AIBU regarding 17yr old newly passed driver carrying my 3yr old daughter?

[missbehaving1000]

Hi All,

I'm just after some opinions please over a matter which I'm in two minds about.

I have a DD who's 3. Relations between her and I father are not good. Court order in place etc and contact is only over email.

She has two half siblings, the older of which has just passed his driving test. He turned 17 in January and within weeks he was driving.

Today, when DD was returned home, she was in half brothers car with him driving. Her half sister was in the front and her dad was in the back.

This made me feel very uncomfortable, and I'm in two minds as to whether to email the ex to discuss the matter.

AIBU to do this, as I know legally the half sibling can drive whoever he wants. Am I worrying needlessly? Or should I be asking for DDs dad to at least sit in the front next to his son so that god forbid if anything were to happen, he'd be in a better position to help? Instead of his 12yr daughter who's there at the moment.

Would appreciate your thoughts! Thanks.

The competent authority judge your ability to drive in an hours test - doesn't mean you are suddenly a safe or competent driver after that hour. There is a reason why insurance for 17 year old boys is so high.

There isn't much you can say or do, but I totally get why it worries you. Is there any way you could offer to pick her up saying that you're 'going that way anyway'. I know it's not ideal but at least you'd get peace of mind without ruffling feathers?

I passed first time with no minors swingofthings.

I see where you're coming from but I feel there's alot more to driving than just being able to perform the correct manoeuvers to a satisfactory level, and for me, putting the life of my child into the hands of someone who has only been driving for a few weeks and is unlikely to have the experience and confidence that comes with driving over time just is not worth the risk.

@swingofthings

To be fair, you could argue that if it took so long, maybe it didn't come to you as easily as someone else. My DD had many fewer lessons than average and her instructor, who has been doing the job for over 25 years said that he couldn't remember last time he had someone as comfortable at the wheel. On her 2nd lesson, she was doing roundabouts. She passed first time with only 1 minor.

Personally, I would prefer to be in a car with her than someone whose been learning to drive for a long time and say failed 3 times.

I am the exact opposite. I would feel VERY wary of getting into a car with someone who was driving around roundabouts on the 2nd lesson, and then passed immediately with '1 minor.'

Someone who has had 50 lessons and didn't pass til the 5th time would be a MUCH better driver IMO, because of all the lessons and driving experience they have had. Just coz someone failed a few times, that doesn't mean they're shit, it just means they got anxious on their test.

Conversely, some of the worst drivers I know (who have the most bumps and scrapes and accidents,) passed their test on the first attempt. Probably because of the lack of experience and too much confidence from passing quickly...

I don't mean everyone who passes first time is crap, but just because they did pass quickly, that doesn't mean they are better drivers than someone who took 50 lessons and 5 tests.

@1310j

I see where you're coming from but I feel there's a lot more to driving than just being able to perform the correct manoeuvres to a satisfactory level, and for me, putting the life of my child into the hands of someone who has only been driving for a few weeks and is unlikely to have the experience and confidence that comes with driving over time just is not worth the risk.

THIS ^ Just because someone gets all the manoeuvres right, and can do pitch-perfect driving on a lesson, that doesn't make them a competent, confident, and skilled driver. That takes time... And as I said, no WAY would I let a 17 y.. boy who had just passed his test, drive my 3 y.o. child around.

@swingofthings

To be fair, you could argue that if it took so long, maybe it didn't come to you as easily as someone else. My DD had many fewer lessons than average and her instructor, who has been doing the job for over 25 years said that he couldn't remember last time he had someone as comfortable at the wheel. On her 2nd lesson, she was doing roundabouts. She passed first time with only 1 minor.

Personally, I would prefer to be in a car with her than someone whose been learning to drive for a long time and say failed 3 times.

I am the exact opposite. I would feel VERY wary of getting into a car with someone who was driving around roundabouts on the 2nd lesson, and then passed immediately with '1 minor.'

Someone who has had 50 lessons and didn't pass til the 5th time would be a MUCH better driver IMO, because of all the lessons and driving experience they have had. Just coz someone failed a few times, that doesn't mean they're shit, it just means they got anxious on their test.

Conversely, some of the worst drivers I know (who have the most bumps and scrapes and accidents,) passed their test on the first attempt. Probably had so many mishaps and accidents because of the lack of experience and too much confidence from passing quickly...

I don't mean everyone who passes first time is crap, but just because they did pass quickly, that doesn't mean they are better drivers than someone who took 50 lessons and 5 tests.

@1310j

I see where you're coming from but I feel there's a lot more to driving than just being able to perform the correct manoeuvres to a satisfactory level, and for me, putting the life of my child into the hands of someone who has only been driving for a few weeks and is unlikely to have the experience and confidence that comes with driving over time just is not worth the risk.

THIS ^ Just because someone gets all the manoeuvres right, and can do pitch-perfect driving on a lesson, that doesn't make them a competent, confident, and skilled driver. That takes time... And as I said, no WAY would I let a 17 y.. boy who had just passed his test, drive my 3 y.o. child around.

My daughter passed within 2 months of her 17th birthday. First time, one minor, and really is a very good, confident but sensible driver. However, I was still very nervous for the first few months, and it was a while before I allowed her to drive my youngest dc on a short, local village trip. Of course you are apprehensive OP, it is perfectly natural. I would probably feel the same.

Have not RTFT, but over my dead body would any of my DC be transported by a 17 yo new driver. And they are, um, nearly 17. I would sooner drive 200 miles to collect them myself. My DM was like this when I was a teenager, and I thought she was mad. Now I get it.

YABU

1. To assume that he can't drive safely just because he is young.
2. To think that his Dad could do anything more in the passenger seat than he could in the back, if his ds made a mistake
3. To think that your opinion / judgement trumps your ex's , when your ex is doing his share of the parenting.

Yes, there are some pretty poor 17yr old drivers, just the same as there are poor new drivers of all ages, and just as much some older drivers who have been driving for years. However, there are also some excellent new and young drivers. You have to trust your ex's judgement.

Fuck the ‘he had passed his test so safe bollocks’. A very inexperienced driver is far more likely to have an accident. No way would I let my young child in the car with them driving.

Amen to that @thefaeriequeen ^

I do see why you're worried but a 17 year old (or anyone else) could just as easily cause the accident that hurt or killed your child even while you were the one driving.

It's a moot point anyway - her dad's parenting decisions are as valid as yours. Just remember, it really is very very likely that it will be absolutely fine.

Kimanda some people are naturally more skilled at driving then others. My SIL has been driving for 40 years. She failed her test 3 times despite many hours because it just wouldn't click.

40 years on she had number of accidents and we all feel anxious getting in the car with her. She might experience but her awareness is terrible. DD would foresee potential danger and react to avoid them quicker than my SIL.

I wouldn't have felt okay with kids in the back for most of a year after I passed. One of the biggest risks for inexperienced drivers is noise and distraction - like if a toddler has a meltdown. It's really hard to focus. It's why so many young people crash their cars with their pals in their - the loud music and teenage volume means they can't focus.

You might be better off taking heart to heart with the teenager though, if your ex is difficult. But you should def voice your concerns, whether or not he does anything about it.

Trust your instinct. NO would be my answer! There is a reason it's much more expensive to get insurance as a 17 year old driver!

Agree with @BackForGood

I don’t see what your ex could do in the front he couldn’t do in the back. Assume there aren’t dual controls?

He was there in the car so it’s unlikely the lad was racing the lights and had the base swirled up, isn’t it?

I agree that passing a test doesn’t make you a good driver, but neither does xyz years of experience.

I passed my test at 17 on the second go with no minors. I was a shit driver. The real learning about driving comes with experience of real situations and time.

I’m a very good driver now, but there is no way I would have put a child in a car with 17yo me. I wouldn’t put them in a car with someone newly qualified for the exact same reasons.

Wouldn't be happy with this at all.

At 17 you simply have zero experience. Yes you've passed the test but that's only one part of it : with driving its experience that counts.

I'm quite surprised at many of the responses here. I teach in a secondary school in a rural area and have followed a number of new drivers who have recently passed their tests. I have to say, they drive carefully and with courtesy to other road users because most of them (especially the lads) have black boxes installed as it is the only way they can keep their insurance premiums less than astronomically high.

To those who think learners spend their entire time practising only with an instructor, that was simply not the case for us. On my working days, we took DD's car and she drove me and her younger sister the 16 miles each way to school. Her driving improved immeasurably over the 3 months. Her instructor was happy that she was getting more experience. She has now had a full licence for 16 months and drives carefully. Of course, I still worry about her, but I have to trust her otherwise she will never become the safe and experienced driver that I know she can do. Today she has offered to collect DD2 from school after a sports match and take her to a dance lesson as I am working elsewhere. Yes, I will be thinking about them, but I know she values the freedom her licence offers and will do whatever she can to keep it clean.

@kimanda and @TheFaerieQueene ...couldn't agree more. Everybody knows that practice and experience make people better at anything they do.
A retired police officer friend of mine said he would rather his dd walked the streets in the roughest part of town in the middle of the night than that she got in a car with a newly passed driver.

Unfortunately the statistics speak for themselves, especially with boys who have just passed their tests. 1 in 4 aged 18-24 young drivers have an accident within the first 2 years of driving. ( brake.org.uk)

Well that still means that 3/4 don't. Plus there's "accidents" and then there's "accidents"

My NCD was lost a few years ago, as we had what was considered (by insurance companies" a "fault" accident. Their definition of this is that there is no-one to claim off. What actually happened is we were parked legitimately, a larger vehicle ploughed into our car, pushing it into a car in front and drove off. Car infront could clam off us but our insurance company had no-one to claim off. In general parlance, no-one would say it was "our fault" (we were nowhere near the car at the time), but statistics still see it as a 'fault accident'.

However, yes, statistically young lads are more likely to be involved in an accident than 42 yr old women for example, but if you break those figures down as to "young lads driving their Dad and two siblings somewhere" I suspect you'll find there isn't a difference, or - and I'm purely speculating here - that the 'young lads driving their dad and siblings' are most probably safer than most other groups.

Your ex knows his son. I'm sure if he was concerned, he wouldn't have allowed it.

Let him parent his way during his time with his daughter.