To want to believe in something mysterious?

[TheCatofAthenry]

I know IABU really.

I'd really love to have a religion. I'd love to believe something was watching over me.

I'd also like to believe in mysterious energy flow rules of the universe, or ghosts or homeopathy. I think it'd add a bit of fun to my life..

The thing is, my scientific background would argue against most of the above, and without evidence, I struggle with the idea of a god. (I also believe a kind god would understand this struggle.)

I just think it'd add an interesting dimension.

I know I am a bit unreasonable really! Wondering if anyone understands where I'm coming from.

You can believe in whatever batshit crazy thing you like. But I won't encourage it. I too have a scientific background and as you correctly note - there is no credible/good evidence for the existence of any of the things you mentioned. Well, homeopathy "exists" but there's no good evidence that it works. I've spent about 12 years debating (actively) most of the things you've listed - there is just nothing even close to credible evidence for any of it.

So yeah, if you want to believe it - crack on. I'd argue belief isn't a conscious choice though. Belief is basically the acceptance of a proposition being true. I couldn't just "decide" to start believing in woo-woo and I doubt you could either.

That's exactly what I mean. It isn't a conscious choice.

Just sometimes I'd like to be able to believe stuff, but I can't really. And for some of the above, it'd be professionally irresponsible of me to believe.

I'd love a bit more "wonder", and even though I love what I do, I don't get a huge kick out of finding out why things are a certain way.

For example, knowing what a rainbow is takes away the possibility that it is some kind of auspicious sign.

And I know I sort of ABU, but I love a good mystery.

I'm more inclined to believe in scientific explanations too. But sometimes I'm overwhelmed by the complexity of life on Earth and find it almost as impossible to believe it just "evolved" from single celled organisms as it is to believe in some sort of God. Then I start thinking there must be some higher form of intelligence surely that had a hand in the creation of life? I still have no answers though.

I get where you r coming from! I have a couple of religious friends and their passion for their faith inspires me :) I would love to have that! --Plus I do like a good song song! And kind of miss the church singing I did as a kid :)

There is something beautiful about having faith and belief in something - whether that be god, angels, aliens, or whatever.

There’s a tonne of magic in science. Could you get well into space exploration? Trappist and the planets with incredibly deep and wide oceans? I love all that stuff! Means I can daydream about the possibilities without knowing for a fact it’s not true.

There's nothing wrong with being in awe, there's nothing wrong with saying "I don't know"

When it comes to belief, we can believe things for good reasons or bad reasons. Outside of some useless concept of absolute truth we can't be sure of anything.

I actually do get a huge kick out of finding out why things are a certain way, because I value truth above preference. It depends how deeply you want to think about things, at what resolution you want to consider questions. I know what you mean when you say it can take away the magic (paraphrasing here) but for me once the false "magic" disappeared - the real appreciation for the actual facts began. And in most cases it trumps any kind of fantastical magic any day of the week.

It's mostly in contemplation of the bigger questions that deep thinkers have found content. If certain scientists hadn't wondered "what is this fungus?" we wouldn't today have penicillin. That's much better and far more useful than thinking "God" invented penicillin :) You're doing fine, don't worry :)

divination is good fun
with the rods that swing around

@Hotdoggity at the risk of sounding ridiculous, that just doesn't do it for me. The idea that someone or something planned the world out is exciting. The fact that it is large is simply a fact.

As a child, I loved "chilling" things. A ghost in my attic is chilling. Pipes settling is just annoying.

As in, I'm happy and love my life and cats and partner and my work.

Maybe I just want to be innocent? I crave the unexplainable over the unexplained.

Small problem, I know.

I think the origins of religion and collective myths is fascinating.

There’s speculation that planets in TRAPPIST 1 are tidally locked. Could you imagine - if there’s life, it’s likely to exist on the lighter side - so there’s a whole side of their planet in inhabitable darkness. What kind of myths and stories and religions would they build around the dark seas of their world?

Fair enough. I think I’m a big geeky about that kind of thing.

I know several scientists who have a religious or spiritual faith/belief of some kind. I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. It's just that their understanding of it isn't as simplistic as taught to children in Sunday school.

you have a cat
surely the cat is evidence of another realm - mine carefully watches 'nothing' walk across the room and then approaches 'nothing' for a closer look.

@TopShagger I think you've hit the nail on the head. I struggle to see the magic in things with a logical explanation. As I believe everything has a logical explanation (even if I don't know it/we as humans don't know it), I feel a tad short on magic.

I'd never admit to this feeling with colleagues, and I'm about as logical as a person can get. Sometimes I just wish I wasn't!

@grasspigeons I think my cats provide good evidence that I buy cat food and like soft things. They do like to attack dust.

I think the issue here firmly rests with me rather than the world.

I know science and faith aren't always mutually exclusive, but without enough evidence I can't see myself finding religion.

I think it's entirely possible to believe in science and have a faith of some sorts. One of DH's friends is a research scientist and whilst everything he works with is science and evidence-based he also feels strongly that there's absolutely something 'more'. He said when we spoke about it that because of his work he sees miracles that sometimes seem bigger than anything he can explain with logic or sense.

I feel quietly comforted by that, because he's by far the smartest person I know and refuses to dismiss all religion (except Scientology, which he says is a bunch of loopy wankers with more money than sense).

maybe conspiracy theories could give you a bit of a chill - some of them are really plausible and you have that sense of you'll never know the truth. Some are bonkers but its still fun thinking about how bonkers they are.

you have a cat

Yes! We have several but the youngest one, who is a silver ball of madness, sits on the last-but-one stair and 'watches' something go past him several times a day. None of the other cats will sit on the stairs, ever, and I always wonder if they can see or feel something.

OP - you are correct. Everything, literally everything, does have an explanation - even if we haven't found it yet. Consider how many things we didn't have an explanation for as little as a hundred years ago, or even fifty - which we do have today. In another hundred or even just fifty we'll have even more. I find a sense of "magic" in that, but it's not woo-woo magic, more a sense of excitement and awe. I think you share this.

I tell you where I do find the kind of magic you're talking about though, look to space. Literally. There's a whole buttload of things we can't explain at the moment going on up there!

One of my favourite quotes EVER -

"Right now, it is raining methane on Titan. The planet Uranus is orbiting the sun sideways, while Venus spins backwards. There are stars exploding, black holes gorging, galaxies colliding. And here we sit, on a planet pock-marked by collisions, rocked by earthquakes, shaken by storms. A planet doomed to be fried in radiation as it’s magnetic fields collapse, until finally the sun grows into a red giant and leaves nothing of the Earth but dust. Here we sit, glasses on our noses, inhalers in our pockets, braces on our teeth, waiting to die as our heart muscle expires, our cells become cancerous, or a blood vessel just pops, and sometimes in unnatural ways too.

Here we sit, and some of us say, behold, look at the "order" of it all."

Frances Langum

I do like that quote, @TopShagger. Haven't come across it before.

You're welcome :)

Science and religion are perfectly compatible. I’m a qualified doctor with a science based training, and also a committed Christian.
I was an atheist, (every bit as arrogant and ignorant as Richard Dawkins!), until I had a direct encounter with God over 26 years ago. That was life changing, and very humbling. I’ve since been confirmed in the church and taught Sunday school when my kids were young.
I think your hunger for a sense of wonder is simply the spiritual hunger of your soul, seeking a loving relationship with God. Keep seeking, with an open mind and heart. I pray that you find it - it is the most important and wonderful thing in life.

OP, have you looked into Eastern philosophies and tried meditating.

@Babdoc I'm so a doctor! I was raised Christian and tried to return as an adult. I don't necessarily think my education is the deciding factor here.

From what I observe in the world, I would feel that if there is a god, he/she/it is either merciless or powerless. This might be my own bleak world view and I certainly wouldn't judge anyone else's beliefs, but I personally can't believe. (Although I try to maintain an open mind and believe an understanding god would see how someone could see things as I do).

Maybe I am just trying to have the best of all worlds.

*also

@Vitalogy I try a bit of mindfulness and I'm terrible at it, but I persevere!