they are "liberal" in views aren't they? The so-called "good men" who would look down on others and yet, they are mistreating based on race. They likely do not even see themselves as racists.

Although there's a saying that white tears can lose you your job. True in some cases. I don't see that as a class thing - it's not impossible for a working class white person to do this if they are that way inclined.

Most people are inherently good. If they weren't, PoC couldn't survive here. The loud racists will always be there but I don't see them gaining any ground really they're just more open since Brexit.

In real life - not the virtual or media world that wants to set people at each others' throats - more of us get on than don't.

But whether liberal racist or any other type they can all attack you so I'm wary of racism in whatever form it takes and from whichever class

Racism is a seed that grows. It doesn’t matter where it grows from; the plant is always a noxious weed. A racist doesn’t always need power to be effective - just a platform, and a loud voice. In today’s society, you don’t even need to leave home for those. Next?

I'm old enough to remember the 70s. Skinheads were very obvious, very violent and there were a lot where I lived. It made being friends with POC frightening, going out with a boyfriend who wasn't white even more so. There were lots (and still are a couple) of pubs you didn't go into. People got hurt.

But yes, racism shows up in different ways and affects people differently. It's all shitty.

Hi MisstressDeeCee

I am well aware this is not Reddit or Quora. Been a long tume lurker on feminism chat and AIBU and now have decided to join.

Yes you are right. Respect is due when deserved. As for special Black Woman? Lol no I do not think that. I’m grown enough to know not everyone in the world is going to like me.

Colour coded respect sounds silly indeed but it reminded of an episode of Black-ish when Dre would give a nod to any other black man he saw as some kind of respect so it kind of exists but maybe mostly in the US I guess.

How do i know what Black people are worried about? Its all over twitter, facebook and youtube. Whenever something happens, it explodes onto social media.

I’ve haven’t scorned anyone. It is something my family has experinced and that is why I am passionate about it gets me when black people do not have the same level of out cry for this.

Your culture sounds like dream. If the culture here in the UK was like that, we would be able to tackle certain issues better without people rolling their eyes and saying your using the race card.

You talk about me generalising when you have done the same. Yes I’m moaning because it is not being done ENOUGH where I live. Now don’t assume my life and what I’m doing and I won’t with you.

Yes it as WE because out side of your community, there are other people who view us as one homogonous group and not in nice ways. Its crazy how one persons action can make someone think we are all the same when clearly we are not.

You don’t have to be on the “we” if you don’t want to not forcing anyone to do anything and definately policing anyones thoughts.

Racsim is a big issue and should always be challenged regardless of class.

You are right op that middle class racism goes unchecked. It is excused, covered up and s lot of the time not even recognised. It is a disgrace how many people I know (especially of a slightly older generation) who will come out with appalling statements.

However, don’t underestimate the power of the working class white racist. It is these people start movements like the nazi party that given the correct situation can accelerate and grow to dangerous levels. It has already caused Brexit. Regardless, of whether anyone supports it or not The overwhelming reason people voted leave was immigrants. Many may deny that their sentiments were racist but at the end of the day they are blaming foreigners for the wrongs they face. In fact it is true government who have consistently failed to invest in education, health, welfare cuts and anything to help disenfranchised communities. Not helped by continual ficis on government investment on the south of England whilst the rest of the country rots.

I have to say that I have had more White people show me respect than Black people.

Can you expand on this please?

*NOT policing anyones thoughts.

The overwhelming reason people voted leave was immigrants

there were many reasons people voted leave. Some vote 'because of the immigrants', but many others had different issues which caused them to vote Leave.

Sadly powerless racists can vote (as well as being able to speak and hit).

NasdaqYouTwat - Yes gladly.

My hair was randomly pulled to see if it was real, constant dirty looks for no reason walking down the street minding my own buisness also when being out with partner who is white, getting rude responses when asking a question (in an adult voice), being called yellow, fruit cake in nasty ways because I’m ”light skinned”, had a guy run past and say to an ex and myself that he’s ugly and I should be with him... just to name a few. All from fellow black people.

Yes alot of it is also common decency not just respect but that has been my life experience so far and it is what I have noticed. Of course, I have met some lovely black people as well. Obviously I know regardless of race, anyone can do this and have that behaviour. Its just that in my experience, it has been more from black people.

And before anyone assumes so, I don’t walk out my house and demand respect from everyone. I just want to get from A to B like most people.

I would love to hear a response from the OP.

@Meetoodear

First of all I completely agree that we shouldn't under estimate the damage caused by poor white racists.

However poor white racists serve as a useful tool to mask more insidious institutional racism "look at those people there, that's racism". It is also of massive benefit to those in power to have those without it all fighting among themselves.

I agree with you op, even though I don’t think working class racism is harmless.

I think it’s probably because middle class people are smarter than working class people (not true) and that there are less middle class racists than working class racists (also not true).

Most ethnically mixed families are from working class backgrounds and working class people are more likely to live in ethnically diverse areas no matter what race they are.

Unfortunately, because working class areas are more mixed, racism is more visible in those areas.

EternalLife90
Always one filled with selfhatred, how can you’ve been shown more respect by whites such a ridiculous thing to say, then going on about knife crimes being our problem.
Does that make other crimes a white issue?
Your first lacks self respect.

I've always thought the DM was pretty middle class. Am I a total pleb? What does this make Sun readers?

Oh yes and I’m sure most black or white Mother’s dont spend a lot of time thinking about Love Island, maybe you should turn of the TV and work on your self esteem.

Also, I think middle class racists are more likely to use soft racist methods such as not inviting you to the party. Or say ambiguous things that people or mumsnet, for example, would defend by saying ‘they’re not necessarily racist, maybe they just don’t like you’.

It happens to be the same methods they use to exclude working class people too.

I think you are right though in that very few people listen or take notice of Daily Mail type racist.
if only!!!!
Very few people in my lefty liberal echo chamber do, but a hell of a lot of people read the Mail and take it's contents as gospel. They, in their millions, take each other very seriously indeed.

Working class racism doesn't cause any harm? Tell that to Steven Lawrence's family