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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think that my sister can't blame the doctors.

86 replies

Shootfirstaskquestionslater · 15/04/2018 22:17

My sister is 34 and she has been taking ibprophen for the last 16 years she has completely knackered her kidneys to the point that she just spent 2 weeks in hospital she is trying to blame the doctors for it by saying that they should've been checking her. Doctors are only human and they don't always get it right but am pretty sure that they expect people to be clever enough to be careful with what they are taking I probably am being unreasonable but I think my sister needs to take some reasonablilty for whats happened it's her body and she can't blame the doctors for what she choses to put in to it.

OP posts:
colditz · 15/04/2018 23:13

Then get huffy when you explain the GP and hospital notes systems aren't magically linked

ok, explain this - Every doctor in your medical practice can go onto the system and pull up your medical record. The hospital can go onto their own computer system anywhere in the hospital and access the records they have of you.The systems can easily be linked up using the internet, but apparently nobody has bothered doing this.

WHY NOT?

I live in a town on the cusp of three counties. If you call an ambulance, you don't know if you're going to Leicester General, Nottingham Queen's Med, or Lincoln City Hospital. Would it not make sense to nationalise the medical records systems?

colditz · 15/04/2018 23:14

Also, it's not bloody magic, it's the internet, we've had IT for TWENTY YEARS

Weezol · 15/04/2018 23:14

OP has said that her sister recently took a load of tablets and threatened to drive herself off the road.
She's a team manager in a care home so potentially has access to a lot of medication.

If that was my sister and my niece I'd be worried too.

IntoTheFloodAgain · 15/04/2018 23:15

@Wolfiefan if the Op has a genuine reason to be worried then there’s nothing wrong with that. I don’t know about you, but in my family it’s normal to worry about a relative who has been hospitalised, especially if there has been a history of depression and substance abuse.

SinkGirl · 15/04/2018 23:16

Colditz - because each of those organisations use a different system for their notes, and they’re not compatible.

In our county they’re currently developing a system for all services to use. That’s just how it is in most places. Even say maternity use a different system to the main hospital, the hospital 30 mins away uses a different system again etc

TammySwansonTwo · 15/04/2018 23:17

Does she have chronic pain? If not I cant see why anyone would take so much ibuprofen - it has no recreational effect.

choirmumoftwo · 15/04/2018 23:17

Colditz, the NHS recently spent biillions trying to join all the systems up. It was abandoned as a bad job. Don't know why but I agree, you'd think it would be possible.

MipMipMip · 15/04/2018 23:17

I take naproxen most days for pain. It's prescription only and I've been told as long as I don't exceed the stared dose I'm fine. Been on them for years.

A couple of weeks ago I moved and changed doctors. I've had a call saying that they should never be mixed with another pill I'm taking. This has not been brought up by any previous doctor (large practice so saw multiple doctors and other did repeat prescriptions) and no pharmacist has queried it.

So yes, doctors do overlook these things. And if they did and it lead to kidney damage then I think your sister has a right to be angry. I'm pretty pissed myself at the moment.

colditz · 15/04/2018 23:19

How can it not be done, I just do not understand! Banks manage it!

Weezol · 15/04/2018 23:22

Colditz successive governments have wasted billions in contracts with PFI providers, including Carillion and Capita whi have promised and failed to supply joined up IT for the NHS.
www.bmj.com/content/360/bmj.k311

colditz · 15/04/2018 23:22

Ok, yes I get that different hospitals use different systems, but why can they just NOT DO THAT?

It's ridiculous to me that you can be ambulanced, unconscious, to a hospital and despite having the worl wide web and an intricate records system, nobody has been able to put the two together and work out from the contents of your purse that your are Mrs fractured Skull from Winchester, and that you are pregnant, allergic to penicillin and are blood group A neg!

Blanikbalm · 15/04/2018 23:25

16 years?? Nobody should take regular ibuprofen for 16 years! Good lord. She's lucky her stomach hasn't rotted through!

Shootfirstaskquestionslater · 15/04/2018 23:29

Thank you vanguardsix that's my point if it was prescribed by the doctor then they should've been checking but it's so easy to buy from the shop or just not follow instructions that things can go wrong like it has with my sister. I just really hope she has learned her lesson after all this.

weedsnseeds1 for all I know my sister could've been doing the same thing but she wouldn't tell any one if she was.

Gnotherguru they may not of known how much she was taking or what she was doing with them.

Gemini69 not completely no I know what she's like and it wouldn't be the first time she's told a lie to get herself out of serious trouble.

OP posts:
Jux · 15/04/2018 23:30

I have ms and am prescribed all sorts of things longterm. My neurologist recently wrote to my gp telling her to stop prescribing a particular drug as I had been taking it 'for some years' (5 years actually) and it was contra-indicated after this time. So I have been put on another drug for the same thing, and the side-effects are a bit weird but I'll get used to it in a couple of weeks and it'll all be OK.

I have been taking another drug for a couple of years, it's one of those which might affect kidney function (not ibuprofen) and I was called in for a blood test. I forgot to make the appointment so didn't have the test. A couple of months went by and then the pharmacist told me that my gp had said that without a blood test she would not sign the prescription for it next month.

That is what gp's do, what consultants do, what doctors do. They won't prescribe a drug unless they believe that it is safe for you to take it.

I do not believe that ibuprofen has been prescribed for your sister for so long without thorough checks. Sorry. She's been buying it in Tesco/Waitrose/Lidl/Aldi/Co-op etc. For all you know she's gone from one supermarket, bought two packs, then onto another supermarket and bought another two packs, and then to the next and the next and the next.

Weezol · 15/04/2018 23:35

Because: software compatibility, hardware, data management, power supply, ethernet, server farms, bandwidth, licensing, hard & wireless networking, security protocols, legislation, disaster recovery/BAU satellite sites across thousands of different geographic locations are not 'the internet'.

Yes, it's shit, and yes, it should and could have been done years ago, but the NHS is a political football kicked every which way by rich men who will never need it and don't give a toss about those of us that do. There is no political will to resolve this, because it's all about the profit margin.

But in a country where over half of those who are entitled to vote can't be bothered because 'it won't make any difference anyway', you get what you're given.

As may be apparent, I'm somewhat cross about this.

TheVanguardSix · 15/04/2018 23:38

You're welcome OP! I hope I didn't sound too harsh.
I just wanted to add that the dispensing chemist would likely raise the issue with the GP if he/she felt the patient was coming in with too many requests for medication. Of course, if it's not prescribed, your sister has free will to buy as much as she likes, as often as she likes.

I hope she makes a good recovery. I can totally understand why you're concerned.

Shootfirstaskquestionslater · 15/04/2018 23:40

lougle I'm not sure that it is something that any doctor would want to prescribe for long term use they would know the dangers of it am sure.

Weezol thank you I might do that just hope it doesn't get back to my sister that I have but I'm just worried about her and I hope she hasn't done anything else but at least if I raise my concerns with the doctor then they can look in to it and give her some help. No I don't think the doctors knows about most of what is going on because she never speaks to them. No they aren't she leaves her with our disabled parents most of the time while she does lord knows what. I don't think she will ever start being honest with any one which is what makes this even harder because none of us can help her if she refuses to tell anyone what's going on there's only so much we can do for her.

OP posts:
TheVanguardSix · 15/04/2018 23:41

Colditz, the NHS recently spent biillions trying to join all the systems up. It was abandoned as a bad job. Don't know why but I agree, you'd think it would be possible.

Isn't nearly every organisation within the NHS on SystmOne now? It certainly has not been 'abandoned'.

Weezol · 15/04/2018 23:44

Concern for welfare reports are confidential.

Popc0rn · 15/04/2018 23:46

@weezol YES!!! That is a typical daily exchange! My biggest fear is that one day I won't be able to stop my eyes rolling into the back of my head when a patient starts questioning my competence as a nurse because I can't guess the tablet that they don't know when they've "already clearly told me it's white and starts with an A!" Grin

Also, about the computer systems, our hospital has handwritten medical and nursing notes, and about 5 different IT systems for prescriptions, test results, observations etc. Some of the systems are like 20 years old, I've been told it's down to money when I've asked someone in IT.

Weezol · 15/04/2018 23:50

My all time fave was the lass in the bed next to me, she was there when I woke up so obviously an early hours admission. After being clerked in by a nurse and being seen by a doctor she asked me in all seriousness if I though the six e's she'd taken last night should have been something she ought to have mentioned.

IntelligentYetIndecisive · 15/04/2018 23:53

Huge efforts have been made to link the systems in the different countries together but the set ups are different wherever you live.

England, Wales and the Isle of Man use the NHS system, however, depending on which health authority you're in, what level of access you've been granted and what country you're in, you can see some or none of the patient's record.

A hospital might be able to see a patient's GP Practice in order to trace the record when the GP is next open, an address history, NOK details (only if the patient gave them and if the GP requested them when the patient registered) and contact details.

Scotland, Northern Ireland and England & Wales use slightly different numbers.

Someone in England can't access the records of a patient from Scotland and the same with Northern Ireland.

What we, in England would call the NHS number (10 digit code starting with a 4, 6 or 7), the Scottish version is Community Health Index Number which is generated around the patient's DOB and Northern Ireland use a Health & Care Number starting with a 3.

The systems generated around and with those numbers were different and huge sums of money have been spent trying to link them together.

Different hospitals have different computer systems, using different operating systems, programs and with different ways of recording information depending on what packages they bought or developed.

A system called Lorenzo which can link different programs together is being used in some hospitals but it's centrally controlled, prone to shut downs and if someone makes an error with a patient's record, then the error goes across the GP and national database within minutes.

It's a bitch to correct.

It is also trying to replace a number of specialist programs and can't mimic the same functionality that the separate programs could.

The increased processing power required would make trust wide, prohibitively expensive upgrade a necessity - the costs to be borne by individual trusts and not central government.

It's a tangled mess.

choirmumoftwo · 15/04/2018 23:56

TheVanguardSix - you may be right and that may be going on behind the scenes but I assure you that it's a very long way from being a practical, fully functioning system. Given the financial investment, you'd expect better. I do work in an NHS trust by the way.

ReanimatedSGB · 15/04/2018 23:56

You don't sound 'worried' about your sister so much as determined that any troubles she might have are her own fault. Do you want some kind of official statement that she's a bad person and therefore you shouldn't be obliged to help her, or something?

Shootfirstaskquestionslater · 15/04/2018 23:56

Intothefloodagain* your right which is another possibiltly that no one has looked at because she has said that she has stopped drinking now but after all this it's hard to know what she's doing and what she's hiding from us all. I'm worried about her because she's my sister and I know only too well what things she has done in the past.

Thank you Weezol I can only hope that she wouldn't be daft enough to touch the drugs in work that I know she access to.

Blankinibalm even I don't know how she doesn't have stomache problems after 16 years of taking it.

Thank you Jux that's my point exactly if she's never been checked by the doctors like my parents are all the time then she's been getting her tablets from somewhere else and taking more than anyone knows about and ended up in this mess but instead of being truthful about it all she is trying to blame the doctor and I don't think they are to blame they are good doctors and have taken my dad off tablets because they've decided that he's been taking it for too long and it's no longer safe for him to take so why would they allow my sister take ibuprofen for so long without checking up on her to make sure she was ok and still needed it.

No Vanguardsix not harsh at all you just said exactly what I'm thinking and surely it would've been picked up on by somewhere they would never just keep giving you a prescrioton for so long without checking to make sure everythings ok still. Thank you she is getting there I just hope this is the wake up call that she needs to sort herself out before she kills herself. Xx

OP posts: