DofE badly organised

[Cora1942]

Dd doing DofE today .
School have given out 3 man tent to carry. Fair enough they have to carry. But main part of tent is groundsheet, fly sheet etc all in one so can’t be split up.
So one girl carries this and others pegs, poles and cooking equipment.
My Dd fitted 4kg tent plus all her equipment in her rucksack.
She could t fit in a pair of spare trousers so left behind. One of the other girls took her plate and bowl.
But third girl refused to take anything . Turns out girls 2 and 3 have small rucksacks.
So AIBU to expect the school to have checked rucksack sizes before trip and insist it’s a team thing .
I can see my Dd carrying heavy tent for two days as other students not prepared .

The whole thing is a complete waste of everyone's time anyway

Ha, ha. DD learnt so much about herself doing DofE - including some home truths. She chose to do DofE Gold as an enrichment subject at sixth form, by-passing bronze and silver. I didn't force her into it.

Her time management skills are ace, her map reading skills enviable and she's not afraid to take charge in a group situation when people need organising. She also knows she's a fusser and a worrier and a bit of a mother hen. She knows the wonder of flip flops after taking off her walking boots and how good long life chicken tikka tastes at 3.00 am because she was too tired to eat it the night before and needed to eat before packing up camp in time to get to the final destination on time.

Most importantly, before DofE, DD wouldn't even pee behind a bush out in the countryside, but the poop scoop changed all that. She's now totally unfazed by any toilet block at a festival.

I was about 8st in my DoE days and my rucksack 3st. 20 years ago, the gear was heavier and there weren't (certainly affordable) women's fit rucksacks etc. There wasn't cheap technical clothing so I was in sodden cotton, and bulky jumpers.

My first bag was 25l with all sorts hanging off it but at least it fitted my back! I then aquired a 65l bag which was hellish as the bag was far too long for my back so hung off the edge of my shoulders, and came down over my buttocks and bounced around for every. single. step. And by the 4 day drenchfest in the Lake District, that was a. lot. of. steps!

I remember on the Bronze practice that there were checks for people who looked ridiculously overloaded, and remember the confiscation of the hairdyer (no electricity on the camping field/ basic toilets), and the 2l bottle of concentrated squash

I got so much out of the award, directly and indirectly. It motivated me to learn to swim and get my 25l badge at 16- to phone up the pool and organise adult lessons took a bit of mustering some confidence. The next stage was to get a Bronze swimming award, a massive leap from 25m... long before completing my Gold DoE Award, I got the Silver swimming award. That gave me the confidence to learn to ride a bike at 19. I joined a walking club at uni and made my best mates and met DH. I've got into Girl Guiding as an adult.

Having a very protective parent, being thrust into the deep end and left to get on with it was so valuable. Nothing other than my own legs was going to get me to where I needed to be and solve the problems along the way. There was a lot of blood, sweat and tears along the way (and some stitches and facial scaring )

There were over 80 of us on the Bronze Practice. 8 people collected their Gold award at Buckingham Palace 5 years later. People tend to flounder on completing and signing off the other sections rather than the expedition.

Such fond memories... the only thing I'd tell my 15 year old self is that I have a nasty intolerance to soya mince and to keep well clear of it...
I still plodded on though. Painfully. So painfully.

I can't envisage a circumstance where either DS or DD would've wanted to do it because they are both well aware of how much of a waste of time and effort it is.

I wonder who gave them that impression, CalF123?

CalF The actual award is neither here nor there for my DD. The bottom line is that without the award neither she nor I would have been motivated / organised enough

Basically it's a pre-school sticker chart for the teenager?

But that's not a bad thing!

Basically it's a pre-school sticker chart for the teenager?

You could see it like that but certainly the expedition aspect is hard to self organise if you don't already have the skills and you're not a guide/scout.

But yes, it is saying, do these things and we'll give you an award.
Just like the badges in scouting really...

I am involved in medical school admissions, and we certainly value DoE Gold (didn’t do it myself so I have no axe to grind here).

We also value playing sport at county level, and playing in youth orchestras. DoE is a lot more achievable for the average person, I would have thought.

(There are other things we look for, such as good grades and evidence of commitment to medicine, but for the “rounded individual” score the DoE is a pretty easy way to tick the box for the average teenager, plus it gives them something to talk about in interview).

Sashkin interesting, and rather worrying how do you manage any sort of equality in recruitment if you value things which are so much defined by middle class privilige?

We also value playing sport at county level, and playing in youth orchestras

Because of course lots of disadvantaged DC play in youth orchestras

How sad for your dc CalF123 that you have influenced them with your bitterness.
I agree with virtually all the points made by the last lot of posters. You are kidding only yourseff CalF123

Well some people might not recognise the DoE if put down on a CV, but what would be recognised is the voluntary work dd does atvthe local library, how she now knows how a workplace operates, how important it is to turn up, be prompt and pull your weight. She has developed customer service skills, how to talk and have posit conversations with people, and how to work alongside others. Her confidence has soared and she has made new friends of all ages.

I call that a success

*positive

Basically it's a pre-school sticker chart for the teenager?

No. I was 25 when I completed my gold. It seemed daft not to complete it while I still had time, and I'd done the most difficult bits. We also had a guy in his 20s join us for our gold expedition, because he wouldn't have been able to do it otherwise, as he was an independent participant.

CalF you have a very warped impression of DofE, I am not sure how that has happened. First of all, DofE is voluntary. If someone is being forced to do it, the fact should be reported to the appropriate authority. For schools this is usually somewhere in the county council.

Secondly, you don't need to do anything new for DofE. By the sounds of it your children could have achieved it by what they were already doing.

Thirdly I also don't know what you mean by bureaucracy as there is practically none. They do something, get an assessor (whoever is in charge of the activity they are doing to write a short report and then they just upload it to eDofE. Actually their assessor can upload it directly so they have practically no admin to do anyway.

Bronze doesn't mean an awful lot really and it isn't meant to - it is supposed to be a stepping stone to silver and gold which show a good level of commitment to something, and this is why they mean something to universities and employers. Obviously you need the grades and qualifications, but many people have those and ways are needed to tell people apart. A university is more likely to take someone with Gold DofE than someone who just plays computer games in their spare time.

On the subject of the original issue, if someone in the group refused to take group kit whole still within their weight limit and therefore forcing others to leave things behind, as an assessor I would consider failing that individual on the expedition. It is supposed to be a group effort. While the organiser (school in this case) has a responsibility to ensure the safety of the group, the group is responsible for their own administration/organisation. That is one of the main points about the expedition!

PMSL at Calf's idea that DofE is full of MC parents forcing their DC to do it. There are whole year groups in schools in the inner city areas of Liverpool champing at the bit to do the DofE. They have a blast and for some of the kids it is their first chance to achieve at something non-academic or non-sporty - as you don't have to be brain of Britain or playing at county level to do it.

As for it counting for nothing, that is just bollocks. How can you say that improving at a skill, a sport or activity, doing some volunteering and working as a team to camp outdoors counts for nothing. What a load of rubbish.

If it was so crap, why have the government spent millions of taxpayers money on the NCS programme trying to replicate what DofE has been doing for 60 odd years?????!!!!!

I think Calf's point was that lots of mc children don't do anything extra for DofE other than the expedition.

Ah, I see Ursula - thank you.

Does that matter? (Not really asking you, just putting it out there.) Do MC kids gain anything less because they already incorporate much of it in their lives already - although I have to say I doubt very much they're all busy volunteering on a weekly basis.

I would love to know what Calf123 recruits for ( mainly so I can advise my children to avoid applying)

Interesting that medical schools do value it. So I will encourage mine to carry on. They both chose to do it. I was barely aware of it - they have both had an absolute blast and extended their friendship groups in school.

Kids learning to deal with a little bit of bureaucracy and be responsible for getting the 'paperwork' done on schedule is a good thing of itself IMO.

Getting the paperwork done is the main thing that stops people completing it rather than failing the expedition or not actually doing the sections.

Because of course lots of disadvantaged DC play in youth orchestras

That was rather my point....