To tell kids’ grandma to stop buying them things as rewards/ joining in with our reward chart

[PlasticDaggers]

I have two DDs, 9 and 5. The 5 year old is very challenging. In order to try to make especially bedtimes and school mornings less of a nightmare we have a reward chart – once they get to the top (by being cooperative, nice to each other, not screaming, getting out of the house without a fuss, going to sleep at a reasonable time Etc. Etc.) they get a sticker, when they get 10 stickers they get to choose something from my box of mostly cheap and cheerful things. The things in there range in cost from 50p to about a fiver but most are about £2/3.

Their grandma loves to buy them crap. I can understand that but it’s unhelpful. She knows we have no space and usually when she gets them more crap it stays at her house. I’m made to feel like the bad guy every time but it’s a given now: crap grandma gives them stays at grandma's. It doesn’t stop them asking to bring it home, though, and then I’m the bad guy again.

She’ll get them stuff and say “have they been good, mum?”.
Well actually, no, they bloody haven’t. The 5 year old is a daily struggle and I really don’t think showering her with lots more plastic crap for no reason other than grandma enjoys giving them stuff is helping. The 9 year old is generally pretty ‘good’ most days, but by giving to one but not the other, more problems are created.

The last time she bought them something, LOL dolls, I explained the chart situation and that giving them stuff all the time is not helping, and also that she's undermining what I am trying to achieve here. She appears to be going along with it, but not really. Because she’s still buying them crap! I just read an email she sent to my eldest to say she’ll buy her some more LOL dolls for when she gets her stickers. FFS.
(The email was riddled with spelling mistakes too which is another AIBU, I encouraged my daughter to write emails to family and friends as a more fun way to practice spelling and receiving replies from adults with typos is not helpful!)
By giving my kids these ‘rewards’ she’s devaluing what I can/want to give them, and it causes more problems because they still want the excitement of choosing something from the box but still want the damn LOL doll too. (They cost between £5-£10 each for anyone who’s not familiar with them.)

She spoils them rotten at birthdays and Christmas, is it unreasonable to ask that she just stops buying them stuff every weekend too?! Not that it would do any good, as I have, and she doesn’t. I feel mean making them leave their crap there but we have no space to keep all this stuff. She does tend to buy them small (in size) stuff so is trying to be considerate of this but it’s still unhelpful due to the fact that we could have all the storage in the world and their rooms would still be a mess. It’s normal for their room to be an utter mess again the day after tidying it. They do not care. I periodically take toys away as they refuse to tidy them up, they have so much that they don’t notice or care.

But it’s the current interference (or if I was being kinder – her trying to participate/help) with our reward chart that is annoying me. It’s not her place, she doesn’t have to deal with the difficulties on a daily basis, or have to battle with them to pick up all the dangerous hard plastic crap they leave on their floor every day. So please stop giving them stuff so they might have more of an incentive to 'earn' stuff by being nicer at home!

I don’t really like the whole reward and punishment thing, I know long term it won’t create changes, but I’m at a loss with my 5 year old’s behaviour at the moment and this helps a bit, it also helps me to see the day as a whole rather than concentrate on the impossible ‘now’ when she’s being very challenging.

Thanks for the replies, it's nice to see it from a different perspective!

Yes they have a nice relationship and I don't want to ruin that. I guess I just feel like I'm struggling sometimes and that being 'spoilt' there will make it worse, but it's true that they know things are different at grandma's so I'll just try to keep what happens there separate from home.

The comment about calling her stuff crap and mine not, yes that's unfair, I'm just annoyed, it's all crap!

It's nice to know I'm not the only one with 9’s and under that don't tidy their room. The 5 year old doesn't at all really, the 9 year old will after much persuasion, then they'll both mess it up to dangerous levels (slipping/tripping over books, standing on painful toys etc) within a day or two.

JessicaJonesJacket Tbh it sounds as though you're frustrated with your 5-yr-old and turning that on to your DMIL instead.
She isn't buying them rewards. She's buying them toys/gifts but because you have made a fuss about your reward system, she feels she needs to check with you if they have been 'good' before giving her gifts. As a PP said, separate them out. If she asks how they have been just say 'oh the reward chart system is still a work in progress but your gifts aren't connected to their behaviour. They're just because you're their granny!'
As for your comment about her spelling, you're just being unnecessarily rude.

I actually didn’t make a fuss about the reward system really. She’s done the "I've got something for you, have they been good, mum?’ thing for ages. It was only recently I mentioned it when they were both close to their 10 stickers and then she pipes up with these new gifts. It just dampens the excitement and incentive to be more cooperative, so I mentioned what we were trying to do.

But yes, I’ll tell her if she really wants to buy them things to just give them the stuff but not to tie it to behaviour, let us keep that for us at home.

AmazingPostVoices – that’s another thing, pocket money! They’ll pay the kids for doing little jobs, and yes, give them lots more than we do. It’s not all about the cost really, but trying to help them understand the value of money- being given a pound at grandma’s for washing a few dishes (poorly- they’d need redoing!) results in them being completely disinterested in earning pocket money at our house!

It’s actually my DM.

Seriously I think you're being a bit unreasonable, controlling and condescending towards your MIL. I doubt very much that your children are able to associate that grandmas' gifts don't follow the rule system - particularly not a 5 year old.

Let grandma time be grandma time. The kids will realise they're allowed treats at grandmas but at home they still have to follow your rules.

The worry if that the DC know that the GP will buy them stuff regardless of the behaviour which will make the OPs life more difficult.

I don't think YABU, could you ask her to put the money she would have spent in a savings account so that your DC can choose something themselves every so often or when they have been extra good?

Buglife I agree completely which is why I've tried to avoid the whole reward chart thing, just little else seems to work at the moment.

Ahh, funny how we assumed it was the MIL. Don't even get me started on my mother.

You sound like you don't like her very much. I'm surprised she's your DM

I'm not surprised this is your DM, mine is very similar!!

With us though it's constant sugary treats. Every weekend if we meet up there's cake/biscuit/sugary drinks. Plus a toy, obviously

All under the guise of "I can spoil my DGC if I want, it's my right"

But actually, it's tipped over into just plain old undermining me as a parent.

I've tried and tried and tried to ask nicely and constructively if the sweet things/toys could be reigned in. I don't think it's healthy to have this volume of sugar/tat on a weekly basis. It also leaves no room for DH and I to "treat" the kids.

I just get blamed for being mean and that I should let DM do whatever she wants. I disagree so now we just see her less.

Plastic why not ask your Mum to buy books instead? That works well for us.

I think others have suggested some approaches on the toys which sound good. But I think YABU on her spelling. I totally understand that you want your children to be able to write English well, but your being unreasonable criticising her for poor English. It's important that she does keep in touch with them and email is a good, postive way sometimes. My own Dad is semi-literate and was not educated well (left school at 13) and both my boys know that whilst it's ok for Grandad to get it wrong (because he's old) they need to work on their English to get it right. They appreciate him staying in touch and contacting them even if the email has lots of mistakes.

The spelling thing - she works in education for goodness sake, she should be able to email a 9 year old without making mistakes. A lot of it is carelessness I think, she doesn't check before pressing send, though she does make some of the types of mistakes that would cause outrage on Mumsnet if they were sent home from school! The whole point of encouraging DD to write emails was because she's struggling with spelling so getting replies with mistakes is counter productive!

Yes, I have supressed issues with my Mum. She genuinely loves her grandkids and would do anything for us, but it's hard for me to get perspective on what's 'ok genuine loving grandparent' stuff and what I have a right to be annoyed with. She means well but she's also done and continues to do things I've specifically asked her not to. Nothing major, just enough to grate on me. She thinks she knows best, and goes all weird and awkward when I try to talk to her about things. I wanted to keep it more of a 'grandma' thing rather than 'my mother who I have issues with' thing and avoid pointless rambles such as this.

You haven't addressed the comments re your criticism of spelling mistakes.
That is really nasty, and quite belittling of your mother. You sound like you dislike her, tbh.

x post.

God, my DD would love your Mum - I hate LOL dolls with a passion.

So...what I would do is get another box, label it Granny Grand Prize/Grandma Goodies and MAKE HER put all of her gifts into that box. Circle on your reward chart the star for 30 or 50 stars (up to you, I would do 30 if it is normally one a day) then they have a monthly
gran(d) prize.

• She feels involved and helpful
• They get the tat but have to earn it
• Your ten star system goes on as before

My just-turned 6 year old's behaviour can be horrendous and my mum loves to spoil her. It doesn't interfere with our reward system here where the kids earn marbles for their jar for a dip in the box of plastic shite because I've never linked the two or made a fuss at all.

Mum can tend to go a bit nuts on the present buying thing - both kids are mad on playmobil and the amount she has stockpiled for birthdays and Christmases is insane (and tear inducing in that I'll have to build the whole lot) but we had no spare cash at all when me and my brother were kids and it's just her way of trying to give them the childhood that she couldn't give us - and I get that. At least she tries to hook in with toys that the kids like and enjoy.

They're also beautifully behaved at their grandparents as a general rule - so yeah - if she rewards them for being good for nanna (she'd kill me if I referred to her as grandma) and they HAVE been good I have no issues in that. She'd sharpish tell them off and me if they were misbehaving!

I don't think that you are being unreasonable. You have a whole reward system and pocket money system set up and being showered with toys and given money for old rope by your dm is totally undermining that. My dm always asks me whether ds could have a special outing with her or to let her know when she can give him a present. But I guess I often let her give rewards, take ds for treats, give presents at the right moment, so I don't think that she would ever feel shut out by me.

Alternatively if it is clutter we are talking about then tell her that and ask her to put money into a savings account for them instead - I would have suggested the children's bonds but they stopped them last September. Serious suggestion - as you say the LOL are five to ten quid each - all that adds up and bingo, they have a uni fund or deposit fund or buy driving lessons fund from their grandma when they reach 18.

Yes, I have supressed issues with my Mum. She genuinely loves her grandkids and would do anything for us, but it's hard for me to get perspective on what's 'ok genuine loving grandparent' stuff and what I have a right to be annoyed with. She means well but she's also done and continues to do things I've specifically asked her not to. Nothing major, just enough to grate on me. She thinks she knows best, and goes all weird and awkward when I try to talk to her about things. I wanted to keep it more of a 'grandma' thing rather than 'my mother who I have issues with' thing and avoid pointless rambles such as this

OP your last post really resonated with me. I could have written this word for word.

It's really difficult to know what is typical GM behaviour and what's crossed a line. I know it doesn't help but I find it reassuring to know I'm not alone in this. Sometimes I feel like I'm going mad, especially when DM throws a histrionic hissy fit when I try and put up what I think is a perfectly reasonable boundary.

If your DM is like mine, then I'd have to tell her straight that her actions arent helpful. It would have to be framed in the context of a shit sand which - you know how much DGC love you DM, however this isn't helping please can you stop, the DGC really do think your fab wiithout all these treats.

Obviously though this won't actually work and she'll spit her dummy out and not speak to you for ages 🙏🏻

Then you can just reduce contact.

I think she sounds like a lovely Grandma and...to be honest, you sound a bit of a killjoy with the email writing practise, judging Grandma's literacy levels, and general slightly snobbish attitude towards Grandma and all her works.

You crack on with the reward charts, and let her be the lovely kind Grandparent who buys them fun stuff for no reason.

MyNameIsTotoro The food thing is another thing... it's often literally a constant flow of junk at their house. She doesn't listen to my requests to just give them one or two snacks, hell three or four things would be ok! She goes all weird and awkward when I remind her, so we just limit our time there. Which is really sad as we live close by.

I don’t think she’s as bad as your mother, but then I don’t know if it’s mostly just me and I’m just controlling or unreasonable or justified in wanting her to listen to my wishes? She doesn’t go off in a sulk or get angry or anything, she just goes quiet when I try to talk to her about things, or will blatantly lie about what she's done/said, little white lies, or she’ll do a weird (and frustrating) thing of just changing the subject and talking to the kids like I’ve said nothing at all so I don’t feel heard by her.
And when she final listens about stopping the junk food it’s “mummy says no” or if she ever DOES stop the constant flow of sugar on her own it’s with “that’s enough now or mummy will shout at me and won’t let you come again.” So she KNOWS I don’t want them having so much junk food, and surely also knows that if she’d just stop they’d get to come over a lot more?!
I try to not make a big issue out of it, and seethe quietly inside as talking to her is useless.

NotMyFirstRodeo that's a really good idea.

I wish she would just put money in their savings account, but I think she just really likes to give them 'things'.
And book giving I put no limit on, despite behaviour, my 9 year old loves to read which I encourage, and although I want them to be excited about getting books as gifts, I'm more than happy for them to get new books for no special reason.

Tawdrylocalbrouhaha I think she sounds like a lovely Grandma and...to be honest, you sound a bit of a killjoy with the email writing practise, judging Grandma's literacy levels, and general slightly snobbish attitude towards Grandma and all her works.

You crack on with the reward charts, and let her be the lovely kind Grandparent who buys them fun stuff for no reason.

Yep, I will let her, I think, but let them know they're getting stuff because grandma's kind rather than it being part of our reward chart.

DD is quite keen on the emailing thing, it's something she enjoys vs regular spelling practice, and she loves getting replies. I think it's totally reasonable to expect someone who works in education to make the effort in spelling, or know how to spell simple words, when writing to a child who's struggling with spelling!

Careful OP. I see where you're coming from, but try to look at the bigger picture. I had a "secret" relationship with my grandmother right up to the day she died (in my twenties!) because she was kind and a refuge to my (in my eyes) strict and mean mother. I actually appreciated things more because of the way my mother held gifts from GM in contempt. Most Grandparents like to spoil their grandkids and to be honest that's how it should be.

OP, I don't think you're being unreasonable about the spelling at all. Asking someone to quickly proof read their emails is completely different from being rude about something they struggle with. It's lovely your DD enjoys writing to people.

Reward charts should at most be a very temporary 'fix' for specific things. Pocket money isn't earned in this house, because chores are the price of living here and we do them for the family not because we are paid.

Honestly, I think your system isn't great and you're blaming your (I get it, she's difficult!) DM. Instead of having a better system to manage behaviour.

Have you read How to talk so children listen...?

This makes me sad

I have that book MrsT, I've had it for ages and still not got around to reading it! I agree, there's certain things I expect them to do and they do them without reward, and I know the reward chart is not a long term solution to our problems and it's actually going in the opposite way that I want and planned to do things, but morning and bedtimes are becoming a nightmare and all my good intentions, logic and tactics seem to be going out of the window.

Thanks, Ianbury, I sometimes look to the future and expect my DDs to end up spending most of their time at their grandma's house because I've become a horrible, grumpy, controlling meanie. It's sometimes hard to see the bigger picture and instead I'm stuck in the day to day stuff of having a stroppy, uncooperative 5 year old, a messy house with a million other things to do and a mother that showers them in chocolate and plastic whose help I can't accept because she won't bloody listen to my wishes. I need to just let some stuff go, I suppose.