To be worried about Norfolk holiday as an ethnic minority?

[Faffandahalf]

I’m from London.

Going to north Norfolk in the summer. It’s been booked. Research showed it was a beautiful part of the UK. Want to do more UK hols.

We’ve been to Cornwall which seemed ok, the Cotswold we were openly stared at.

But now I’m doing some more reading and turns out Norfolk is horribly racist.

We are Asian. Me DH, 2 young kids. My sister is coming too...she wears a headscarf but very modern dress...jeans and hoodie etc. I don’t wear a headscarf. But we are all brown!

Are we going to get trouble? We’ve booked a cottage in a lovely little village which I imagine doesn’t see many brown folks.

I don’t venture out of London much and forget it’s a different world out there sometimes.

I just want a nice holiday without being gawped at.

My friends holiday in Sheringham regularly. They are Asian and they love it there.

When people say it’s not a witech hunt or wicker man blah blah they obviously don’t understand the nuances of racism.

I don’t want my children being stared at. Some people think that’s ok, not a big deal. That I jusvhave to deal with ignorance because it’s a small place etc.

No. I don’t want my 7 year old asking why people are staring at him or whispering about him or turning away from him or being rude to us etc.

Racism is on a continuum. It’s not just people shouting Paki.

I don’t appreciate being told I’m offending people. With what? What are clearly, based on some of the posts, legitimate concerns.

In London my children have never felt ‘other’.

It’s really hard to explain your fears without being ridiculed.

DS2 is at uni in Norwich and he’s seen racism. I grew up in the Cotswolds and regularly saw racism. My sister”s DH and their children have experienced racism in the Cotswolds. There’s racists everywhere unfortunately.

Norfolk is beautiful. I do hope you have a lovely holiday.

samantha I’m
Not hysterical, merely responding to posts but but thanks for whitesplaining to me that I’m probably just being paranoid about being stared at and that white peoples get stared at too. Cheers

Thank you fairy

I think any rural UK area with lots of older white people who've perhaps not travelled lots will have problems but here it would be limited to an old country boy looking a second too long at most.

Got to love a bit of casual ageism. I think you'll find that most hate crimes (which of course include racism) are committed by young males rather than old people.

Hi OP. I just wanted to offer some support against the posts saying you're being unreasonable and generalising and not to worry etc.

I don't know what it's like to have to think carefully about there I go due to the prejudice of others, I'm white. But I have experienced seeing my Asian partner get stares, abuse, gawping, everything in some places we go. It's so bad if I fancy a day at the seaside I go alone or with friends as it's just not worth the emotional stress for him.

I don't know Norfolk so I can't help really. I just wanted to say that if you're white and only hang out with other white people you likely haven't a clue the amount of stress it can cause to go certain places in the UK (and abroad) while being brown! I was ignorant completely before meeting my partner and I'm sure I still very largely am. Sorry that people are choosing to focus on the idea that you're generalising over the actual reality of what you're talking about.

I'm originally from Norfolk very sad to think that anyone would be nervous of going there because of racism. It's a lovely place to visit.
Norwich is very international university city. There were ethnic minorities at school and in the city when I was there 35 years ago.
I have walked into a village pub more recently and experienced the whole pub turning around and doing the 'you're not from round here' look - nothing to do with skin colour - they all go back to their conversations once they have been entertained by watching you order your drinks (clearly the highlight of the evening).
Parts of n.n.(but away from tourist areas) can be a little wierd - i stopped and asked an old man for directions - he looked at me as if I was talking foreign until I repeated the question in my best broadest Norfolk.

We were there last year around the tourist areas and although still a majority are white there was a big mix of people.

Thanks walking and everyone else who has tried to support me against claims of reverse racism and goadiness.

I wouldn’t say I’m less concerned now having read about people’s experiences of racism in Norfolk but I’ll just be getting on with it like I was planning to anyway.

Might revisit the thread post hols and let you all know how it went!

Cley's lovely, OP, although the traffic can be a bit much in the summer (think narrow main road and people parking like bastards). Mumsnetters should decamp en masse there just for the parking threads it could offer. It is one of the villages that all the Londoners decamp to, so you shouldn't feel like you're being stared at.

And you're quite right, as a white person from Norfolk, I have no idea how it feels to be the only 'other' person in a place. I'm sorry if my and others responses have made you feel a bit got at. I hope you have a great time here.

Another top tip - go graffiti hunting in the church on a rainy day PM me if you want to have any more tips on good places to go before I start sounding like the tourist information service.

Afraid I've heard this too, from friends who are trying to move out

They basically told me to gird myself for comments if I visit. I fucking hate being treated as a novelty as well, it's not just the outright shouting, it's that I hate going anywhere that people will be surprised to see someone who isn't white.

I know some of its sheer luck but my friends' comments were quite worrying.

Please let us know how things went. x
Try to think positive, the more brown folk visit the less likely the next brown person will seem like a novelty, someone has to start to change expectations.

Im Asian. I live in Norwich, but I work all over Norfolk. Admittedly mainly North Norfolk, which is where Cley is. I see loads of Black and Asian people around me, even by the sea. I have never experienced any racism here or staring. Every 5th person I bump into has moved here from London or is on holiday here from London.

Walking, wondering which seaside areas your partner avoids but I realise you might not want to say.

That's a very sweeping statement about Norfolk!!
Of course they are not racist as a county!.
Good grief.
Just go and have a really lovely holiday OP and don't worry.
Remember racists are idiots who know nothing about you.
It's a beautiful county,I hope the weather is lovely for you.

Oh thanks sadeyed. I am a crazy itinerary person so have lots on my list.

Tell me what you think
Holkam Hall
Wells beach
Hunstanton beach?
The broads for a day to do the boats
Bewilder wood
The steam railway that runs from Holt to sherrinfham I think (am just trying to remember off the top of me head)
Mooching around some of the nearby villages/towns though the kids will be bored of that.
Thetford forest on the way up or back for some cycling

Just reading through threads above - I have never seen golliwogs in Norfolk - EVER.
MY kids are also English /( swiss)German bilingual and we have never experienced any negativy regarding language in Norfolk. Confuses people when we switch languages but that happens everywhere we go.

In Norwich you'd be absolutely fine. It's changed enormously in the last 20 years or so and is now far more ethnically diverse.

Somewhere like Cley - tbh I think there will almost certainly be some staring. But I'd like to think it won't be staring with any malice - it'll just be the novelty thing and I certainly hope you wouldn't get any rudeness or hostility. That's not something I've ever witnessed. I appreciate knowing that won't make it any easier for you to deal with, though. That said, North Norfolk is so touristy now that the residents must be far more familiar with differences than they were. If it helps, Cley is beautiful. I really hope it all works out well for you and your family - it's a lovely part of the world.

There's a theme park at Lowestoft (just over the border) called Pleasurewood Hills. It's no Chessington or Alton Towers, but if your children are younger they'd probably love it.

Bewilderwood is great. If you like zoos Banham is very good.

I’m from Norfolk and don’t consider myself racist.
I can understand your concerns though. My Bil who is originally from Zimbabwe feels very uncomfortable when he visits from London.

Please do update OP! It'll come up for everyone who has posted.

I absolutely love that the white posters on this thread saying there's no racism in Norfolk and to ask if there is any is offensive are displaying beautifully the exact issue underlining this thread: that if you're white, you just wouldn't know. You wouldn't know about the stares and abuse and ostracising. You wouldn't know how it feels to walk into a pub and have every single person stop and stare at you because of the colour of your skin. Let the fact that the OP's question is so incredible and unbelievable to you be your insight into how little overt and covert racism goes on day in, day out in England.

OP thanks for this thread. I'm Asian too, my partner is White British and I often think the same. More so when we go on UK holidays than abroad actually. We live in. Cotswold's village and I honestly haven't experienced racism but I do agree about pubs feeling more like I'm being stared at. We went to Norfolk at Christmas and found everyone we spoke to really friendly, I hope that gives you some reassurance. You aren't paranoid for asking about this, honestly, those of us who have felt the same way totally understand.

Residents being older/fearful of change and others moving in does not make it OK to make someone else feel small!

It's not just stereotypically racist places either, we've experienced it in big cities like Leeds, Manchester, York. Trying to find a decent pub before a show, walking in, my OH saying let's find somewhere else and going straight out again. Because he's made to feel like an oddity or curiosity at best. Which is racism whichever way you slice it.

Oh Faff. I think you have a point.
I live in and i am from one of the places you have mentioned.
The thing is is that everybody knows everybody for generations, so somebody from even 10 miles away is seen as other.
I hope you have a lovely time, remember it’s them not you.

Also apologies as I'm aware it comes across like I think I have any idea just because I'm in a relationship with someone who deals with it: I know it's a totally different experience witnessing it than being the subject, and that it's something I see at certain times instead of live with every day. I just wanted to offer support, and now I feel like I'm whitesplaining racism 😭 (Not real white tears 😂)

Have a great holiday OP.