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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this behaviour regarding Pope's visit to Ireland is despicable

291 replies

user1485342611 · 26/06/2018 12:23

The Pope is visiting Ireland in August and two public Masses will be held. For Health and Safety reasons numbers attending have to be limited so free tickets are being allocated, on line, on a first come first served basis.

People who object to his visit are deliberately buying up thousands of tickets, booking in fake coach tours etc to ensure a low turn out and, in the process, deny tickets to those who want to attend.

AIBU to think that, whatever your religious beliefs, this is petty, vindictive, intolerant and downright despicable behaviour>

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 27/06/2018 06:30

"I believe this pope is a progressive one"
In what way?

BoneyBackJefferson · 27/06/2018 07:02
Allegorical · 27/06/2018 07:10

This is the same Pope who stuck his beak into the Alfie Evans case, causing further trouble for the dedicated proffesional nhs staff?!?

Not really that nice a guy is he then?

sashh · 27/06/2018 08:13

How does a few people buying up loads of tickets send a message about how the whole of Ireland now feels about the Catholic Church

An empty seat for every person who was abused is quite powerful, but it won't be a seat for each individual because there are so many.

And how many Catholics condoned abuse?
They didn't even know about it.

I'm English and was brought up lapsed ie I was sent to RC schools but we rarely went to mass. I knew about it. Maybe not the actual details but knowing that priests were moved and people were given hush money.

I think the first time I saw a TV documentary it was about the US but in the 1970s.

If a 10 year old child knows that some priests are not to be trusted and if they disappear it something the adults talk about but fall silent when a child walks into the room then the adults know more

This is the same Pope who stuck his beak into the Alfie Evans case, causing further trouble for the dedicated proffesional nhs staff?!?

Yep and had his ground soldiers stir up the 'don't murder babies' brigade in the referendum.

GameOfMinges · 27/06/2018 08:21

Very true kokeshi.

Katiepoes · 27/06/2018 08:33

I've had a good think about this and I think a visible protest is more appropriate. As Kokeshi says, show up and wave a banner, turn your back, walk out en masse - but make it impossible to ignore. Assuming a banner would be allowed of course.

This is about more than abuse. This is about telling people when and how and with whom they may have sex, about blocking women and babies from healthcare (anyone know about Dr Noel Brown and the Mother and Child scheme?), about the grip on the schools, about the women told to put up with violent husbands, about the hypocrisy of their own clergy. For two high profile hypocrite examples - Micheal Cleary and Eamonn Casey.

Ireland has done itself proud with the equal marriage and repeal referenda - time to close the past and let the Church know they must own their past and acknowledge the damage they have done in Ireland, and are still doing in less fortunate parts of the world.

Member984815 · 27/06/2018 08:46

You can only book 12 tickets at a time for Phoenix park and 8 at a time for knock. I'm near knock I didn't book tickets because I've no interest . But I think this is a valid protest .

Moonkissedlegs · 27/06/2018 09:29

The Knock tickets were all allocated within hours apparently. I suppose if you are super into it all that is the place to go. Unless most of those tickets have gone to protestors?

I guess they will find out on the day!

Windmillsinsummer · 27/06/2018 10:12

Protesters should have booked tickets under names of abused women , men and children since the Catholic church basically treated them as non humans. The Catholic church treated people like slaves who deserved what they got. I remember when the scale of the abuse came to light and the pope refused to apolgise and I'm sure I've read somewhere this pope himself was responsible for relocating more than one paedophile priest. How any of them can call themselves godly is beyond me.

Xenia · 27/06/2018 10:33

Most people in the church are pretty good to others. It seems a bit of an underhand tactic.

Mammysin · 27/06/2018 10:59

Just booked 12 tickets for Final mass- so looking forward to not going 👍

Jasperoonicle · 27/06/2018 11:02

And none of you booking tickets that you have no intention of using consider yourself childish at all? Seriously?

PaddyF0dder · 27/06/2018 12:16

Speaking as someone in possession of 48 tickets, no I don’t feel childish. I feel great.

Jasperoonicle · 27/06/2018 12:23

You are not in possession of any tickets. You have applied four times to get 48 tickets but you currently have none. I think that the online ticketing thing will be curtailed and another method used now that this has been brought to the attention of the organisers.

PinguPaws · 27/06/2018 13:00

@Windmillsinsummer, yes I too remember reading about the current pope, (might have been the Gaurdian) during his time he was responsible for the movement of pedophile priests from one parish to another, thus avoiding any prosecutors.

I don't buy his benevolent nice guy image for one second. Just good PR from a billion dollar cult, who want to keep it that way. Anyone who has risen through the ranks as something so rotten to the core knows exactly what's has gone on and is still going on in the name of religion.

The €20 million spent by the Irish government is outrageous, the Vatican could flog a few of their artworks in Sotheby's and raise that amount in 1 hour and paid for their rubbish concert.

And I think the empty chairs for all the victims would be a very strong signal to send.

BertrandRussell · 27/06/2018 13:24

There are several Facebook things around that make the current pope look progressive. They are, sadly, fake.

StripySocksAndDocs · 27/06/2018 14:02

Kokeshi123: ^"If people want to do a protest, get your arse in gear and get out there with a Kokeshi123

Clicking on an online ticket site is the ultimate definition of an idle keyboard warrior."

You understand that the two thing aren't mutually exclusive? I'd imagine that many who are booking tickets will get their "arse in gear and get out there with a banner or placard on the day" as well. This is what they're choosing to do now, due to the difficulty of protesting with placards on the day, before the day.

Not sure what the booking was meant to achieve, but it's certainly drawn attention to people's negative opinion of the pope's visit.

PaddyF0dder · 27/06/2018 14:04

@Jasperoonicle

Indeed that’s true. They may well cancel all tickets and find a new system.

I’m sure this protest would adapt accordingly.

derxa · 27/06/2018 14:15

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." What a ridiculous oversimplification.

PinguPaws · 27/06/2018 14:56

It's an insult to human dignity to say all non believers go to hell.

Many people have a belief in the afterlife, a parallel universe, peace and their understanding of what happens when their soul moves on, it maybe it's nothing and that's OK too.

But as the Catholic Church would it have, they are all going to hell, as they are non believers.

And that is a shocking thought to inflict on anyone...

LeahJack · 27/06/2018 15:07

Heavens. You think we’ve got to a point in history where we’re all religiously tolerant and accept freedom of thought and belief.

And then fucking “liberals” (who are anything but) turn up and fuck it up for everybody. No better than Jihadis who want to impose their world view on others.

I’d fight for the right for anybody to turn up and worship God, Allah, Ganesh or the fucking Flying Spaghetti Monster before I stood with people like that.

They’re no better than the bigoted Catholics who thought they had the right to impose their beliefs on the entire republic and oppress resistance. But they’re too blind to see it.

The stupid thing is, in 30 years the next generation will probably be fighting against this sort of intolerance and suppression rather than anything like the Catholic Church.

derxa · 27/06/2018 15:08

But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion Who judges who these 'good' people are?

PaddyF0dder · 27/06/2018 15:12

@LeahJack

“And then fucking “liberals” (who are anything but) turn up and fuck it up for everybody. No better than Jihadis who want to impose their world view on others.”

Do you not think you’re SLIGHTLY overstating it there? Hmm

There isn’t really an equivalence. I will freely agree that some atheists can be as stupidly evangelical as the worst religious people.

But I’ve yet to become aware of liberals mass-murdering people in terrorist atrocities or establishing cruel theocracies.

So ease off on the moral equivalence nonsense.

BertrandRussell · 27/06/2018 15:12

"And then fucking “liberals” (who are anything but) turn up and fuck it up for everybody"

There is rather a difference between stopping somebody worshipping as they wish and protesting the visit of a political leader.

PaddyF0dder · 27/06/2018 15:17

Oh man I’m still kind of laughing at Leah Jack.

I wonder, when there’s news of some terrorist attack in Europe, does she think “that’ll be those damn lefty liberal atheists again?”...