To ask you how to be more assertive with my in laws/life in general

[Flyawaypeterflyawaypaul]

Name change for this.
When I had my ds, my in laws became very overbearing, think handing out unsolicited advice over and over, ignoring my wishes about visiting, turning up unannounced, staying for hours, trying to sabotage my breastfeeding, which failed miserably as I couldn’t get them out of the house/to put my ds down.
I’m pregnant again and I don’t want this to happen.
What I have learned about myself is that instead of facing things head on when people are disrespectful of my wishes, I say nothing and then seethe quietly, and I know this really isn’t helpful. I do it at work, and with friends. I do think that people have more respect for you in general if you stand up for yourself. But I seem to be a bit of a pushover. As my in laws have got away with it for so long, they just do as they please, or if I try to put a rule in place/tell them how something is going to be, they kick up a fuss with my dp.

I know that a lot of people are going to reply and say I have a dp problem not an in law problem. But what I have figured is that I can’t change my dps behaviour, I can’t change my in laws, I can only change my own.

I feel like during pregnancy/post natal period, the woman who has given birth wishes should be paramount and I don’t want to be in a position where they get all their own way again. So for those of you who manage to assert yourselves and get what you want (when it matters I don’t mean I should have my own way all of the time), how do you go about it?
I don’t want to fall out with anyone, they are dps parents and he loves them dearly, but I know that they will become more interfering when this baby is born and I can’t face dealing with it again.

Op you have been put into an awful position. If your in laws sulk then perhaps they are not the most reasonable people to deal with.

In terms of being assertive you have to let dh you have a mental line that won't be crossed this time, how upset you're last time and your not going through that again. You won't put yourself at risk.

Explain to him you will be asking your in laws nicely, not to do x y and z, you expect back up. That if they won't listen to your nice requests, if he can't step in to diplomatically hold the library, then you can't be held responsible for any fall out

Hold the line!!

In general, think of the most common situation (home, work, whatever) that bothers you and where you want to be more assertive. Play it through in your head and have a few choice replies ready. The good folk here are always creative if you need suggestions. Then practice those replies in front of a mirror out loud. You will feel really daft doing it, but saying out loud really helps somehow.

Once you’ve done it “live”, then keep pick another situation and do the same. After a while you’ll find you’re doing it naturally. The sweaty palms and shaky stomach feeling take a bit longer to go, but the feeling of taking control and doing it outweighs the nerves!

I think you're right, you have to start on yourself. Here is a link to a blog on how to be more assertive, it's from the British CBT & Counselling Service.

Assertiveness needs to be practised, so you are doing the right thing starting now, rather than waiting until you have given birth. Maybe you could try writing down how you would like things to be, post-birth, so you have it clear in your head, then work out some phrases you can try out beforehand, so that you are used to saying them and they won't seem so hard.
So, maybe, a response to unhelpful advice could be, thanks MIL, I'll remember that. Then ignore advice :).
If they visit for too long, you could say, It's been nice seeing you, you have to go now as I have to (add in a reason of your own here).
Rehearsing lines like this makes it easier for you to say them in real life.
Also rehearse a Death Stare :) That's fro your DP if he doesn't have your back!

Lock the door if they try come over unannounced. Just say no, don’t expand on that & take the baby off them when feeds are needed.
Just repeat “My baby needs feeding” if they don’t then they’re not welcome.

OP you can stand up to them, get your DH onside, mother & baby trump in laws.

So your in-laws made your life hell and your DP did nothing about it? I'm a very very assertive person but I couldn't do anything about my in laws until my DH woke up and saw the problem and started to back me up - until then everyone just ignored me and I was fighting a totally losing battle.

Sorry but if you're post partum and the one person who is supposed to be supporting you (your DP) isn't, then you're fucked.

I went low contact, especially for how they behaved when DC1 was born, but their behaviour before that was awful too. I didn't explain why, but they probably have an idea. It was helped by the fact that all their arrangements are last minute, which meant when they would invite us over we would have other plans.

The other thing was that I had moved hundreds of miles to be with DH and given up a good career to do so. I had short term contracts with a few weeks here and there between but pretty constant. EVERYTIME I saw SIL she would ask me if I'd found a job yet. I would explain and her and BIL would visibly eye roll. I stopped explaining and made a joke out of it. Like 'no I'm not working but it's great that employer X puts money in my account monthly' or 'SIL, are we still having this conversation?'

DH claimed not to notice the digs as he generally wasn't in ear shot. So, I took to calling him over. 'DH, SIL says I'm still not working/spoiling DS/etc can you explain?' Then he couldn't be in denial. He did pass it off as that's just how they are/they don't mean anything. I made the point that I was unhappy with their rudeness and wasn't prepared to tolerate it and that was just how I was, so what did he want to do? He could speak to them or I would.

It took a while, but we now have a more balanced relationship which works well. You do need to have a talk with DH and see where he stands.

When we told mil I was pregnant she said oh accidents happen!! Then when dp was out of ear shot told me how his ex gf wanted dc with him but sadly he wasn't having any of it!!
And she wondered why she was uninvited from the wedding!!
Practice saying out loud the responses you want to say.
The words will free flow soon enough!!

We thought that we'd have a similar experience second time around. Turns out she couldn't have been less interested.
She bullied me for months about different things in the end I had a breakdown, ended up on serious meds and I'm only just on speaking terms with her now over 2 years later. I avoid her when I can.

I made the point that I was unhappy with their rudeness and wasn't prepared to tolerate it and that was just how I was, so what did he want to do? He could speak to them or I would.

Excellent, Oraiste.

OP, it seems you have written off DH as someone who won't back you up which is sad. Yes, you can change the way you react to things but he needs to speak up for you too. I would refuse to have anything to do with in laws if DH didn't stand up for me.

Thanks some really good advice on here.
It is very tricky with inlaws as I do have to maintain a good relationship with them. But I just need a way to be able to shut them down when they start going on about things or insisting on their own way.
Any suggestions of generic phrases I can use when they start with advice offering/pushing boundaries would be really helpful.

Spaghetti I see what you mean, but I’ve given up a bit on dh standing up to them, recently he has started recognise their behaviour as controlling/interfering, but as yet he won’t make a point and say something when they cross the line.
He thinks it would just be more helpful if we moved to a different area so he wouldn’t have to confront them, but it would make the distance bigger so reduce their access and ability to interfere with our lives. At the moment they live less than ten minutes away in the car, and both are retired, in their sixties, and very fit, so I think they see our family as a way to fill their time/a role in their life. But this is frustrating for us as I feel like saying you have had your turn, stop concerning yourselves with decisions that aren’t yours to make But of course being this blunt would cause ructions. So I need to try I and just use assertive phrases when they do push the boundaries. And maybe look into dps idea of moving to a different area to put a bit of distance between us.

Interesting that he would rather move!!

Very dramatic step. And he would rather do that than simply be diplomatic and smooth things over.

Op another way to look at it... They have to maintain good relations with you also, you have the gold.
Can your own patents be there too support you?

Say now, I was too exhausted last time with visitors so we are putting visiting hours in place, we couldn't get bf established, medics have said we must have space.

Etc. But do it now to manage expectations.

Raynedance it’s a good idea to say this to them. The problem I tend to have is they belittle me or ignore any rule that’s made.
So for instance when ds was born I said no visitors when we get back from hospital for a few days, I’d had them sat around my bed for hours on the postnatal unit (These maternity wards with open visiting don’t always do women a favour but that’s a whole other thread).
Fil told me not ‘be be so silly’. Dh heard and said nothing. As you’ve gathered I have no assertive skills and was hormonal and vulnerable after giving birth, so I said nothing.

Or they will accept what I have told them to my face, then ignore it and come round anyway. They are clever about this, for example after ds was born we asked for one day on our own, they turned up anway with a card one of their neighbours had sent to us, so said they were just popping by to drop our card off. So they make it seem like they are doing us the favour, and it took dp a long time to see that they were being manipulative.

They also help with childcare for ds 1-2 days per week while I work, which is a huge help and they are more than happy to do this (before I get a flaming for using them for free childcare). But I feel like Because they provide free childcare, it shouldn’t give them rights to interfere so much. I’m at the point where I would rather pay the nursery fees than put up with this.

Practice saying a few stock phrases out loud as well. Hear yourself same them over and over again.
Thanks, but that's not convenient.
That doesn't work for me.
No thanks, maybe another time.
I have a lot on so I can't do that.
I need to get on now.
I'm tired and I need to rest - please leave and I'll see you soon.

I can't stress enough how much actually practicing these phrases out loud helps.

So I suppose I need to make some ground rules now. Then know how to be able to assertively make sure they don’t undermine me when I have made my expectations clear.
I don’t want to rely on dp for back up. As whilst he’s wonderful In every other way, i know he will let me down when it comes to this. I need to be able to do this on my own for myself and my dc.

What’s also odd about dp is that while I’ve been clear I’m a pushover, he wouldn’t take any shit in any other area of his life. It’s bizarre but when it comes to his parents he reverts to being a child with them in charge.

That's so rude of them just turning up with the excuse of the card! I would just keep repeating your wishes while maintaining a hard stare, lots of eye contact e.g we won't be having visitors for a few days after baby comes, I want to establish feeding. Cue moan moan, I want to establish feeding, I said I want to establish feeding, I want to.... you get the point! It'll feel awkward of course but they will get used to it eventually if you hold your own. Don't be drawn into them trying to put you down or convince you otherwise, repeat repeat, good luck!

I used to leave the door locked so they couldn't walk in.
I used caller ID and stopped answering the phone when I did not want to speak to them.
But I think the biggest tip I can give is to stop giving reasons why you are saying no as it only gives them chance to argue back. So whenever they kept pushing for something I just kept repeating the same vague phrase.

• Can this happen?

No I'm sorry that's not convenient.

• But it wouldn't hurt - why not?

Thanks but that's not convenient.

• But Spandex we really want this to happen.

Thanks, but as I've said, it's not convenient.

It sounds as if you were able to put guidelines in place, but they felt free to ignore them.
So you need tactics for reasserting your wishes after they have ignored you.
As others have said it is worth practicing phrases that might work for you.
How about
‘baby and I need rest and privacy to allow feeding to work - I’m sure you will agree that is best for baby’.
If they belittle you, you need to make it clear that in your opinion they are being unreasonable. Maybe you could politely point out that they have overstepped the mark and need to back off. Unless your dp starts seeing that this is not acceptable to you at the time it happens, he won’t know that he needs to intervene and distract his parents away from pestering you.

I know sunshine it is rude and it’s the manipulation as well because they do it in a way to make it seem as though they are being reasonable “mrs x next door has sent This card for you and the baby, we wanted to to have it today”.

Thanks spandex, good advice. I can see this is going to be draining. Looking back at my pregnancy with ds it started before he even arrived. mil was repeatedly asking to go to one of my scans, she thought it was her right to attend in place of dp, when unfortunately he couldn’t get the time off for my 20 week scan. when she was repeatedly told no she actually turned up the morning of the scan asking again could she come. I did say no (proud of myself for that one). But this is just an example of how persistent they are in getting their own way and will stop at nothing to make sure that they do.

A close mutual friend of ours has offered to have a word with dp, and tell him that the stress of worrying about them won’t be good for me. I may take her up on it yet.

Will she still be having your dc while you are on maternity?
Imo gps who provide childcare DO see it as a right to interfere, like since you trust them on x/y day then they are up there with the dps!!
Back down to earth and visitors only it need to be - reclaim your dc and get those boundaries up.
Get dh on it ASAP.

Do you need to use them for child care? That muddys the water a little, as even if you set boundaries there will be mixed messages. MIL seems to want to be very involved. Is she like this with her other children, if there are any?

Interesting your DH would rather move away. Mine has said similar or declared we would go NC rather than address the issue. I pointed out that would be something else I'd get the blame for, so unless he was prepared to talk to them about why he felt the need to NC rather than support his wife in a few areas he could explain it. I think for me the bottom line was that they meant well but because I was younger, from a different cultural background that it was tricky.

You need clear communication with DH that they have overstepped but tread carefully if you need the childcare. It's not put up and shut up but if they are usually OK and you want to maintain this connection, then you may need to pick your battles.

I used to have a massive MIL problem OP, with many of the same problems you've described, ie telling them NOT to come to the maternity ward until after DH had called them. They turned up anyway, 3 hours after a gruelling C section, but I was lucky in that I put my foot down, told DH they weren't coming in and he backed me up.

It took an almighty row with MIL a few months later to stop her treating me like a pushover. Like you, I hate confrontation, but she pushed me to the edge and I let her have it, 10 years of anger and pent up frustration. I went extremely NC and now only bother with them when I absolutely have to.

She's good as good now, because she's realised that if her DIL doesn't want to see her, she'll automatically see a lot less of her gc.

The trade off is that you cannot ask them for any favours at all. No childcare, no help around the house, no more holidays with them, etc. Favours mean you end up beholden to them and it gets very difficult to say no because you 'owe' them. Definitely start paying for childcare.

Moving house is also a great idea - new home, new boundaries, new rules. And I suspect your DH knows things need to be sorted, since he suggested it. Moving is his way of dealing with it without actually having to address the source of the problem, ie THEM. Mine was exactly the same!

*LC not NC!