To think you shouldn't be better off a single parent living with family than being in a working couple? **Title edited by MNHQ**

[CallingAllLovers]

In a nutshell, I'm working 17 hours a week and getting £700 take home salary, plus £82 something Child Benefit. I have one DC.

On top of this, I get about £800 it so in tax credits.

I'm now separated from my husband so living with family.

I'm far better off financially than I was when both myself and H worked and ran a home together.

I have a friend who's really struggling, her DH and her both work full time with one DC. Another friend in a similar situation with two DC.

I was incredibly panicked when leaving H, I often kept staying when things were really tough due to being petrified of how skint I would be.

But it's not the case.

I did wonder why the money I get was so high, then I was told tax credits don't care about your bills/outgoings, just your childcare.

AIBU to think I shouldn't be better off than someone working full time, or a hard working couple working full time?

I realise this thread sounds really goady, but I'm not trying to be.

It just seems like people are penalised for working more/having a partner.

Well, good for you that you have that option! Not everyone has such choices, do they?

What’s your issue with claiming childcare?

You have claimed extensively in the past. Why the reluctance now?

I have no issue with people claiming anything. Why do you think I have.

Again

For the FIFTH time

I have no issue with how much help people get, the issue I have is the LACK OF HELP FOR WORKING FAMILIES

There is help for EVERYONE on a means tested basis. And for the umpteenth time, single parent also head working families.

The cut off point for tax credits doesn’t cover the extra costs of another adult or the lack of HB and CTB

This is happening all over the country I know tonnes of families who live apart because it’s the only affordable way

OP, is the £800 figures for Tax Credit yearly? As this figure is very high for one DC monthly.

So who do I need to talk to about me not being part of working family, do I tell my boss I don't actually work so he should stop pestering me to clean my work area or do I tell my kids we're not a family so they can stop pestering me to feed them?

When we found ourselves on benefits I was amazed by the amount of benefits we received! I thought it was very generous.

Frequency

Or maybe just not purposefully misinterpret what people say.

I’ve been a single working parent. Obviously I know they exist.

If belligerence is your only argument, maybe have a little look at what it is you’re actually trying to say...

Got it camel

My question though is that you have claimed extensively in the past.

If you are entitled to assistance with childcare, why not claim now?

So who do I need to talk to about me not being part of working family, do I tell my boss I don't actually work so he should stop pestering me to clean my work area or do I tell my kids we're not a family so they can stop pestering me to feed them? . Go for both, then you can use all those lovely benefits for an exotic holiday! (I’ll join you, seeing as that’s what people seem to think we’re doing anyway, may as well enjoy it hey?)

Can I come?! Pllleeeaaasssseeee!

Why would I claim for childcare? My children aren’t IN childcare.

Again I have no issue with people claiming anything they’re entitled to (please try and reread that as it seems impossible for you to understand)

My only wish is that there was more help for working families. At the moment there is a lot of help for single parent families but when you add another adult into the mix suddenly the disposable income becomes a huge issue. It’s horrid to think that families are separated because of this.

You all might think it’s a laughing matter but it’s reslly not. It absolutely sucks for many people.

Op how many kids have you got?

Sorry to be pernickety but as I claim child tax credits I do know a bit about it.

If you have 3 children and earn under 15k per year you get £740 a month in CTC
(And that's only if your third child was born before April 2017)

If you have 2 kids then you get £505 per month (if you earn under 15k)

I am unsure of WOrking tax credits and all the other benefits you can claim as a parent earning under 16k.

But yes, I can see why being a single parent can leave some parents better off. This is why universal credit is being rolled in, so this is no longer the case. But families who are in need, are struggling with the cap on benefits as they are the ones who have lost out

Your tax credits sound wrong to me; too much. Unless massive childcare costs of done sort of disability / carers(?) element.

I earn about 12.5k a year (£900 a month) and get about £400 tax credits a month. Plus £82 CB.

I think most people would find living on £1382 a month with kids a huge hardship. Surely???

Sigh. Those pesky working families again. What help is it you want? Do you understand the concept of means testing?

How can you be, by your definition, both a single parent and a working family? If you are part of a couple claiming as a single parent then you are committing fraud.

Single working parents can claim WTC and CTC, those add up to more than the amount added to the pot if/when a second earner comes into the home.

I am failing to see why this is such a contentious subject.
It’s a lived experience for many people and a known issue.

What help do ‘i’ expect? Well, none really. I find it quite easy to have a conversation about a social problem without it having to be a complete reflection on my own personal circumstances.

In this case I have an understanding of the situation because I have lived both sides of it.

Working families need more support, has Mumsnet suddenly become populated by a bunch of arsey Tory supporters who fail to understand that raising a family, working and living on the breadline is a fucking thing for two parent families?

Seriously, it’s obvious, look around. You’ve got google, use it.

"Working Families" have two chances to go and earn. If they can't support themselves on one wage, the second person can go out to work. "Single working parents" (also working families, fyi) only have one person to go out and earn. If they can't support themselves on one wage, it's tough shit, basically.

It really is simple. Why should "Working Families" be given extra support on account of there is another adult to feed, assuming that adult is not disabled?

I'm usually all for low-income workers, benefits etc but even I would say 'get a job you feckless scrounger' if a "Working Family" started whining about not being able to feed themselves when only one adult in the household was working.

Can you stop with the ‘working families’? Or explain to me why as a single parent I am not a working family too?

You will need to provide genuine worked examples. You seem to believe single parents get money two parents don’t. The whole thing is means tested so you will receive the same. If you bro g in a second person who earns, why would you expect their earnings to be disregarded? Or are you not actually a family?

Obviously for the sake of this conversations we are discussing single parents who work or two person families who work.

That’s obvious. If you’ve really spent this entire bullshit conversation because you’ve belligerently refused to acknowledge that obvious connetation then you need to have a word with yourself. What the hell is the point of trying to having a conversation if you’re intention is to be that bloody minded? Honestly, find something else to do.

A second working adult has to earn a wage well over the national average to come close to topping up the SPF up to the same amount of money that family is receiving in top up benefits.

If you don’t believe me, go and do the research for yourself.

I know it’s the case because I’ve lived it. My wish (after working hours today in a fucking physical job mostly with my child on my fucking back) to scroll through entitled to in order to point out the bleeding obvious to people who would argue the Sky was blue instead of cyan, is zilch.

You HAVE working families here TELLING you this is the case.

There needs to be MORE HELP FOR WORKING FAMILIES. The demographic of those families are irrelevant. The help is needed for ALL of them because many are stuck in a trap where they can’t live together or cannot work more because the loss of top ups would cause major issues. Maybe you live in a world where this is not a problem for you but it IS a problem for many. Many of whom who have commented here. Maybe LISTEN rather than hoiking up your judgey pants and imaging things that people haven’t said. Nobody has suggested taking anything away from SPF or giving more to anyone else but not to them.

The ONLY concern for many working families is being able to get by AND live together without it causing fucking poverty.

A second working adult has to earn a wage well over the national average to come close to topping up the SPF up to the same amount of money that family is receiving in top up benefits

I call bullshit.

I worked PT when I was part of a "Working Family", my ex worked fulltime. I'm in the same job, took a pay cut to avoid paying me CM as best he could.

Together, we could afford to eat, holiday once every two years, occasional days out during the school holidays, everyone had the right food, no-one was worrying about the leccy meter running out before pay day.

Separately I have nightmares about the words "Mam, I need new shoes," literal, actual nightmares. The dog needed to go to the vet today. I cried. DD2 offered to give me her birthday money because she wanted him to get better (I didn't take it. I used money I'd been saving for rare night out for myself). We go on zero holidays per year and have one day out during the summer holidays.

My ex, otoh, is not only single but apparently also free of responsibility and has gone from one holiday every two years to two holidays everyone year plus days out at least once a month. He took a pay cut remember? His reduced wage is going much further now he doesn't have two kids to feed and clothe.

How does your abuse help? A refusal to provide a worked example of something you are defending just adds to the ‘bullshit’ idea expressed above.

Two people have the opportunity to bring in two full time wages - minimum wage would see them topped up...and then depends on what they are earning above that. Whether single or not, a family with an income above the threshold will receive nothing. That is not something that affects only 2 adult households. Plenty of single parents also affected. There is a loss of benefits if you move in a working partner but the expectation is a pooling of resources ( I get that might not be the case but that isn’t the problem of the DWP or HMRC).

Right. So you agree there needs to be more help for working families!!!

Before DH moved in I got £117 a week TC plus a £150 from self employment. I paid £13.50 a week council tax, paid all but £90 a month rent and had far less outgoings. I also got £500 a month in child benefit.

He needed a significant wage increase until he could come close to matching what we had without him here, in fact he still doesn’t cut we can survive so we do.

Your working minimal hours and complaining about being skint. Sort your hours out maybe. I started work when DD2 was 6 weeks old because I had no choice. Maybe it’s time to look at your life choices.

@Frequency sorry to hear this. Xxx