To think we should do away entirely with school holidays?

[SkaPunkPrincess]

Just musing and wondering why we don't just do away with them entirely?

Run schools like a regular workplace in that they operate 52 weeks of the year, Teachers and students to get 4 weeks allocated holiday allowance per year and parents can use this at their discretion. Staff would be able to be more flexible and they would have more time in the year to teach children at a more realistic pace?

Am I missing why this isn't a genius idea?

I am inclined to say that nursing and teaching seem to be the most stressful professions that require minimum undergraduate degree and the pay doesn't reflect the stress, hours, physical and mental well being.

Going back to the original question, I think the OP, or people who think like this, don't think beyond early primary school. By secondary school there are so many fixed points, such as exams, coursework, university application time, pre-release exam work etc, that this would not work!

The long summer holidays are fantastic for kids. Life isn't all about academic achievement.

The long summer holidays are fantastic for some kids. Others can't wait to get back.

Probably the absolute worst idea I've ever seen on Mumsnet! YABVVVVVVU!!

Genius idea?!

Not even remotely.

This term at my school is 16 weeks and everybody is knackered. Thankfully we are on shorter days at the moment as it is Ramadan but were it not for that I genuinely think everybody from kindergarten up to grade 12 plus teachers would just have collapsed.

Children need regular holidays. And they need more than 20 days a year off.

I was born and bread in Finland, the school summer holiday is 10 weeks. Parents arrange the child care in between camps, holiday clubs, grand parents and mostly - leave the kids alone at home during the day (usually age of 8 and above). Bearing in mind a regular work day is shorter than in the UK, usually finished by 4pm and home soon after as the long commute isn't as common there.

I know this wouldn't work in the UK as the culture is so different what it comes to leaving children alone at young age as well as the long working hours.

But hell no for shortening the six week summer holiday. I personally think 10 weeks is bit too long, FOR OUR family 7 weeks would be perfect but six weeks is pretty good compromise. To make is shorter would just be awful. PP described it being like something out of communist China, parents and children living for the work. Wasn't far off.

Also, considering England has one of the shortest school summer holiday breaks in the world (if not shortest?) and yet the parents whine constantly how it is too long. I also don't know any other country where they claim the long summer holiday is detrimental to children's learning. Why is pitiful six weeks so detrimental to English kids? It's the working culture that needs a shake up, not the school holidays.

Also if the schools would run like the OP suggested, I bet there would be a lot of kids who would be there 52 weeks a year. Sadly there are way too many parents who would just book a holiday to themselves but leave the kids at school if it was an option.

"The long summer holidays are fantastic for kids."

Not for all of them.

As many have said, I echo that this is a terrible idea for children.

However, I also recall the huge shock to the system at 17 when I got a real job and discovered real life. But I wasn’t a child by then really. Perhaps there needs to be a more gradual build up? Maybe not school/education but mandatory extras (like the national citizen thing, or voluntary work or extra skills (touch typing or languages?) if you can’t prove you have a paid job for the holidays so that as our children become adults they are more ready for the reality of just 4 weeks off a year?

I would be interested to know where the money will come from to pay the higher salaries bill? I am a TA and am paid hourly. The extra hours would equate to almost an extra £2000 on my salary alone. That's without paying teachers for the extra hours they'd be working. Financially,
schools are struggling badly enough as it is, how does the OP propose they miraculously find all this extra money? Or does OP believe that people should work the extra hours for free?

i can tell that you OP obviously spend the entire school
holiday scheduling your DCs into every camp /club/class you can find just to avoid spending time with them

Banana, the hard of thinking who propose this kind of thing ALWAYS think school staff should work the extra weeks for free. They are so bitterly resentful of the long holidays, they gleefully anticipate all those lazy teachers getting their holidays slashed by 60% and no more money because obviously, if you work term time only you don’t live in ‘the real world’. They never stop to think about TAs and other school staff anyway but if they did I’m sure they’d begrudge you the perks as well. Apparently, if you don’t live a life of relentless grind then you don’t understand reality - and these people’s lives are so empty and their imaginations do stifled that when they imagine change it comes at the sacrifice of their children rather than imagining a world where work didn’t supersede everything else - for everyone.

The OP’s boneheaded nonsense would see the immediate resignation of everyone working in a school, as just one of the myriad things which are utterly stupid about it.

Those of you wondering where the extra money would come from, don't worry. I, (and I suspect most other teachers) would be off looking for jobs with better pay and conditions.
*honeyishrunkthekids' I am confused by your comments about minimum undergraduate degrees; my PGCE required a minimum 2:1 from a Russell Group university. I have since (during one government initiative which said teachers should have masters degrees) completed a masters in my 'spare' time (while working full time) and a second masters level sen qualification (again completed in my own time).
Back to the original idea though, apart from there being no teachers left I do think that adult life is rubbish enough and school has already lost the fun that we used to have; the holidays do keep a lot of kids going too. I do think however more affordable child care options are needed for the existing hols for families who don't have holidays matching school holidays.
As a teacher i would be very happy losing up to two weeks from the summer hols to have longer on other hols and better spacing, in particular in that awful autumn term (eg going back mid august, a week off mid-late September, another Early-mid November).

Clairedelalune

Maybe I wasn't clear
Nursing and teaching are two of the lowest paid jobs which require the minimum qualification of an undergraduate degree. As in you need a degree to become one and further study is usually expected.

With you now 😀

I have always thoght schools should remain ipen almost year round.

However:
caretakers in secondary schools are there all the time, until 9pm in shifts and need a break.
Support staff would need a hefty increase in wages.
Teachers would need a hefty increase in wages.
I thought bring in the extra curricular providers during the holidays would be a good idea so children can still attend the same schools on the same buses with their peers but not following a formal day.

However,
When would the building get painted?
When would building repairs be done? It isnt like doing a Repair in a workplace and people just aVoid it. These are children. Some of them are naughty.

And finally, the statutory minimum for holiday in this country is 5.6 weeks, not 4. Or are we sticking with bank holidays? (I know a boy who due to his naughtiness his family sent him to school on eid while they celebrated at home.)

As teachers we cannot take holidays in term time for any reason and it can be frowned upon to even take leave for sickness. If you did away with school holidays, explain when we would take our holidays? It would always mean we missed a week or two with our students and would require covering.

Further to that, children desperately need a break and they need life experiences outside of the classroom. Also, we are not Victorians.

Also pah at requiring a ‘minimum undergraduate degree’. I don’t know a teacher with less than a 2:1.

YABU. My DC need that time to rest and just be kids. Also, when are schools supposed to have major refurbishment done?

Crazy idea OP, financially and educationally.

What is needed is a better system of providing good but reasonably priced child care for working parents and an additional system for supporting poorer children who don't need all day care but who miss out on other things through with holiday clubs providing lunches and access to online personalised education.

Strange as it may seem I think we have slightly shorter school holidays that many other countries, it would be interesting to find out how they cope with the long summer break.

Personally I would hate childhood to be reduced to 48 weeks of compulsory schooling, we might as well just hand children over to the state at birth though in that case obviously they would have to be tattooed with the parents details so you could reclaim them, or not , once they are eighteen.

Sprinkles in DD's case it's because she's an introvert. Video lessons at home would be ideal for her. She comes home and flops on her bed every afternoon and I only see her for supper and to say goodnight.

Mousefunky

As stated on my next post I meant the minimum qualification of an undergraduate degree. Not the levels you can obtain during that undergrad.
You basically study for 3 years or more for a very low wage.

But yes I do know teachers with 2.2 degrees. Mainly men, mainly early years.

School isn't childcare, just like my aunt isn't providing childcare right now, she's having my DC so they can experience the countryside and do things I can't afford.