Influencer ethics on Instagram

[MadameGrizzly]

Continuing the discussion on whether influencing on Instagram is an ethical business model, particularly around the disclosure of advertising and the over exposure of children.

AIBU to think it isn't a sustainable career unless the influencer is scrupulously ethical?

Not with ham then?

I've been reading your posts in a Spanish accent.

I love a bit of jamon iberico, but alas, not on a crumpet

I think there are parallels with MLMs - the fact IG blogging is presented as a "great way to earn a living around your family!", the fact you are flogging stuff to your friends/followers, the fact that only a few make big money at it. The thing missing for me is the recruitment aspect.

In some ways there are a lot of parallels with investment scams (for the brands), the fact that returns generated directly by the gift/product placement are probably not easily quantifiable, the possibility of fake followers in unscrupulous accounts, and the fake engagement created by bloggers liking and commenting on each other's posts. As a brand, I would want to really check a bloggers credentials and reach thoroughly before engaging with them as the opportunities for creating fake returns on your investment are widespread.

goes to get crumpets from shop

Has anyone mentioned Tigerlilly Quinn on here? She's been doing ads since waaaay back and I think was probably one of the first prolific mummy bloggers. I do remember thinking how transparent she was even years ago and there seems to be less fawning with her. I had to unfollow though as she does relentless ads but advertisers must still be approaching her so there must be success there. She is another who heavily features her kids though and if be interested in her take on it.

I'd not if...

They sort of do recruit a bit though, don't they? In that they recruit people to buy the product. The effect is the same, ie people at the bottom paying.

You are right actually. "All you have to do is follow me, follow Brand X and tag 3 friends (who may or may not want their details tagged but whatevs, details details...) and you could be in with the chance of winning a year's supply of dry shampoo!" They recruit people to follow the brands (and themselves) and get paid by the brands to recruit the new followers as leads for future sales.

Lol yeah I want a crispy crumpet now. We've been 'influenced'. Such fodder 😂

Yeah beans IG threw up tigerlilly to me! Bet she was glad MOD didn't move to Bristol as she said they originally intended to!

The MLM argument is genius. Especially as many influencers believe what they are doing is lofty: I'm here, suffering in St Lucia, for you, my followers.

I bet they look down their noses at MLM just as much as I do. Yet there are absolutely parallels between influencing and multi level marketing.

Something else that hasn't really been touched on is that on MN we post our opinions publicly to be critiqued, agreed with or sometimes deleted. There's very little private discussion between posters - it all happens in public. You know the influencers have chat groups where these threads are discussed - and I bet their private comments aren't as pretty as their public ones.

I bet they can't put their hand on their heart and say behind the scenes they are 'kind at all times'.

A friend of mine has an IG business that trots out the usual spiel (and memes) about being kind, women supporting women, mamas etc etc (I won't be more specific as it will be pretty outing) - but honestly you should hear her talk in private about it - including several people named on these threads. It doesn't reflect especially well on her (it's all just a marketing sham to be honest) - but it is the language you need to use to get on in that particular advertising (and advertising it is) world.

Blimey it's so depressing described like that. I actually feel sorry for them. At least you don't have to pretend to be friends with people 'you've got this mama/hun/megababe' in an office.

@Flying yes, we are agreed on not blindly supporting each other. As I’ve said before that would lead to an uncomfortable Truman Show-like existence. I also don’t believe MN should be a constructive feedback portal for Instamums. That, too, would be an odd set up. Hopefully the ASA will step up in the absence of anyone else regulating myself and other Instagrammers.

It's interesting that this is the second group of people in the space of what, a week, who don't post on MN but have seen fit to make demands about the way they're discussed on here. The first was certain transactivists.

Whatever one's perspective on either transactivists or Instagram hawkers, I think it's very interesting to consider whether this is part of a trend and if so why. If I were MN moderation I'd be nipping both in the bud asap.

Erkkk agree C M, not sure you can pop on here to tell MNers how to discuss stuff, Badmotherpukka. Are you on any other threads managing their conversation?

FlyingBird that sounds spot on. Was the intention always to be a MLM or were they organic and hijacked by brands, I wonder? If they were attending 'training' meetings, the former I guess.

To be fair I was thinking more of NB, MOD etc and that #dearmumsnet arrogant, self-serving nonsense. But yeah, it's not really up to anyone other than HQ how this is discussed. I do think it's quite important that there are people on here making it clear we're very well aware that however she might style herself, Natasha Bailie is first and foremost a flogger of crap and monetiser of women online, and thus we're more than entitled to interpret her behaviour accordingly.

Ah C M sorry to misinterpret you. But I think it is one thing for them to # on their own accounts - their forum, and another for badmotherpukka to suggest conversation here shouldn't be 'constructive feedback' on IG. This can be whatever it wants if it is within MN rules.

I wonder if these threads - I've read a few of them - would ever have happened if certain instamums hadn't ignored/blocked questions about #ad last year.

I haven't seen the eloquent 'haters gonna hate' for ages, and I'm fairly certain that's thanks to these threads.

'Hawker' is an excellent word. If a future thread were to be called 'hawker ethics' we'd all know what it was about, right?

Do you think that any of the influencers that are headed to Manchester today for the #pregnantthenscrewed event recognise the irony of their situation? Their pregnancies are what made them successful, well, the fact that they decided to capitalise on the experience.

There are so many women that are left genuinely disadvantaged by having children. Women who just want to do the job that they love, and are qualified to do. How patronising for them to be pep-talked at by women that have 'bravely forged' a living of using their kids' faces to flog a load of unnecessary stuff on instagram.

I doubt they'd recognise the irony, Jamon.

There are so many outright disadvantaged women who couldn't afford the train ticket, let alone the event.

I'd think very highly of influencers and brands who directed some of their #gifting and #hospitality budgets towards women who genuinely need support.

Use all that thin, white, well off, middle class privilege for good.

@PilotPilates, I wasn’t intending to tell MNers how to discuss stuff - I have no influence in that regard. I used to work at Mumsnet and have detailed knowledge of how supportive/powerful this is as a platform. I think the comment from @Cuntinuous was aimed at the bigger #dearmumsnet campaign, which I am not a part of. Apologies if that has come across, though. I’m here because I am interested in what you have to say. I’m also interested in how to translate that to change on Instagram. I have a meeting with the ASA next week (through Gleam) and will highlight a number of frustrations and concerns across the board - from both Mumsnet and Instagram. I can’t speak for other influencers but I definitely didn’t have any training meetings ahead of working with brands on Instagram.

@MadameGrizzly did you see what Sali Hughes has been doing with #beautybanks? She’s brilliant.

@Badmotherpukka what do you think of the #dearmumsnet campaign or would you rather not say (which would be understandable)?