To discourage DS's friendship with this boy

[ALiensAbductedMe]

Genuinely not sure if I am unreasonable. I have a son (9) who is friends with another boy. The boy is high functioning autistic. I am friendly with the mother and we have younger cchildren the same age so often get together. When they play, the friends son is often rude to my son and will shout in his face. My son acknowledges that it's due to the autism and tries not to take it to heart. His younger sister (5) is awaiting a similar diagnosis so we have some insight.

My issue is that the boy will continue to be rude and mean to my son and his mother will never correct him, instead she just soothes him and cuddles him while he calls my son names and shouts. The most recent example was when we went there to play and the friend got cross over my son having won an award at school that day and refused to speak to him. My son ended up sitting and playing alone and was so disappointed he cried. When the friend and his mum saw this they just completely ignored he was upset and went and watched a film together. When I gently pointed out that he was crying and wanted to play the mum just cuddles him tighter while the boy says he hates him and shouts it loudly for my son to hear. The mother says nothing.

Now I have a 5 year old awaiting diagnosis as I said, and I know it can be tough when your child gets upset, but even at 5 I would not let my DD be mean or rude to her friends. She doesn't always understand social situations and how to cope with them, but I see my role as trying to guide her through them and develop strategies to cope and maintain the important relationships and friendships she has. Like my son's friend, despite the high functioning she does understand what acceptable behaviour is in terms of being mean, and when she doesn't understand or behaves in a way that is unacceptable it is still my job to teach her and correct her.

I have become a bit distant with this friend lately because although I do understand, I don't see that my son should keep being subjected to this behaviour. My son also needs to learn that being shouted at and called names is not ok and that he doesn't have to put up with it. So, am I being unreasonable in distancing myself, especially knowing that the boy doesn't have many friends as it is? WWYD?

@PuttinOnTheRitzCracker I don't want her to shout at him, but in her place I would either explain to him that his words are hurtful and not to shout, or of this is likely to upset him further I would at least acknowledge the other child and apologise on his behalf.

Yes it can putting but it is unpleasent for op ds, he does not have to be exposed to that. That is why leaving the play dates for now is best, if you do meet up, be prepared to leave if the boy starts that behaviour again and explain to the mum why.

ALiens tgat is exactly what my friend ones with her ds who has High functioning Autism. She gave play dates a break, but mused to see her when the kids were at school, as her ds used to be mean to my own Autistic dd, who was confused as to what was happening.

You have to support your DS. We have had a similar issue with a friend of DS' who has high-functioning asperger's .
DS' cousin has autism so he understands (as much as an 8-yr-old can) but ultimately he feels threatened and frightened by his friend shouting loudly in his face. In our case, it happens at school too and they make no attempt to manage or mitigate it.

Sorry I don't buy this. The woman may have to 'calm' or 'soothe' her son at that moment but that doesn't excuse the fact there was a guest - a child, in her house crying and she ignored it. She could have at least gone to your son and apologised to him, saying it's not a good time to talk to ×××××× right now but I will tell him that his behaviour made you sad. If she didn't want to leave her son, she should have phoned your son later and acknowledged he had felt upset in her home. It all seems very one sided, your son is trying to be understanding and she is not trying to understand what it must be like for your son on the receiving end.

I would stop the play dates for now. Go and see your friend if you want to but I arrange your son to go on other play dates whilst you are there. If she asks where he is be honest and say 'He was upset and crying last time we came, he would prefer to play with -'

She let her son say he hates yours, she didn't reprimand him for this.

That's all you really need to know about the type of person she is, and the type of nasty behaviour she is going to continue to reinforce.

Walk away, life's to short to spend time with mean people.

By continuing this friendship you will be teaching your son that's it's ok to accept being shouted at and hated. It's not ok.

İts not really about Wether or not youre being unreasonable. The fact is with the best will in the world you'll never stop a kid playing with another kid

Sounds like your son is more tolerant of learning disabilities than you and you probably need to educate yourself. You say you understand why but then you can’t understand why this boy isn’t acting in a neurotypical way. Why not speak to your son or the Mum instead of isolating this boy even further.

@Guacamoledip Have you even read what I am saying? I am not saying they can't be friends, simply that I will have less visits while her son continues to scream and shout at my son. So should I teach my son that it is ok for people who are meant to be our friends to scream that they hate him? To accept poor treatment from others because that is what he is worth? Yes my son is tolerant, because I have always taught tolerance and understanding, but surely not at the expense of your own emotional well-being. Also, if you read it was not the child's behaviour I was upset about but the mother's behaviour in not acknowledging my son's distress or that her child repeatedly causes it with not even a word of being corrected or an apology.

I do understand why the boy is behaving on this way, what I do not understand is why the mother does not acknowledge the impact this has on my son. Does him being neurotypical mean that his feelings and responses are less important?

Guacamole if you bothered to read the whole thread properly, you’d realise that OP does have empathy towards children who don’t necessarily behave in a ‘neurotypical’ way - her own DC is awaiting assessment.
Why don’t you stop being so reactionary and read threads properly?

@Awwlookatmybabyspider I am happy for them to play together, just wondering if it would be best to just play at school as there seems there is no conflict when at school?

I think that you need to have a chat with the mother and explain to her that you want them to be friends but they get along better at school so it may be better to limit contact out side if school for a little while and see how they get on outside of school in a few months time.

I wouldn’t have any chats with the mother about it directly - she seems to be the crux of the problem. She may deflect and suggest “oh well let’s just try this...” blah blah...

Guacamole op and her ds have been very tolerant towards the boy, and she is on here asking for opinions. As her ds mother, she has every right to protect him from abuse, and not exposing her son to that is part of it. It does not sound like the boy is ready for playdates yet, and his mum has to find a way of dealing with his behaviour. Nobody is saying that she should not have a friendship with the mother, she should do, of course, but when the boys are at school. The mother doing nothing about it, not even acknowledging her ds behaviour and apologising to ds about it, is going to further isolate him.

Just tell her that you would prefer to meet her when ds are at school, as its easier. No need for a little chat, or anything.

If she asks why, just tell her that your ds finds her ds behaviour towards him distressing and upsetting, and feel that playdates together are not a good idea at the moment, and that they seem to get on really well at school so they can play together then. REally if she is clued up, she would know this already.

I'd discourage the friendship. Sorry for the boy's disability but that doesn't mean your son should have to suffer. Put your own child first and if the friendship isn't benefiting him it needs to stop.

YANBU my son has autism and can come across as quite rude sometimes but it's my job to remind my son that that is not how he behaves. He can lash out at his brother and sister sometimes, which again is not acceptable and he will be punished for it i.e he loses his form of entertainment for an hour etc, his autism is not an excuse for him to go round doing whatever he wants without consequence as that's not how the world works! It may take him longer to understand but he does know right from wrong. Yes every parent is different and it is very challenging being an asd/special needs mum but to me she should be telling him that it isn't nice to speak like he is to your son

YANBU

The biggest problem here is the mother. She sounds the type who'd excuse bad behaviour even if he was NT. The autism almost sounds like a red herring in this case.

As the boys appear to play nicely at school I'd let that continue so long as your son is okay with that (although it'd probably be impossible to prevent them playing together at school anyway). But I absolutely would not allow them to play together outside of school. That wouldn't be negotiable on my end. Your son doesn't deserve to be treated like that no matter what the circumstance.

At the absolute very least, the other mother should be apologising to your son on behalf of her son, but she can't/won't even do that, and that's not okay. Frankly, at this point, I wouldn't want to see the mother at all, with or without the son. Does she have any other children and if so, does she discipline them?

@emmyrose2000
Thanks, that's an interesting point about the other children and her parenting. She also has a five year old whom she 'babies' I would say (dummy and bottle in evenings still, if she behaves badly she will say it's because she is so small) I have never seen her actually correct the five year old either... But that's not to say she doesn't at other times, and her five year old is quite well behaved anyway to be honest. I think with her brother whatever she does pales in comparison.

Yes the brother is like that as it is part of his Autism, that is no excuse to ignore yiur ds feelings and acknowledge his behaviour towards yiur ds, even if it is apologising herself on behalf of her ds(like my friend used to), and tell him that those words and shouting isent kind. With my friend, we did not see them ich in the holidays because her ds found it difficult to cope with other kids there, and she preferred not to ask people round. We wou,d meet up for dinner in the evenings or during school time.

I would be guided by what you DS wants. It sounds like he does understand that the behaviour is caused by autism so if he still wants to meet up and be friends with this boy I would supervise but not discourage it. If it's upsetting your DS and he doesn't want to see the boy as a result then absolutely don't force him, just see your friend outside of playdates.

@ALiensAbductedMe I understand that - however, even a non-shouty telling off can be HUGELY upsetting and stressful for an autistic child. I completely see what you’re saying but it’s a really difficult line to tread.

I’m in two minds because your son should not have to put up with difficult behaviour, but I think for other posters it’s incredibly easy to say “cut him off” because they’ve never had to be the autistic child who came home from school every day and cried because their peers bullied and pointedly excluded them.

Yanbu at all.

Just a thought but if the mum feels she is soothing/cuddling to limit her DS anxiety/distress, then perhaps she needs to look at what is causing the distress and outbursts. Is it the game (too intense?) for example?

When her son refused to interact with yours because your DS won an award, then if DS was not happy to play alone, you leave and arrange another time for them to play, or just to meet up alone with the mum for a cuppa. This can happen with neurotypical kids (not handling others winning awards) and you can't force them to deal with it emotionally there and then so you leave whilst mum deals with it. The mum, on recognising her DS's distress, should've said "oh dear, I think we should rearrange for another day when my DS is feeling better", apologised and let you go, not taking her DS to sit and watch a film ignoring you both!

Some kids with ASD can be OK in school because they are "holding it together" and then melt down afterwards when they let their emotions out. Or it might be that school is more structured so feels safer as there are rules on what is happening, but home life can be very different with a looser structure, especially if there are siblings whose needs also have to be met.

I would OP suggest that if your DS wants to see his friend outside of school, it's when that friend can handle it. Your DS shouldn't feel like he has to accept being the target of a meltdown.