To not disagree that IVF should be further restricted to save money

[Banana8080]

NHS England is considering reducing IVF offer guidelines, some areas offer 3 cycles (the current recommendation), while others offer none.

Current age limit is 40 years, strict BMI and trying to conceive for at least two years.

While infertility can be devastating, I myself have just had treatment (private) followed by a mc, it’s not critical/life saving. I’m sad but I left it late (37) even though I knew the risks.

Am I being unreasonable to say it’s ok for NHS to review guidelines, maybe reduce upper age to 35, one cycle etc. And this money goes to critical care - cancer, more nurses etc etc

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jun/29/ivf-cycles-restricted-england-nhs-advisers-ignored

I'm more than happy to pay my taxes

But we can't pick and choose what our money goes towards.

Ivf should be funded, equally in every area. Possibly 2 rounds.
I do think an age limit of lower than 40 makes more sense. But bearing in mind you have to ttc for 3yrs if unexplained infertility (younger women) it isnt as easy as saying you should be under say 35 as that would be starting to ttc either 32/33 and also you have the wait for treatment too. It took us a yr from referral to treatment and that was without a waiting list.

SugarIsAmazing Yes let’s stop helping fat people and smokers, their choice to be fat and smoke right?

Mrsjones17 I agree 100% with you. I don’t believe the OP when she says she’s had fertility treatment. No one who’s gone through the pain of infertility would speak such shit. X

It should be made consistent, it isn't fair that your postcode determines whether you have 3 goes or none! Also perhaps fairer application of the criteria; but as it is so expensive privately doesn't seem fair to remove it completely.

@BoxsetsAndPopcorn you’re speaking shite

Most of the treatments suggested are female specific what a fucking suprise

I think as women we need to put our foot down and not accept the treatment we get during pg/labour and postnatal as it is awful.

I think actually if age wasnt an issue then a bmi of 25 or under should be what they are looking for. And men's weight too.
Because ivf works they seem to not want to fully investigate especially mens issues.

Mrsjones17

Best of luck x

abbsisspartacus I said the same to my husband this morning when I read the piece. Particularly concerning heavy menstruation, I was shocked but not surprised sadly when I think of friends who talk about how long it took for them to be diagnosed with endometriosis, and how they had to battle to get GPs to see it as more than 'just' painful periods.

@WaggyMama What I meant was I'm happy that my taxes goes towards IVF. I know we can't choose what they go towards, but with some of the shit I see taxpayers money wasted on, IVF isn't one of them, imo

Anyone else remember George best? Had a liver transplant I remember going nuts about it because he was a drinker and I didn't think he should have it due to him not quitting drinking well he got it and he still drank himself to death what a waste of resources someone else could have had it and made a life for themselves not a prolonged death

What the nhs doesnt need are more rules and pencil pushers it needs better resources more staff better training and common sense

@NoNo well yes, it is their choice!

All those saying that IVF shouldn’t be funded because it’s a non essential and such a shame for the couple.

Well in that case, giving birth is non essential. If it’s not essential for people needing help to conceive to have a baby then why should babies that are conceived naturally be essential.

Let’s even the playing field and make all maternity care be it midwife, birth or IVF have to be funded by the patient. I wonder how many women would advocate for that now.

I despair at threads like these. Most people have no control over having kids. Make no mistake anyone that conceives naturally does it from sheer fucking luck not because they are worthier than those that need help.

Because with babies that are conceived naturally the NHS then has a duty to preserve life.

I don't think we should fund it at all. It's highly invasive and with uncertain outcomes. There is plenty of life saving stuff we are going to struggle to afford to fund over the next few years. Helping people have children can't be a priority in that context.
Of course it's easy for me to say that. I have three kids.

@NorthernLurker yes it’s easy for you to say, as you said. You have no idea the of the horrific pain and torture of infertility.

The way we’re going, cutting treatments of different types, we’re heading towards fully private Healthcare. This is the beginning of the end for the NHS

NorthernLurker I agree with the poster above you. Why should my taxes pay for your three births then? Bit selfish of you to choose to have three kids and expect taxpayers to foot the bill wasn’t it.

It's very easy to say if you have children and haven't needed IVF to conceive them.

I'm currently pregnant with my first, but I've done nothing to deserve being able to conceive naturally. I've just been fortunate that I'm able to. It doesn't seem fair at all to me that someone else should have to pay thousands out of pocket to try to get something that I managed to achieve merely because I had sex and we are lucky enough that both mine and my partner's reproductive organs work.

What I see time and time again is this bizarre desire to bring other people (women) down. Women telling other women that they can just adopt or that they should pay for IVF themselves, while NHS mismanagement and poor organisation fritters away way more than is spent on IVF. But instead of focusing on that, it turns into 'what can we take away from other people that will have no effect on me'. I find it really sad. Women should be standing up for other women and their reproductive rights. Not taking part in a race to the bottom.

@Celebelly thank you so much for your post. I’m sick of the smug fertile women on here who like to make others feel bad and have no idea of the pain of infertility. You’re right woman need to look after each other 💐

IVF is just a drop in the ocean financially. It’s a red herring IMO and a very cruel one for people going through infertility who don’t have money to pay for private treatment.

Debate on what to cut - and/or what funds to raise - should be informed by analysis, eg of what money goes on, factors increasing costs.

A big issue is how to fund long term care for the elderly. Politicians don’t want to deal with that one because it’s so difficult and so many voters are older.

@nonotheresnolyrics I agree, it tends to be women who have never suffered who start these threads. As long as they’re alright that’s all that matters and fuck anyone else with an issue out of their control.

Yes, it’s such a nasty streak to have, gloating about others misfortune

I think it's very easy to make grand or sweeping statements about things when they will have zero effect on your own life or wellbeing. But that's why those of us who it doesn't affect need to listen to the women who are having to go through the process and find out what they want and need. But if you're sitting at home with your kids and have never needed help to conceive them, then think about your own privilege before responding and how that might affect your viewpoint.