To want to get far away from London?

[bluecherry1]

I have a very nice house with a great dh and 2 lovely dc, good jobs and no real worries BUT I live 2 streets away from one of the recent stabbings and it has put me so on edge, crimes rates here seem to be soaring, I hate not letting my children go out to play and don’t even feel totally safe myself walking the 10 minutes home from the station. I know there are nice places in England to live but me and dh are thinking of homeschooling the kids and travelling, we have family in Spain, South Africa and the USA, I want them to experience a carefree life for as long as they can. Ahhhh I’m so confused?

If I lived in the countryside, it would've been harder for my friend and I to come up with a list of things to do. We're not really the type to enjoy long walks, plus neither of us drive currently; if I lived somewhere with infrequent public transport we would've likely spent the whole week stuck in the house, which is not something she enjoys doing.

What is it that means only London can fulfil your needs?

no galleries or museums for us last weekend, although we were at the Science Museum 3 weeks ago 😁. Re last weekend my mum popped in on Sat to babysit so I could get my hair done & then DH & I went to Soho for dinner. On Sunday my sister took eldest Dc1 to a local theatre show & food. My mil offered to take dc2 for a bit & then decided to keep him for the night (result, as he’s 1 & shitty sleeper). I was then free to go to Oxford street to do a bit of shopping with a friend.

I don’t normally have so much “help” on the weekend but we are going away on holiday today (hence why i’m awake now) plus DH was busy fixing our drain & fence & did some DIY for his mum too. London “keeps” me because I do have amazing family support & gives me opportunities to be spontaneous.

Why do these threads always turn into countryside bashing when the OP hasn't even mentioned going somewhere rural? Most of the UK (and MN presumably) manage to live neither in London nor the back of beyond but find somewhere in the middle. Even if fields and suburbs are your idea of hell, surely you have the imagination to think that maybe Edinburgh, Bath, Bristol, Newcastle, York, Glasgow, Cardiff.... might not be cultural wastelands.

Because a PP said she had grown up rurally and never lived in a city and what would a teen in the countryside be missing out on that a teen in the city would be doing. Another PP said she couldn't understand why anyone would choose London over a commuter village. For me it's less about London vs anywhere else than it is about city living, I agree. But my contributions were in response to specific posts about countryside vs city - OP may not have mentioned the countryside but other posters did, and many of the town mouse vs country mouse replies were in response to these.

*All this talk about London being full of culture and not being able to bear being stuck in the Country as there's nothing to do. Needing it busy and needing things to do bla bla.

So, any Londoners...what's a typical week in your life like? What is it that means only London can fulfil your needs? Presumably you're out every evening at galleries and museums, soaking up all that culture...not going home, cooking dinner and going to bed like the rest of us*

For me it's about being in the city, wouldn't need to be specifically London. I've lived in Oxford, Brighton and London (where I currently live) and all tick the boxes far more than the Cheshire suburbs where I grew up. For me the thing that makes city living a must for me, is being able to go to pretty much anything within walking distance or easily accessible with plentiful public transport. I feel claustrophobic as soon as I'm anywhere that you're pretty much dependent on a car to get anywhere. It's the fact I don't have to plan to do stuff because there's so many options all the time

So this last week

Last night, I did a yoga class at a specialist yoga studio that's 5 mins walk from my front door, on my walk home from work. If I'd missed that class then there's 3 other studios within walking distance from my house.

Tomorrow I'm going straight from work to the theatre to see Hamilton (squee!). In the last couple of months we've been to see Network, the Ferryman, Venus in Fur, A Long Day's Journey into Night, Oslo, Glengarry Glen Ross, a Labour of Love and Follies (off the top of my head). I love West End theatre and love that I can go to a show straight after work and then 20 mins after the curtain goes down I can be at home, as it's just a quick tube ride away.

I work near Borough market and I have the most incredible choice of food options at lunchtime, within a 5 min walk from the office.

At the weekend DH and I stayed in for a takeaway. We had a choice of tonnes of local restaurants on Deliveroo to have any kind of cuisine we fancied, freshly cooked from a restaurant (not just a takeaway from Just Eat or Hungry House) and delivered to our door within 30 mins.

It's the proximity and convenience of having so many different options on my doorstep, easily accessible through plentiful public transport, that I love about city living. Different strokes for different folks however! Neither is better than the other - it's just my personal preference.

And to be candid, a key thing keeping me in London is work. The industry I work in is very much centred in London - I have plenty of colleagues who don't live in London, but they are commuting 4h a day to get to and from work (including from other cities like Brighton and Cambridge). If we both leave the office at 6.30pm, I'm home by 7, whereas they won't get in the door until half 8/9pm.

I feel for you! I used to live in Greater London and decided I'd never bring up kids there - they need fresh air, grass, fields, woods and trees, no worries - London does very little of any of those things - Spain sounds fabulous but it does get really hot - I'm sure you could sell your home and buy something bigger and better in other parts of tehnUK or Spain etc

Do it! Good luck!

This thread started because the OP is scared that black kids are getting killed near her.
She is scared by this.

When you sneer at mad people who live in dangerous London maybe consider that many of us feel safer here than 'there'.

Kids need fresh air, grass, fields, woods and trees, no worries. Umm says you
I live in the city my kids have huge parks,botanical garden,galleries,shops,mates all in walking distance
Let’s get this clear this boden catalogue lifestyle of fields and ruddy cheek kids catching things in jam jars is my idea of mc hell.hell with fields

The peaceful hippie in me says ‘wouldn’t the world be a boring place if we all agreed on everything?’

These threads always deviate off-topic and turn in to Londoners versus Everyone Else, though .

Back to the original point of the thread. It’s not in any way unreasonable to be worried about violence in London. I have a teenage son who is also black (well, mixed race) and it is frightening to see that he is the demographic most affected by youth violence. It was one of the reasons I left Hackney with a heavy heart.

Not all of the young people you see are from the stereotypical poverty stricken, broken homes. Lots just get caught up in a situation that affects their area. Most have loving parents.

Fact is, if you have the option to move somewhere less affected by crime, great (although SA wouldn’t strike me as a great alternative)...but many don’t. We were lucky enough to be able to sell up and buy in a ‘better’ area of London. Lots don’t have that option. And we couldn’t leave London altogether because of our jobs. It would be pretty much impossible.

I love the English countryside and coast. Beautiful villages, market towns, historic sites, greenery etc. But I live in London, I'm from here and family are here and I absolutely love it. It isn't a competition, everywhere has good and bad. I can understand the OP being concerned, I don't share those concerns but they are valid. The one thing I wouldn't do is home school, that fills me with dread, but that's nothing to do with location.

secretbum that’s the idea - people live in cities so they don’t have to endure the humdrum of going to work, coming home, cooking dinner and going to bed ad infinitum! The thread earlier this week about eating packed lunches in a carpark on an industrial estate every day made me feel panicked!

I meet with friends and go to fantastic bars and restaurants. I visit galleries and exhibitions and go to concerts and gigs. I go to things like Secret Cinema and interactive theatre. I pop out at lunch and visit The Tate. Now I have a child this is indeed less than previously but still very frequent - we share Nursery pick ups so I have plenty of free evenings. And at the weekends we explore as a family - anything from a walk in the woods (because contrary to what flumpybear stated London is one of the greenest cities in the world and has a huge amount of parks, woods etc) to the local children’s theatre to battersea children’s zoo to Stratford storytelling zone - then we go and eat dinner together and experience foods from around the world and thank the Lords our only options aren’t Prezzo and Giraffe!

I used to want to move out of London (lived in then grotty - now gentrified area) but did not have the courage and only moved to zone 5, the glorious suburbs! Used to hate it here in the beginning as it felt neither there nor here... until I have grown to like it. My suburb is safe, green, low crime, low pollution, yet diverse enough (edge of Croydon borough), and yet easily accessible to central London. I am alone raising 2 boys and do worry about the gang and drugs element a lot, however I feel that I have chosen the best combination of location, education, low crime, commute and convenience with the housing budget that I've had.

Although, if it came to my DCs' involvement in gangs or the like I would move without a hesitation, and far.

I would be worried for my children's immediate wellbeing, given that it's not unusual for people to get caught in the crossfire in these situations; and their future wellbeing in terms of steering clear from gang culture and those involved with gangs.

Wouldn't fancy London right now.

morningseleven you do realise London isn’t one small place don’t you? It’s half the size of Kent. The population is around 9million. In 2017 there were 116 murders in London and, as we all know, most murders are committed by men of their partners.

There has been a spike in the last 2 months only due to gang knife crime in some very specific areas. And it is pretty unusual for people to be caught in ‘crossfire’. Especially during knife crime issues.

It’s pissing me off that people with limited knowledge or idea of what ‘London’ is like are condemning it as a hotbed of danger for children when the reality is many of us live incredibly happy safe lives here. Try and look at the mindless drunken Saturday night violence that occurs in towns up and down the country - your children are far more likely to be caught up in that as they get older than mine are to be get involved in a gang.

It’s pissing me off that people with limited knowledge or idea of what ‘London’ is like are condemning it as a hotbed of danger for children when the reality is many of us live incredibly happy safe lives here. Try and look at the mindless drunken Saturday night violence that occurs in towns up and down the country - your children are far more likely to be caught up in that as they get older than mine are to be get involved in a gang.

Well said!

It's so ridiculous to suggest 'london' is risky as a whole. I live in SE London and it would take me the best part of an hour to get to hackney. Hardly likely to get caught up in the 'cross fire'. Ridiculous.

people live in cities so they don’t have to endure the humdrum of going to work, coming home, cooking dinner and going to bed ad infinitum!

Wow even with a child/ren?

No humdrum, no cooking dinner and doing dishes every night, just live in London to avoid it

I hazard a guess that most London parents aren't out and living up the London life most evenings though.

people live in cities so they don’t have to endure the humdrum of going to work, coming home, cooking dinner and going to bed ad infinitum!

I live in London and don't have kids and, try as I might, I can't avoid all this Every day it happens. Every day, I tell you!

I mean, I can easily grab a takeaway or something to microwave from one of the several food shops on my high street, so that takes care of the cooking thing –but one assumes a lot of people can do that even outside cities.

Try as I might, I haven't yet found someone to go to work or to bed for me...

Now you’re being faecitous. Yes parents in London do eventually come home and go to bed.....you know exactly what I’m saying though - there’s plenty to do outside of a routine of doing solely that every night. And yes even with children secretbum - life doesn’t have to be routine and dull with them you know it just adapts. I quite often pick up my daughter and pop out to eat during the week.

I 'd never bring up kids there - they need fresh air, grass, fields, woods and trees, no worries - London does very little of any of those things

As a teenager growing up in the suburbs of Manchester - not even the countryside - I was very dependent on my parents to ferry me around everywhere, and that was even living somewhere that had OK-ish public transport links. My friends who lived more rurally didn't have that option at all - unless they could get a lift they were pretty stuffed. There's so many threads on MN where it's emphasised that public transport outside of major conurbations is limited - so whilst trees and grass (of which there is plenty in Greater London) are great, as an older child, the ability to get out and about to different activities, see friends etc is also pretty great.

London is 47% green which is amazing for a capital city of its size. Look at this
www.nationalparkcity.london/
Not only can we walk to major parks and heathland, the general environment is very green for a city

I have three huge parks, a nature reserve and a large woodland within walking distance!

there’s plenty to do outside of a routine of doing solely that every night

Of course...I just fail to see what's uniquely 'London' about that tbh. Or even what's uniquely 'city' about that!

Unless you really literally live in the middle of nowhere with nothing for 20 miles in any direction (which is actually very rare) then there's plenty to do almost everywhere nowadays.

Haven’t rtft but yanbu. We moved out towards the end of last year, the massive increase in acid attacks, knife crime and shootings were the reason we moved our plans forward and got out as quickly as possible. Most weren’t even reported in the media so it wasn’t some sort of hysteria that made us worried about it, we saw it for ourselves. The attacks were almost daily, on our estate or on people we knew. When you’ve seen gangs wandering past your house with machetes and your OH is threatened with acid at 8am on a average Wednesday, you know the crime stats for the area are absolute bullshit and not a reflection of what’s really going on IMO. Of course it depends on which part of London you’re in, we were east London. I wouldn’t want to go back.

Lipstick The places you mentioned in Enfield and Haringey are impossible to afford on an average income. I moved out of London from Enfield. My DS's had a choice of going to High Schools on the A10, where kids were getting mugged daily outside the school gates and several stabbings in the area in a very short period of time or risking a less than 40% chance of getting into Enfield Grammar. We are two highly educated professionals, who were stupid enough to work in the Public sector instead of going into Banking. There is no way on earth we could afford to live in those places you mentioned. If we could, we would have stayed. Hell, we probably would have considered staying if we could have moved from EN1 to EN2. People are right when they say London is brilliant if you are wealthy and utterly shit if you are even average income. I was born in London. My parents still live there because they bought their house in the 80's and cashed in. As an aside, I go to Central London far more frequently now than I did when I lived there, because the train goes straight into the centre of the city. There are a hell of a lot of museum entries and train tickets that can be paid from 1.5k a month mortgage payments we were paying out for a 3 bedroom terraced house in Enfield.

" Most of the stabbings, as you know, are gang on gang. "

the thing is, that is becoming less true by the day.