To be a bit dubious about cannabis being legalised

[LeahJack]

William Hague called for legalisation today. And there is the discussion about legalisation for medical reasons, which is obviously great for people like Billy Caldwell, but has been used in the US as a back door for recreational legalisation as certificates are given out like confetti for everything.

I worry about this as DH used to smoke it. And like most users thought it was harmless but it made him absent minded and empty headed even when he wasn’t smoking it to the point where I was frightened to leave the children with him because he wouldn’t be able to react quickly if they did things like run into the road. Plus he was grumpy, irritable and short tempered when he wasn’t smoking it.

Another friend of mine who is a bit vulnerable had a complete breakdown into psychosis smoking it and lost her marriage and wasn’t allowed her children unsupervised for a long time as a result of cannabis smoking.

I also know someone who is currently smoking it claiming it is curing his depression, but it is quite obviously making his already poor mental health worse and tipping him into paranoia.

I know some people say it should be treated like alcohol, but if alcohol was discovered now, it would probably be banned too.

I think smoking it is a selfish act, and the price for recreational users legally getting stoned will be paid by their partners and children and vulnerable people who are made ill by it.

I hate that it’s effectively been decriminalised anyway and my children have to walk through clouds of stinking smoke on our high street.

Is Cannabis Oil Legal?
In the UK, it is still illegal to possess, supply or use cannabis oil for any purpose. However, the law has recently changed to recognise CBD, one of the components of cannabis, as a medicine.

recreational cannabis wont be legalised. it would be political suicide.

I think this is bollocks. If someone is going to be a smackhead they are going to be a smackhead. Nothing to do with weed.

In my personal experience of this, which is sadly quite extensive, this isn’t actually the case. You do usually have to have a fairly specific set of circumstances to end up a smackhead (eg abusive background, frequently mental health issues). But people don’t just go out one day and start taking smack. It’s not like you can just pop down the shops and buy a wrap of smack, you have to know where to get it.

They do generally start with cannabis and then move on to pills and speed etc and you actually have to build up connections and trust re dealers and have some knowledge of drug taking before you even think about moving on to heroin.

But that potentially is something I suppose legalisation might prevent as cannabis smokers wouldn’t be building those connections with criminals.

recreational cannabis wont be legalised. it would be political suicide.

I agree, I think they're are going for both to ensure they get the medicinal.

There is apparently a huge difference between medical marijuana and what most people smoke which is a potent version called skunk. Skunk causes psychosis and mental health problems. My sister who was bedridden with MS and unable to move walked downstairs after a couple of puffs on a joint. It was miraculous. It is hypercritical that a government minister’s DH owns a company producing and exporting medical marijuana, but it is illegal in this country. I am beyond sick of the double standards in this country. My sister was prescribed Sativax, a spray prescription version but it had no benefit whatsoever.

That's not really true leahjack. The legal limit for THC currently is 0.2%, and the medical cannabis is higher THC than that but still not a lot. You'd have to down the bottle ( and you would not want to because it's blooming expensive) to get stoned. There are many different strains of cannabis with different proportions of the various compounds in - some are designed to get you stoned, some are not.
I have a child with epilepsy that responded to conventional medication, and have several friends using CBD for children with epilepsy. Had my DD been intractable I would absolutely want access to medical cannabis. Currently many families are using CBD with some success but they have to do it without medical advice as the doctors won't prescribe or advise on it. Billy's family are friends of friends and suddenly withdrawing an epileptic child's medication was callous. The Home Office are lucky they do not have his death on their conscience if they have such a thing

In my personal experience of this, which is sadly quite extensive, this isn’t actually the case.

In my personal experience, which unfortunately is also extensive, it seems to be a boyfriend or groups of friends that introduce smack, not weed.

"you do know how many people smoke weed and manage not to be mentally ill, obese and jobless right?"

Not in my area, though. Those of us whose life is blighted by drugs/crime/unemployment, things will just get worse.

My POV is how do I keep my kids off it when there is no reason not to do it, because it has been decriminalised.

This was taken from an article in the Independent,

Lord Hague said issuing orders to the police to stop people smoking cannabis were “about as up to date and relevant as asking the army to recover the empire”.

He doesn't just want the Oil legalised. That would mean that in my area, children's parks etc we would be constantly living in Cannabis fumes. The only reason we don't have to put up with that is because the Lads won't risk a stop and search.

It won't take dealers off the street because what would be made legal won't be strong enough, to expensive, or underage kids won't be able to get it. We'll just have a two tier system.

I use CBD oil, I got benefit straight away, but living were I live the last thing we need is legalised drugs.

There is no doubt that cannabis is a gateway drug
Can anyone actually prove that?

I would suspect its visiting a drug dealer that is the gateway to harder drugs.

Legalise cannabis and it will reduce the number of people trying harder drugs.

"In my personal experience, which unfortunately is also extensive, it seems to be a boyfriend or groups of friends that introduce smack, not weed."

That's true. But it's the relaxed attitude to using drugs and the availability that contributes. How do explain to large numbers of WC kids, who are suffering due to the cuts, lack of jobs etc, that Cannabis is dangerous, if we legalise it?

I think that the Royal College of Psychiatrists should be listened to on this one.

I'd decriminalise all drugs.

Cannabis in particular - swathes of people (including many, many high-functioning professionals) use it with no adverse effects whatsoever (other than smoking related).

Spice was invented as a legal synthetic cannabis and it is the most terrifying drug I have ever encountered. It is causing the most horrific violence and self mutilation in our prisons and awful scenes on our streets.

It was invented and marketed as a legal high, non-damaging and non-addictive.

Sold freely and cheaply in shops till last year. A big fuck you to the illegality of cannabis which many people feel is less harmful than alcohol.

It wouldn't have even been invented or marketed if cannabis was legal. It was designed to circumvent cannabis legislation. If all drugs were legal we can regulate production, content and distribution. Spice is now illegal and what's happened? There's more money to be made from it..so more will be made and more dangerous strains will come onto the underground market.

Decriminalise drugs and put the extra money into genuinely effective drug and alcohol treatment for those that are addicted.

People will always want to use substances to alter their mental state. If as a society, we prohibit some of these, an extremely lucrative drug trade exists which involves violence, exploitation and deaths.

Cannabis oil is legal here as long as it doesn’t contain THC. I have some in my cupboard.

It’s the THC which is illegal and it’s also the thing which gives the high.

If it was decriminalised there would be a lot less people smoking it, and more people eating it and taking it in many other ways.

Less drug dealers and Les criminal activity.

More tax paid, less money in black market.

Bring it on I say.

There is no doubt that cannabis is a gateway drug

Can anyone actually prove that?

No, no evidence whatsoever that any "gateways" exist regarding substance use. These theories are generally floated by Prohibitionists who disapprove of the whatever substance is being discussed.
Far more likely coming into contact with dealers who have other goods available and peer pressure leads people to try other things.

" (including many, many high-functioning professionals) "

Lets keep Professionals out of this, their drug use has nothing in common with the Lads on my estate, or City. It's the bottom rung that will once again suffer for this law.

We are trying to get people to stop smoking, yet we are thinking of legalising a drug that is smoked with a tobacco mix.

"Less drug dealers and Less criminal activity."

They'd drop the price of other drugs and make them more addictive. They'd also make sure that they got their customers underage.

I've seen that where I live, they used to do special £5 bags for the school kids.

it seems to be a boyfriend or groups of friends that introduce smack, not weed.

And how did the boyfriend or friends get into smack? There is a very naive view generally held by people who have very little experience of drug takers that there are ‘drug pushers’ who are actively trying to get people hooked on heroin.

In reality it’s an incredibly furtive business run by people who really don’t want to get caught and often do it to fund a habit of their own. They’re incredibly selective to the point of paranoia who they sell to and it is highly cloak and dagger. Most dealers don’t sell to people they can’t trust. And they expect there to be some sign of previous drug experience because selling smack to a teenager whose naive about drugs is a very quick way of getting an angry parent reporting you to the police and being raided. Not to mention that young people who have never taken drugs aren’t likely to throw caution to the wind and take the most dangerous addictive one. And it’s also frequently first used as a ‘come down’ drug after speed, cocaine or ecstasy too.

it would allow for cannabis to be grown in properly regulated conditions with lower levels of psychoactive elements.

This is already happening in UK, it all gets exported though. Uk is World's top exporter of medical marijuana.

I have smoked some uk grown medical cannabis, and it's very good. You get nicely relaxed and a bit high, but not stoned or heavily affected and no munchies. They have bred out negative qualities and enhanced the positive.

They'd drop the price of other drugs and make them more addictive. They'd also make sure that they got their customers underage.

I'm pretty sure that studies done in countries that has legalised cannabis (and in the case of Portugal all drugs) Show that this simply isn't the case.

Agree it could be a good idea in theory but our illegal drugs market is simply too out of control to implement without causing a massive boom in the illegal trade of it. A lot of the problem is the type people are smoking nowadays, and I can’t see any way back from that without a massive shift in attitudes and a massive programme of drugs ed, which clearly won’t happen. Cannabis oil for medical use absolutely should be legalised. Don’t know anything about it but it clearly helps a lot of people with awful symptoms.

You could say the same about most prescription drugs. They aren't a huge problem because they are prescribed responsibly. The US in general has a problem with over prescribing drugs. I don't think that we should be looking at the US as an example of what might happen in the UK. People often forget that the US is extremely different culturally from the UK.

Hallelujah just read that the home sec is ordering a review into the benefits of medicinal cannibis.
But he makes it clear that they will not be legalising recreational use.
Lets hope this is common sense winning the day !

Two of the most dangerous drugs are legal and taxed. Tobacco and alcohol.
Look what happened in USA with prohibition.
Legalise, quality control, educate, rehabilitate.
Crime would go down, addicts would get help, the number of drug, gun and knife related
deaths would reduce.
I believe that 100%.
I speak as a bereaved mother of a child with addiction who could get no help at all with his mental health problems.

But it's the relaxed attitude to using drugs and the availability that contributes. How do explain to large numbers of WC kids, who are suffering due to the cuts, lack of jobs etc, that Cannabis is dangerous, if we legalise it?

Presumably the same way we do now given it’s widely available and having it isn’t likely to lead to prosecution. I’m not sure the fact that it’s technically illegal is a big deterrent. Or it isn’t round here anyway.

@endofthelinefinally I agree with you, but I just can’t see the educate and rehabilitate bit happening. Certainly not under this government anyway.