To ask you to talk to me about Lord of the Flies?

[Chandlierheights]

It’s a book I’ve always fancied but never got round to reading till now. How in the name of God is it marketed as a kids’ book?!

It’s so brilliantly disturbing. I finished it a couple of days ago and can’t stop thinking it. Would the boys retain their hatred of Ralph once they’re on the boat that rescues them, or would they revert to the moral code they were raised with?

How did Piggy and Ralph get drawn into Simon’s murder?!

Please can we have a discussion about it? No one I know in real life has read it.

'Fair' also symbolises justice. Quite apt, though Ralph's involvement in the death of Simon shows how even he can be corrupted.

You may think you are a "good" person with strong values instilled in you by society, but once society has been stripped away you don't know who you will become.

I think that really nails it. Also, once those values have gone it really is survival of the fittest- all the boys with health issues - boy 1 with the large birthmark on his face, Simon and his epilepsy, Piggy with asthma & glasses- are all the victims. Rules of society really make us protect the most vulnerable, once that has gone the world becomes a very dark place indeed. LOTF depicts this very successfully.

Thats what makes Ralph good imo. He is athletic and attractive. He does fit in. He could easily become a leader of the new dystopia, over the less attractive Jack. He chooses not to because he does have an innate sense of morality.

Oh God, I remember reading this at school aged 11, it scarred me for life

I love this book!

I’m currently marking this (GCSE examiner) and the kids get such beautiful, insightful stuff out of it. There’s a lot surfacing about the ego/ID/Freud theory that is interesting.

I think it’s something we like to think is far fetched, but actually very close in reality. Humans are animals ultimately.

“A High Wind In Jamaica” is another book about children that you might enjoy if you liked Lord of the Flies.

It’s about a group of children accidentally kidnapped by pirates and, although there are adults there, the themes are similar.

The bit that I found most upsetting from Lord of the Flies was very near the beginning: the very little boy with the birthmark on his face who disappeared after the fire. Piggy’s urgent “I don’t see him!” haunted me for a long time.

I found and read this book when I was 11. I enjoyed it but there were some bits I didn’t understand. I didn’t know I didn’t understand them until I had to read it for O level. I was very surprised at the whole deeper meaning of it all😄

The little boy who always introduces himself with his full name and address, and can’t remember it at the end, absolutely destroys me.

At 14, I read it as being a loss of identity and sense of self, and being utterly adrift without it.

Now, as a parent, I realise that it was something likely drummed into him by his parents, so that if he was ever lost he could be returned safely to them. But now there’s no going back to them or the life he lived before. And the idea that you can’t always keep your children safe from the horrors of the world, no matter how well you try to equip them, really affects me.

Sucks to your ass-mar!

In all seriousness though deploy your last paragraph really got me there :( definitely more scary viewed from a parents perspective

I read it for GCSE. It's full of symbolism. Piggy's glasses represent civilisation and when they break it's a break down of civilisation.

It was written in response to the second world war and it's horrors.
Are we all savage underneath the veneer of civilisation?

I should read it again.

Sucks to your ass-mar!

I still say asthma like this half the time as a result of that book!

Hate this book, thought it was shit.

Channel Four did a reenactment of the Stanford experiment. It wasn't a total replica and it turned out very differently (the prisoners turned on the guards) but it was still pretty scary to see what people do when the rules change, and what power can do to people without social controls.

It was written in response to the second world war and it's horrors.

At school, in the 60s, our English teacher made us take lots of notes about its relevance to politics in the 30s.
I didn't understand any of that and wrote about it in the exam as being the story about boys and human nature that it appeared to be. (Passed so it must have been okay)

I think I'd find it far more upsetting to read now than I did then.

Oh sorry, it wasn't Channel Four it was the BBC

this music video always reminds me of Lord of the Flies... I love it. This Is Why We Fight by The Decemberists

I love this book too! I need to read it again. We did it aged about 13/14 (along with Silas Marner @MexicanBob - and that was horrendously boring).

Can't remember when exactly but an author recently on Woman's hour was explaining her book and described it as LOTF with women! And I thought that I should get hold of it, but I can't remember the day that I was listening and who the author was.

I'm interested to know why people think that girls would not behave in the same way, and especially not kill. Is it their socialisation, or testosterone or what.

I am not sure that I agree, I think that they behave fairly similarly once they had been there a while. Granted it's been about thirty years since I read it.

it's a wonderful novel to be sure. Yes I think it is suitable for children. If you think about it there are many writers of children's fiction who introduce dark themes - Michael Morpurgo is best known.

I cannot bear to read anything else William Golding has ever written and I wonder why because clearly he is a spectacularly good. I've just given up on the other novels - they leave me cold. I think it is because they lack the immediacy of Lord of the Flies.

'Man produces evil as a bee produces honey.' Golding said this on his experience of the second World War. He was also a teacher...

The idea of inherent evil is both fascinating, and deeply terrifying.

based on*

I read it when I was about 11 I think and I loved it, although i don't think i really fully understood it. Did anyone see that TV experiment a few years ago I think it was channel 4, where they set up a house with a group of boys, a bit like the big brother house. At first they took care of the house, prepared food etc but without any adult supervision their behavior gradually deteriorated and they ended up being very aggressive and trashed the house. When they came out their parents asked them why they did it and they all looked ashamed but none of them could answer. It reminded me of that scene on the beach. There was a house with girls too and while there was some rows they behaved much better on the whole. Does anyone else remember seeing it?

Channel 4 did a documentary called ‘Boys Alone’ about ten years ago. I was teaching the novel at the time and showed it to my class. It was frightening how quickly the boys reverted to the ‘savage’ behaviour explored in the text: splitting into factions, isolating and bullying perceived weaker group members and, if I remember correctly, the crew had to intervene to stop them killing a hedgehog.