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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that when people say ask for help if you feel your mental health is poor they don’t mean it?

60 replies

Bizarretortoise · 04/07/2018 22:29

Just that, really? Or they mean ‘you should ask for help, but don’t ask me’.
Been having a hard time recently, feeling in need of some support, and just that. I’ve tried speaking to a few close friends and family and they don’t want to know. Fortunately, I can afford to go to a therapist instead, but I’ve been really shocked at how people just palm it off (but are equally happy to post MHA ‘ask fir help’ memes).

OP posts:
mydogmymate · 05/07/2018 11:14

I really understand where you're coming from op. I've had depression for years & nobody is interested, so I've become a bit isolated. The day before yesterday I felt suicidal so I phoned the local mh team ( who I see every 3 months) and was fobbed off & told someone would get back to me. No one did. Even my niece said have you still got depression? I thought you'd be better by now Confused

I can't look at the shit that's posted on Facebook, the reality is that there is still a stigma attached to it. Unless you've suffered from it then it's difficult to understand.

So all those who jump on the bandwagon: fuck off! Either follow it through or shut the fuck up!!

MargaretCavendish · 05/07/2018 11:20

With the best will in the world, any one with an illness, physical or mental, is prone to talking endlessly about their own problems, ailments and conditions to the exclusion of other people. If you are that captive audience, repeatedly, then it becomes emotionally draining.

Yes, I completely agree - and I'm thinking here about how I was when I had a really bad depressive episode. I was pretty self-centred, and I can now see that conversations with me were repetitive and frustrating for other people - from their perspective I was refusing to help myself. At the time I felt so hurt by some of the people I felt had let me down, but looking back I was asking too much, and actually I think I was very fortunate my marriage survived as it took so, so much out of DH.

goingonabearhunt1 · 05/07/2018 11:27

I don't think ppl understand things that don't get better and that may never get better (as in, all you can do is learn to 'manage' them). So a lot of MH issues and chronic conditions; unless they themselves have experienced it or seen it up close they sort of think it'll just go away somehow or that there must be some 'cure'. I have a couple of family members with chronic conditions and they have lost friends/relationships because of it.

And as pp have pointed out, trying to take on someone's MH problems can be a bad idea if you take on too much and you don't have the experience to help in the right way.

goingonabearhunt1 · 05/07/2018 11:27

Btw I agree the memes can be very insincere!

ToothTrauma · 05/07/2018 11:29

So true. I also find that people say ‘oh you just take time for yourself and if going to events is too much then don’t go, everyone will understand’ but what they actually mean is ‘come to MY event, don’t go to anyone else’s’ and then get in a miff when you can’t make yourself leave the house.

I do try to remember that friends and family are not MH professionals and they don’t know how to deal with it anymore than I do, but it still hurts.

Thinksthinksthinks · 05/07/2018 11:30

So much of Facebook is insincere - the positive you can take ka that it’s a barometer of how that sector of society thinks ‘Facebook users’ and there is no longer a stigma to having mh problems, according to the memes.

TheHulksPurplePanties · 05/07/2018 11:30

With the best will in the world, any one with an illness, physical or mental, is prone to talking endlessly about their own problems, ailments and conditions to the exclusion of other people. If you are that captive audience, repeatedly, then it becomes emotionally draining.

Absolutely. Fear of doing this is why I tend to withdraw during episodes. I don't want to bore people.

BarbarianMum · 05/07/2018 11:37

I think this is very true. For a long time I certainly viewed depression as a temporary condition (because this was my experience) and something that you got better from. It was only much later in life that I became aware of people for whom it was a chronic problem.

And YY to Facebook being the home of insincerity. It's just a medium people use to project an image of themselves/lives as far as I can see. Verylittle connection with reality.

Sirzy · 05/07/2018 11:40

I think when the shit hits the fan you realise who is there for you and how much you can rely on them.

I have two people who i genuinely know I could call on any time day or night and will “share the load” - and for both of them I do the same.

Other people I know are fine for the coffee and chat but not for anything too heavy.

Others I have realised are a waste of space so have gradually removed myself from them!

Nikephorus · 05/07/2018 11:45

Sometimes the people you most expect to understand are the ones who retreat, and the ones who you don't expect to understand are the best help of all.
I admit that I'm probably not the best at being emotionally supportive - I do try but I struggle to find the right words and then panic that I'm getting it all wrong (the joy of autism) so I end up offering practical solutions where possible when maybe people just want me to say 'how terrible, tell me more'. The ironic thing is that my mum does exactly the same and it drives me crazy!
I rarely ask for help. It's easier!

DeckSofa · 05/07/2018 12:09

A lot of people think "helping" is about suggesting "solutions" but soon become irritated if the sufferer can't make use of them. "Just think positive" and "you've got nothing to be depressed about" won't help clinical depression, for example.

"Helping" is believing what the person says, not belittling their feelings, and not recoiling in horror at how bad it is for them (if you feel horrified, and are able to walk away, what do you think the unwell person feels like to be living through it 24/7?)

Verbena87 · 05/07/2018 12:22

I think people are just really unprepared for the reality of mental illness.

Again, this. I’d never ‘advertise’ my listening/caring skills on social media - I hope I’m a reasonably compassionate listener and am able to acknowledge people rather than thinking a cuppa and a command to ‘chin up’, but I’ve also experienced trying to support someone through psychosis and severe mental illness and I would never try and do it again because it ended in being threatened, loved ones experiencing violence, and my own mental health being seriously damaged. I don’t think people saying “I’m always here/I’ll support you through anything” have had the misfortune to see loved ones going through serious mental illness.

On the other hand, I really think holding space for your loneliness/worries is not that hard and folks should step up. Flowers

BarbarianMum · 05/07/2018 12:24

Is that "helping" though? I did this for a long time for a friend of mine who was depressed. It might have given her momentary relief but what actually helped her was 1) Seeing a new GP 2) Getting the right referral 3) Getting the right diagnosis (bipolar) 4) Getting a new drugs regime 5) Proper support from the local mental health team. At best I was a sticking plaster but I don't even think I was that mopst of the time. Now she's getting the right treatment and is generally better (by no means cured obv) our friendship has a more normal pattern and when she needs to offload I can be some actual help by lending a sympathetic ear. Before, when she was in crisis, I honestly believe I was no help at all.

MargaretCavendish · 05/07/2018 12:39

Now she's getting the right treatment and is generally better (by no means cured obv) our friendship has a more normal pattern and when she needs to offload I can be some actual help by lending a sympathetic ear. Before, when she was in crisis, I honestly believe I was no help at all.

I completely agree - and it was in no way your fault that you couldn't offer more concrete help to a person in crisis, it was just too much. Again, when I was ill I thought 'why can't people just make the time to have a chat with me?' - but looking back it was never 'a chat', I had a bottomless need for reassurance and a desperation not to be left alone (I was scared I'd hurt myself) that no one could satisfy but that exhausted and drained them. Talking about it couldn't make it go away - medication and counselling did, eventually. But I permanently damaged some friendships first.

Racecardriver · 05/07/2018 12:40

I think that it depends on who is saying it. I don't offer help unless I mean it.

taxicum · 05/07/2018 13:09

Listen, I don't know you but here's my input for what its worth.

I think you are wrong.

Most people will make an effort and try to help anyone if they think that will be accepted but unless you are specific and specify what you want from people they will assess and try and help in the way they think is 'best' for you in that moment. That can take the shape of changing the subject, one upping, trying to find solutions to your problems, minimising, comparing your situation to others they know, staying away from you because they feel they are 'enabling' you etc

It's really good you are having therapy OP because it means you have the opportunity now to focus on allowing the relationships with your friends and family to be what they need to be. It also sounds like therapy alone is not enough.

There are lots of other things to explore to support your therapy. A friend is doing the AA 12 steps (not for alcohol but out of curiosity for a relatively innocuous pattern of thought they want rid of) they have found it life changing! I found yoga and NVC (non violent communication) really key in supporting me and getting the most out of my six years of therapy.

I'm telling you this for illustrative purposes. My husband is in a situation at work where a close long term colleague is very depressed, he refuses to take medication (fine) or do anything at all to take any responsibility for the place he is in or help himself. He is his own worst enemy and there is always an excuse, I'm just this way, I can't do anything about it, I can't change things because x,y,z, I've had/have a hard horrible life. He's seen and sees a number of therapists but that never works out. When he gets to the point with his therapist where it's uncomfortable, ie, he has built trust and is pinpointing and addressing the work that he needs to do or if he's told something that's hard for him to hear, he just leaves.

He trys to talk about his problems to anyone he comes in contact with at work who will listen. He has effectively made himself unreachable and obviously this affects my husbands work life. After being very patient initially, (this has been going on for a number of years) my husband has decided not to be around him if he doesn't feel like it and to sternly call him out about his observed behaviour, specifying why it is insufferable for him.

There have been times my husband has tried to inject possitive energy in a generous way, asking him out after work or simply saying brightly, "Hi X, good weather predicted today, how was your weekend?" and he's responded "Shit" and walked off. He's basically built a pattern now of leaning on others to listen which is pointless because their listening is often begrudging doesn't actually touch the problem. I'm glad my husband is sensible enough not to feel guilty or accept responsibility.

Friends and family have their own problems and basically using them to listen to you and seeing that as an attempt to seek help is nonsense. That is not seeking help.

'Seeking help' is often a phrase we hear and drag others into immediately when we are depressed. This is a red herring because we immediately think about people we already know. "Who can/why wont they help me???"

Actually, the true meaning of seeking help is discovering and learning what tools you can have at your disposal and how you can call on and use these tools effectively when you need to, so you can help yourself.

While other people might be showing you tools and how to use them, people themselves aren't the actual tools. Treating people like they are the tools is simply using others to support your own narrative to yourself.

WitsEnd2018 · 05/07/2018 13:16

Hi OP, I'm sorry to hear that you are having a difficult time at the moment.

I think it boils down to people being busy with their own lives, most people are well meaning I think but perhaps don't know what to do or say? It's also worth you considering that perhaps they are going through their own stuff that you are not aware of? Lots of people wear a mask.

Obviously I don't know you, but could it be that they feel you are being too demanding?, Do you offer support to the people around you if they are going through a tough time? Are you a giver or a taker?

If you are experiencing mental health difficulties then you should speak to your GP and perhaps a counsellor? This will give you a safe space in which you can talk through your concerns confidentially. All the best!

RayRayBidet · 05/07/2018 13:32

I used to manage someone at work with chronic mh problems - PTSD, panic attacks and depression.
I was made redundant and we are still in touch and good friends.
Sometimes all you have to do is be there.
I used to sit in a quiet office with her when she was having a panic attack. I was just there and held her hand and talked quietly while we waited for it to pass.
Another time she was off work and wasn't looking after herself so I went round and did her washing up and made her have a shower and eat something.
Another time she came to work and told me she wanted to die so I called the GP surgery and insisted they see her straight away and then drove her there.
She can be very frustrating when she is in a trough and does seem self centred but that is her illness.
I love her to bits, she is from the middle East and had a really difficult life before she came to the UK. She has no family near and yet she manages to hold down a job and actually she is really good at it. She is one of the kindest, most generous people I know and an amazing cook.
We decided to adopt each other as sisters.
I don't give advice unless asked but I will be with her and try to distract her when she is feeling bad.
I have moved away from the UK now but she comes to stay and we have a lovely time mostly cooking and eating and gossiping. She loves my kids and I miss her so much.
You don't have to have all the answers to be able to help. Just be there and show you care.

Rockandrollwithit · 05/07/2018 13:40

@RayRayBidet

What a lovely post, it sounds like you have built a wonderful friendship.

GarfEatsYellowFood · 05/07/2018 13:43

@mydogmymate I really hope you're feeling better today Flowers

mydogmymate · 05/07/2018 13:54

Garf. Thank you for asking. I'm feeling a bit better today, but it's an uphill struggle Thanks

Lottapianos · 05/07/2018 14:05

'That's because majority of people couldn't give a fuck about listening to other pile problems as they're too keen to share their own. Sounds flipant, but I'm Serious. '

I know you are, and I agree with you. I think a lot of people like to think that they are great listeners and terrific friends, but very very few people are actually able to make real space for others. The people who can really do this, listen without offering solutions, or minimising, or trivialising, or offering 'at least....' instead of actual empathy (my personal hate!) are like gold dust. As another poster said, it's only people who have suffered similar troubles in their own lives who really get it.

I think a lot of people like to play the hero and imagine that a few platitudes and a 'there there' will have the other person feeling right as rain in no time. The reality, as others have pointed out, is a lot more messy, tedious, challenging and complicated than that.

Lottapianos · 05/07/2018 14:06

'We decided to adopt each other as sisters. '

That's lovely Smile I can feel how much you love her from your post. You're lucky to have each other

RayRayBidet · 05/07/2018 15:00

@Rockandrollwithit
Thank you Wink
What I'm trying to say is that you don't have to solve the problem. You just need to listen and maybe a bit of practical help now and then.

RayRayBidet · 05/07/2018 15:02

@Lottapianos thank you, she is the sister I would choose.

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