Invisible illnesses on a packed train

[MsFrizzle]

Had a "fun" time on the trains yesterday. Somebody (very sadly) passed away at Chesterfield and sent the entirety of Sheffield station into chaos, just as I was about to get on a London train. It's not a huge issue for me because I didn't have to be anywhere but home, but it is because I was directed to multiple trains missing out Chesterfield before I finally got put on one where everybody was packed in like sardines. I walk with a cane. I have severe rheumatoid arthritis, and somebody was kind enough to give up a seat for me (the little seat that's inbetween carriages if you get what I mean).

A pregnant lady got on with an older lady, presumably mother, grandmother or perhaps other relative? My cane was folded away in my bag because it was a long journey and I can manage making my way to a seat if any open up because there's handles on train seats. Older lady instantly glared at me, looked at Pregnant lady. OL said "aren't you going to get up for her?" looking at PL again. I felt pretty awful about it but I knew I couldn't stand for even the 45 min journey to the next station and however long it took us to get out of our station (20 mins waiting for the OK to get going) and said "I can't stand for that long, I'm sorry". standing and walking is incredibly painful for me but keeping moving is a way to help with flares, which come and go. I don't want to get a wheelchair which is even more cumbersome in incidents like this. OL said "You're young. she's pregnant, you should be giving your seat up for pregnant people" and now everybody else in the crammed space is glaring at me so I took out my cane to show her and she just laughed at me and called me a selfish bitch. I just said "i have arthritis" and she said so did she (herself), but you didn't see her complaining.

PL didn't say anything. She looked a bit embarrassed, but maybe she was annoyed. No train staff had any chance of coming down the aisles so there was nobody to really mention it to. Was I in the wrong?

You were not being unreasonable. This is why I wouldn't feel comfortable asking someone to give up their seat for me (heavily preggo) and think the 'I need a seat' badges are great.
Sorry if you were made to feel bad.

In future just reply with "I'm disabled. This wasn't a choice for me. Being pregnant is usually a choice and is not a disability"

I have to do this a lot. I have a prosthetic leg which I usually hide with trousers so you can't always see straight away. When people bitch and moan I just lift my trousers leg while looking them dead in the eye. Usually works

Of course you weren't unreasonable, sorry you had to deal with that.

Were you in the only seat in the entire carriage? I've never heard of a train carriage with only one seat .... Somebody else could have offered PL a seat, rather than glaring at you. Y were NBU.

Sorry you had to deal with this. I had a similar situation recently on a packed train, ironically to Sheffield. The train was so full with so many passengers standing the conductor made an announcement for everyone not to put bags/luggage on seats, but to leave the seats for people.

I didn't get a seat and although I looked fine I had recently had major surgery and couldn't stand for the whole of the journey. I had to ask an elderly lady to move her bags off the seats as she had ignored the conductors announcement. She was not best pleased.

you will have to tell people sometimes that you have a condition whilst using priority seating or similar

Which part of "I can't stand for that long, I'm sorry" was not clear? Its really very straightforward. Frankly the more you try to explain, the more likely you are to be dismissed by judgemental prats justifying their own appalling behaviour.

The alternative is that we just allow CFs to abuse the system which I think is worse.

Its also mostly a fiction. Like all the people who apparently buy walking sticks and leave them on trains just to get a seat without booking. Its a nice trope to trot out to justify a culture of disablism.

Are you female OP, I guess from your user name you are? I find this typically happens to women, why couldn’t she have asked another passenger? You were not wrong OP.

*In future just reply with "I'm disabled. This wasn't a choice for me. Being pregnant is usually a choice and is not a disability"

I'd stop at "I'm disabled" - pregnant women should also be able to get seats when they need them as well and in this story it was another passenger being an arse, not the pregnant woman.

That's upsetting OP. Please use the words, "I'm disabled, I know you may not be able to see that at outset, but could you please ask an able bodied person if they can offer you their seat? "

I agree next time say "I'm disabled and not able to stand" . I'd be tempted to add "perhaps one of the other passengers is more able to help".

Obviously, ideally trains wouldn't run packed like sardines and there would be an adequate service.

No, the only unreasonable person is the one insisting you give up your seat, more so after you explained your condition and for trying that “as I have I” business. Obviously, not all levels of arthritis are the same and how dare she argue on. I think that woman is the type to find an argument any where. Some people are miserable twats and take on a self righteous tone to make themselves feel better. Pathetic.

Sorry that happened to you; it’s bad enough you have severe arthritis. Just know anyone in the train that has a working brain would have figured out you weren’t being unkind.

Grammar edit * the old woman for trying that “as have I” business.

UrsulaPandress me too. Debilitating pain.
Can I ask, are you able to work? I’ve been told not to expect to be able to given I can’t walk for long nor be seated long either. Days are variable, sometimes I need one stick, sometimes two. Don’t know my flare up triggers either 🤷🏻‍♀️

Op I’d have honestly kept the stick out because ‘invisible disability’ to some is ‘fake’ so therefore unless they can see the wheelchair you’re in, it doesn’t exist.
Just be thankful you’re a much nicer person than she’ll ever be- and if others were so fussed about the pregnant woman, they were free to give up their seats too. As someone else said, pregnancy is a choice- a painful disability is certainly not.

What a rude women, I would have told her to shut her mouth or pick a window lol lol joking!!!

@SharronNeedles quite a few pregnant women have disabilities as well, or conditions from pregnancy which mean they can't stand either. So if you say that you could end up in a nasty confrontation.

Regardless OP if there are able bodied people on the train they should stand up rather than expect another person to.

I've noticed from being ill before on the tube and train that only certain demographics tend to give you a seat. (I actually tend to stand up if I'm healthy or not pregnant so avoid that problem. )

No you're not, just because someone's pregnant doesn't mean they need a seat. When I was pregnant I wouldn't have expected a seat

What I would love to say, if accosted like that, but don’t think I would ever dare to, is

‘I have cancer and right now I am too fucking tired to stand. Tomorrow might not be so bad, and if I see you then I’ll apologise for swearing and offer my seat like a person in normal health, but right now I’m too fucking tired to do anything of even to care’

When I was pregnant I wouldn't have expected a seat

This shouldn't even be the dichotomy. On a carriage full of people it is hard to believe that none were able to stand for a pregnant woman who wanted to sit, whilst leaving the disabled person seated.

YA absolutely NBU OP! I’m currently pregnant and struggle to stand for my full commute without keeling over. The bump and badge aren’t usually sufficient for someone to offer a seat, so I quite often have to ask if someone could give up their seat for me but I would never directly ask a specific person for their seat, they might need it as much or more than me. Like you clearly did in this situation!

It would take all my effort not to have unfold the cane, hook it around her ankle and whip the feet out from under her.

I think there must have been a rush sale on lemons in the UK today. There seems to be a lot of tight-lipped old fuckers people with their grumpy faces everywhere.

Fuck her for making you feel like that.

I would’ve struggled to stand when pregnant but I would’ve never expected, let alone asked someone else to move so I could sit. Totally unreasonable and sorry you were made to feel bad, she should be ashamed of herself x

I really wouldn't engage with these rude people. A "no, I can't stand" is more than enough. You don't have to justify yourself, show your cane or tell your life story. You have a right of privacy! It's no one business what your disability is.

You did the right thing.

Dh had a similar dilemma last week. He had a mini stroke or TIA & was sent from A & E to see the Stroke Co-ordinate. He was asked to wait in the relatives room & there were lots of elderly, quite inform people without seats giving him (a fit looking early 40’s bloke) funny looks. He felt very under pressure to give up his seat. Luckily after about 10 minutes they came & hooked him up to a machine so people could see he was a patient.

Somebody asked if I'm fat - a little. I'm chubby, I gained a lot of weight because of new meds (antidepressants) and feeling like shit since diagnosis. I was alright about a year ago and my health and ability to walk has tanked, especially when I'm flaring.

There were zero seats on the train though, I'll say that! The entire train was packed - even first class was completely full which is where I eventually moved when people cleared out around Derby area.

Also: When I mean it was packed, I mean you literally couldn't move for people/luggage etc. It was person to person all the way down the carriage and in the inbetween areas. If you wanted the loo at any point you were pretty screwed so I was probably the only seat she could have.