To ask what/who the dole should be for?

[Lollipop30]

Just been having this discussion with my brothers and Dad and we obviously disagree totally! By dole I mean any government help excludind child benefit.
So I’m interested to know who you think it should be for and why?

apposed to a way that subsidises business owners!

This with bells on! The majority of benefits are paid to people in employment.

Watch I Daniel Blake

Anyone who fits the current criteria for whatever benefit you mean by "dole". Nice use of stigmatising language BTW.

People who are unemployed and not eligible for other benefits need JSA to keep them afloat while they find work. They don't have any income, so they need help while they reach that goal. We can’t just let people starve because they’re inbetween jobs.

I was on JSA for a period a few years ago and it was very much a lifeline, even though the whole experience was awful.

This subject is hugely complex. In principle I think only people that either cannot work or need temporary help in between jobs should be eligible in an ideal world. However, this is not an ideal world and other issues need to be addressed -

• Employers that pay salaries too low for people to survive should not be allowed.
• Employers that hire people on JSA on the cheap - Why don't they deserve minimum wage?
• Much better mental health treatment and help in the workplace. Many people with MH issues can physically work but the lack of help they get means they are unable to.

Do we even have enough jobs and will it get worse? That's my worry. Technology has moved on so much and replaced real people in businesses that if everyone living on benefits upped and decided to get jobs would the jobs even be there?

It used to be the case that a family could live on a single salary, now it's 2 salaries at full time hours. We effectively doubled our workforce and improved technology so less people are actually needed.

It's not called The Dole. Loaded expression and not helpful. Should be entertaining thread.

The Dole used to mean Jobseekers Allowance. Now it's a derogatory term used by people who think that people who claim benefits are the scum of the earth.

Also, my Personal Independence Payments aren't "The Dole", thanks.

Riiiight so disability benefits including PIP which isn't an out of work benefit are 'dole'?

Have a , OP. Bloody goady fuckery.

The slang term for unemployment benefits when I was growing up was usually ‘the brew’ rather than the dole.

I haven’t heard anyone say ‘the dole’ since the ‘80s.

It rightly should be used as a safety net to protect the most vulnerable in society as well as those that for one or two reasons have fallen on difficult times.

It shouldn't be a life-style choice but from the press you'd think that every claimant was quite literally drinking champagne at dawn at the tax payers expense.

Benefits have been slashed drastically for those most in need of it. There are far too many people living in poverty and or precarious circumstances but the problem is that the press has demonised those that do because they've created a narrative that people 'on the dole' are work-shy leeches.

Op has stated we are talking about JSA. Not PIP etc. The names in the title op. Issue is with people forced on it. who can’t work but are told they can. Not just people, who don’t want to work.

The OP said any government help other than CB.

Why exclude child benefit?

Firmly agree with VladmirsPoutine

The 'dole' as you describe it, is now called Universal Credit in many areas across the UK. UC for new claimants, includes JSA, HB, IS, ESA, CTC and WTC.

It is intended for those who are seeking work or are unwell and cannot work. HB is meant to assist with the cost of rent. CB is paid by HMRC not the DWP. You can work and claim UC as your earnings are deducted from your allowance. Really meant as a short term safety net I think, as the DWP want people in work (what ever the job and pay!)/

Dole is SUCH an eighties word. What prompted you to write this post? Are you claiming? Watch I Daniel Blake and there's your answer!!

Yep a family who dont undersrand the venefit system.

And when called on ingorance changed the critera of duscussion.

Who recieve the Dole? Please dont call it that although it used to be called that just geberally it now is degorotry. And it only refers to unemployement benefits

"Unemployment benefit is commonly referred to as "the dole"; to receive the benefit is to be "on the dole""

What you refer to as any state welfare used to be called the social in the 80's maybe thats what your getting confused with.

Who should recieve state benefit. Those that meet the various and strict critera for the various benifits.

HTH

ICantCope
I was referring to Oops ok I think we were discussing JSA as opposed to everything else.. So no, IMO, op was talking only about JSA but of course it has been changed to UC in some areas.

The dole is a term that's been in use for decades, there's a 1930s novel called Love on the Dole.

What used to be the dole Is now Jib Seekers' Allowance which should do what it says on the tin. What a nasty goady post.

I believe we should be able to have a say on what our tax money pays for. I should be able to say I am not paying into benefit pot. And as a consequence I am happy not to receive it if I'm out of work and I'm fine with that. Living up north in a pretty deprived area I'm sick of seeing and knowing many people who abuse the system including family members who could work and CHOSE not to. It is supposed to be a TEMPORARY measure, not a lifestyle choice. My BIL decided to quit his job after a day because he wanted a holiday. How is that right?! Some people just have no work ethics whatsoever and they dont work not because they can't get a job. BIL had a very good in demand job until he started fucking it up. It should be a discussion. I pity people who call OP goady, you must be so pathetic.

I'm of the general opinion that before you discuss something as inflammatory as benefits you should:
A) make sure you are really well informed by reading up on it.
B) actually read real life stories from reputable sites (ie not the daily fail).
C) watch I Daniel Blake.

Then I'll happily have a debate with anyone on the validity of JSA and the pathetic amount paid and the deplorable sanctions they inflict

I was made redundant, my job and my colleagues jobs went offshore to a non EU country. I applied for Universal credit £73 a week. My bills continued to appear eg council tax £100+ . I attended interviews whereby I paid my own travel expenses. I have been extremely fortunate to find new employment quickly. I relocated to several miles to start a new job\life. Some people are not so lucky. I lost my job through no fault of my own. I know several other people who have been made redundant more than once under the same circumstances. Cheaper work force and internet means that prices can be cut. I predict that more jobs will be taken by robots in the future, so more people may be ‘on the dole’ in the future. I claimed, because I had paid into the system for decades and I wanted to be on the unemployed statistics. ....
What I don't agree with is younger, fitter people who spend years on the dole. When people like myself work unsocial or extra hours. Being made redundant is not nice, but l had transferable skills to start again. Does your family think that I am deserving ?

@CertainlyChoco

I sincerely hope, with all my heart, that what happened to me happens to you. I was a privately educated home owner with two businesses and a teaching career. I was a victim of DV, I became chronically ill, I broke my back and I have PTSD.

I now live in a council house, I can barely afford to eat, I am wracked with pain and my life is not worth living. Thank you for not paying into the "benefit pot" for people like me, for who it IS a lifestyle. Someone who never, ever thought it could happen to someone like me.

Sending you heaps of karma.

Ok sorry to cause a shitstorm then run! Obviously hadn’t fully explained discussion before I had to dash. No goadyness implied just was interested in others view as I hadn’t realised I disagreed so fundamentally with my family’s.

Use of the ‘dole’ probs not helpful but I meant JSA and having come from discussion with Dad that’s just his era/language.

So, my point has been that JSA should be a safety net for people whilst out of work to help them live etc whilst they find work. However I think it should be a case of they then get a job and whilst working can look for something preferred or more permanent/better paying etc.
If you then choose to keep looking or try and better your career then fantastic, but it should be done alongside work and not instead of.
My dad/bros however believe JSA should be used until you’re in the job you want as opposed to something to just pay the bills.

The dole? Have I wandered back to the 1930s? The benefit system is far more complex than a hand-out to the unemployed.