Poor people being priced out

[veggifriedbreakfast]

I live in East London and need to move, I currently rent a 2 bedroom flat. But, looking around now, for a 2 bedroom the minimal is £1400 a month up to £2000 for a 2 bed!!!

It seems to me that what is happening is that actually poor people are being priced out of London. I lived in Stratford and had to move out of there due to the market going up and now where I am again it's happening. How can people on lesser incomes afford this? I am now looking to having to uproot ds again and move even further out because of this. Aibu in thinking that this is a part of forcing the poorer people out of London?

I did live with my parents for a long time. That was both before and after periods of renting in the private sector in two different cities, all within the last decade.

Your refusal to answer a simple question tells us all we need to know about your actual, real life experience of being in this situation.

You're obviously on the defensive now because you have been exposed as a hypocrite. Either way, you're not adding anything constructive to the debate or giving the OP any useful advice. And I really need to stop wasting my time on you.

I'd say you really need to stop wasting all day on MN and get on a do some work, then maybe you'd afford that deposit.

"I lived with my parents for a long time" blah blah blah means you maximum rented in London for 5 years, I did that for a lot longer and yes, prices got raised every time you signed a contract. As I kept saying.

The has been shown by many people lots of different properties in her price range, within East London ( Walthamstow, Newham, East Ham) by many posters .

You just keep making excuses and saying why should she have to move.

As I keep saying, its not new, we had to do it a few times, as did other people, and people I know still to this day!

So LoveinTokyo

you don't live here
you don't currently rent in the UK
you lived with parents for many years - lucky you. quite a lot of us had to move out at 18, some before that for various reasons so leaning on the bank of mum and dad whilst we saved wasn't an option.
You don't have children who are of the age that they are looking to rent for the first time.

None of these mean that you aren't entitled to your opinion, of course you are. but I have kids in this situation. I am dealing with where to find rentals for them RIGHT NOW. I was last in rented when I was in my 40's.

Read what I said. what suggestions are you making on a macro scale to make the situation better? what are your ideas to improve this?

tax second home owners? stop buy to let mortgages? any other actual ideas?

and I guarantee in 20 or so years time when your kids (or if you don't have them that generation) are looking at rentals, the market will be different again and you will be telling us how they have it better than you did when they will say to the contrary.

and I stand by my snowflake comment. we all have different and varied life experiences that we bring to the table. I just happen to have lived longer than you so have had the opportunity to have more of them.

and again - we have to have a radical change solution. if anyone comes up with a decent one on this thread then you/we can lobby our MP and push for change.

sitting back, throwing your hands in the air whilst uttering doomed, doomed yet not actually trying to change things is just so pointless.

I live in a small rural community now. whenever locally any planning application comes up for housing I always write in to ask about affordable. I always write in to ask about agricultural ties. it puts pressure on the local council to make the right decision and sometimes it does make a difference.

BTW

I have kids the same age as mummymiesters

My DS and his girlfriend were early to mid 30s.

They lived on both slightly lower than the London average wages but put 30 k into a deposit in two years.

Its doable, but difficult, but it was never easy.

When I first bought a house my income wasn't taken into consideration on the mortgage but we still had to save 25% - guess about how long it took us living in "crumby" shared accommodation.

I have recent and perfectly valid experience of the struggles faced by people in the private rented sector in both London and another city.

Yes, I lived with my parents for a few years because I was tired of paying such a large chunk of my net income to my landlord for the privilege of living in a poly shithole where the heating didn’t work throughout the winter, and because I couldn’t see any other way of being able to build a deposit. Yes, I was lucky to be able to do that and realise that not everyone can.

Your snowflake comment was stupid the first time you said it, and it’s not going to get any less stupid the more times you say it.

On a macro level, I vote, but I have absolutely no faith in politics, the government or the electoral system. I think they’re all in it for themselves and nothing is likely to change that. My MP (a current cabinet minister) is a lying shit and completely useless at both local and national level.

topcat1980

Do you actually know Thorton Heath?

bobo It is not necessary for her to know anything about Thornton Heath (or anything else) in order to express her opinion about (a) living there, or (b) other people's reasons for not wanting to live there.

Please note that the above does not apply to anyone expressing an opposing opinion, who must have no less than 20 years' recent experience in the thing they are talking about in order for their opinion to be valid.

LoveInTokyo True! I always find it weird how these threads bring out so many people adamant that things have not changed. I say that as someone who is mid 30s & has lots of equity.

The childcare comment always pisses me off. Childcare costs have risen massively & the whole 30 hours isn’t free, it’s subsidised. And let’s not forgot the gov aren’t doing it out of the goodness of their heart, it’s too encourage woman in the main to stay in work & therefore collect more in taxes.

Whilst the child care comment might piss you off bobo its not half as off pissing as actually having to pay the full costs like some of us did. I am not saying that things haven't changed. on the contrary I am saying that things always change - that there are always challenges and each generation brings its own ones.

do I give a shiny shit if you don't like my snowflake comment? nope I really don't. and so LoveInTokyo instead of saying how useless politicans are at effecting change, why don't YOU stand for office. or let me guess, you are happy to be all doomed, doomed about it all but when there are opportunities to actually, you know, take some action, you cant be bothered.

there is always a lack of local councillors, town councillors etc and this is where grass roots initial decisions are taken about small developments - the kind that could affect a community.

but, nearly forgot, you don't live here so you cant.

when will people realise if you don't like whats going on, you do it, you make the change or you become the changemaker. don't just moan about how rubbish everyone else is, get on and volunteer yourself for office. you don't have to belong to a political party. you just have to be arsed.

So how much did you pay for childcare? mummymeister

And no I don’t have to time to campaign at the moment but who knows I may in the future. Also Im lucky & far from doomed, but I appreciate others aren’t so fortunate.

Full childcare costs may piss you off but I’m pretty pissed that as a higher tax paying family I’m paying for a NHS & state pension I’m unlikely to access or receive.

London has always been unaffordable for the average earner as far as I can remember. I was born in 1960 in Thornton Heath. We moved out to Surrey where I spent my childhood and when DH and I married we bought a 2 bed terrace in Surrey which we renovated and sold in the mid 80s. By that time we had 2 young children and I was a SAHM, property prices had rocketed and mortgage rates up in the 12-15% bracket. To move to a larger property I would have to return to full time work but a job transfer within my DHs company opened up in the South West so we moved to Cornwall in 1988 when our daughters were 1 and 2. Better house, better quality of life and better schools and I was able to find part time work in our local city.

My advice to anyone who can is move away. There is a life outside London. I don't think it is any different in other major cities. New York, Paris and Barcelona are all expensive cities to live. Nothing to do with austerity or social cleansing. It is just supply and demand of properties in a desirable city. My family still live in the Greater London area and in the main enjoy it and we like it when we CCJs it but would not want to move back even if we could afford it. Tough to have the distance between family members though.

but, nearly forgot, you don't live here so you cant

No, that’s right, I can’t.

My husband is from another country, and the way things were and are going in the UK I couldn’t in all conscience expect him to go and live there. So I made the decision to go and live in his country instead, where things are not perfect, but they are better.

(The housing crisis was one of the factors which contributed to my decision that we would be better off outside the UK.)

Leave them to it OP, in a decade or so most of that shit hole will be submerged with any luck.

They should build a fucking wall round London and keep them in.
Hate the place. Beneath the glossy facade it really is a cesspit

I wont out myself bobo because I have more than 2 children. I had to pay for nursery between 2.5 and when they started school and then one of my children was ill we spent two years in hospital on and off I also paid for a nanny to come in 4 days a week and my DH had a day off to do the remainder. so all in all we spent a lot on childcare because we chose to have more than two children but of course we didn't choose to have one who was ill.

I also couldn't return to work full time because of the hospital appointments/stays. So free hours would have been very useful to me then.

I am completely baffled by your comment about the NHS? so you didn't access it to give birth, to have holiday jabs, to have your children immunised? how do you know that you wont as a family have to access it for unfortunate reasons say next week or next month.

No one ever has time to campaign but they always have time to sit at their keyboard typing on MN!! takes 2 minutes to e mail your MP. Most town/parish councils sit for 3 hours once a month. We get the politicians we deserve if we cant be arsed ourselves.

I have emailed my MP many times. He always leaves it until the last day he is legally allowed to respond and then sends me a poorly written response full of buzzwords and empty platitudes which doesn’t actually address any of the issues I raised.

One of my former neighbours writes to him weekly, which I greatly admire, but frankly I don’t have the energy to do what is essentially a pointless exercise on a weekly basis.

Leave them to it OP, in a decade or so most of that shit hole will be submerged with any luck.

They should build a fucking wall round London and keep them in.
Hate the place. Beneath the glossy facade it really is a cesspit*

Bold fail.

We left London 5 years ago with 99% no regrets. Our rent halved for 3x the property and we are walking distance to a train station with an excellent service. I earn the same as I do in London OH earns a lot more both doing the same jobs. We are now in a position to save to buy, something we would never have been able to do in London. Hospitals and public services in London have a higher proportion of young people doing the lower paid roles like nursing and teaching as they often house share but as soon as they want their own place or to settle down with a partner they have to re think and there can be high turnovers of staff as a result. The only thing I miss about London is a Sam's chicken when I've had a few and the ability to jump on the tube and go on an adventure without a whole lot of planning.

They should build a fucking wall round London and keep them in.
Hate the place. Beneath the glossy facade it really is a cesspit

London pays almost a third of UK tax, report findss*

A study by the thinktank the Centre for Cities found that London generated almost as much tax as the next 37 largest cities combined and increased its share of “economy taxes” underpinning the Treasury’s finances to 30%, up five percentage points since 2004/5.

Will that wall keep all the tax revenue raised in London as well?

Haven't read full thread but compare these...

My mum in the late 60s, early 70s - lowish wage but could afford to rent in Notting Hill. Youngish (not career established) friends could afford to buy there and elsewhere in central London.

Me in the early 2000s, high earner with high earner husband, priced out of Stoke Newington. Us and our career established friends couldn't afford to buy in London.

We left in 2004 and it's even more expensive now.

I also couldn't return to work full time because of the hospital appointments/stays. So free hours would have been very useful to me then. The 15 or 30 hours are not free & only available for 39 wks & you have to work a minimum of 16 hours p/w to qualify for the 30 hours. Whilst I appreciate it, in reality when we got the 15 hours are bill was reduced perhaps by a third.

Why are you baffled by my comment re the NHS? you don’t have to be a rocket scientist to appreciate the fact that one is likely to need long term medication & operations when older. I’d rather know that was there for me when needed as opposed to a holiday jab. I’ve paid NI for more than 15 years.

user09876543211234567890

Well apparently you, just like me are imagining it. I went to school with children of nurses, policemen, teachers etc & they all had homes everywhere from Balham to Raynes Park many with only one parent working. And whilst these areas were not as naice as they are now in no way were they crime cesspits! One of my school friends lived in Wim villiage which was swanky in the 90s, their house was just about 600k, now prob 4m+