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To have done a nutty over GCSE options

150 replies

chorltonwheelies · 13/03/2018 23:44

This is going to sound terrible, but here goes. Probably outing and long so as not to drip feed.

DD at an independent school. One of the reasons we chose it & she liked it, above other schools was that it offered lots of language options. Her primary school had 4 languages on the curriculum (it got swallowed up by a big chain when she was in Reception who introduced them) and fortunately she had excelled in them all, despite my thinking it was too heavy. She's got a natural aptitude for language.

School said that it offered French and Latin in Year 7, then they could chose to pick up an additional language of Spanish or German in Year 8. Cool beans thinks DD, having already studied French, Latin & Spanish.

Midway through Year 7, school informs us that they are changing policy and for Year 8, they all have to keep on with the Latin, but choose between either keeping on French or dropping it for German or Spanish.

DD disappointed, but chose to keep on with French. School says that they will have the option to pick up Spanish or German in Year 9.

This time last year, school then informs us that they are effecting a change and that pupils will need to pick their options for Year 9, before then choosing their options for GCSE.

As part of this process they get taster lessons in Spanish and German. DD decides that she really wants to try German, much to my surprise, I thought she'd resume Spanish as she'd enjoyed it before, but hey ho, her choice.

She was a bit disappointed at having to drop some subjects she really enjoyed, (drama, ICT, art) but realised that you can't do everything. I let her make her own choices.

They've then had to choose their GCSE options and DD really wanted to do French, German and Latin, amongst other options. Spoke to all the teachers at Parent's Evening a few weeks back and they were all delighted she was plumping for their subjects, because she is so naturally good at languages and has really hit the ground running with her German. No indication that she couldn't do both. They don't have option blocks.

Anyway, she comes home today, angry and upset because deputy head has informed her and other pupils, that due to low pupil uptake, they can't do either French & German, or French and Spanish.

They can only do 1 core language. Reason given is that there will only be 4 people in her German class and that's not conducive to learning, however she can swap French for German which will put her in the core German class. Currently there's only 2 people in the core German. She doesn't want to swap, but also doesn't understand why they won't run it. I'm not sure I do either.

Apparently the German and Spanish teachers had no idea about this, and only found out from their students today, about not being able to do a 2nd language. They then went back to Head of Department who didn't know either.

It all sounds like a disorganised cock-up. I've written a sharp letter to the Head of Year and cced in the deputy, pointing out that we feel disappointed and misled and that actually the pages on their website are misleading because they state that students do 2 modern languages from early on, and it clearly lays out that students can choose 2 modern languages for GCSE.

I understand that it's sometimes not viable for schools to run small classes etc, but another part of me thinks feck it, why are we paying school fees? If it's a change of policy also think it's a bit shit to spring it on her without telling parents first. Apparently deputy tried to ring me a few times today, but she tried my landline instead of my mobile.

I'm not sure I understand it and I'm really peeved on behalf of my daughter who feels she has been lied to and wouldn't have dropped other subjects, to start German if she'd known that she wouldn't be able to continue it.

I know that it's not going to be career ending or anything for her, but she'd really set her heart on languages.

Written a pissy letter. I've probably been completely unreasonable haven't I?

OP posts:
theeyeofthestormchaser · 14/03/2018 09:34

Deputy Head said to her “you can’t learn German properly with just 4 in the class, it’s not enough to interact properly, trust me”.

Bollocks! Of course you can. It's a financial reason, that's all.

theeyeofthestormchaser · 14/03/2018 09:35

Latin IME seems pretty pointless. Much better to do a current language that people actually still speak.

Buxbaum · 14/03/2018 09:39

Latin isn't pointless if you're thinking of studying Classics.

Is your DD doing ancient or modern Greek, OP?

DoloresLandingham · 14/03/2018 09:44

If you have a gift for languages then you don't necessarily study them because you want to be able to speak them, ludicrous though that sounds. You study them partly for the joy and fascination of seeing how the language is put together, and partly because when you study multiple languages within the same family you make contextual links which deepen your understanding of each one. If you're studying Indo-European languages then Latin and Ancient Greek are very useful. If you have competent Latin and Spanish, you will be able to read Italian and Portuguese. If you have Latin and German, you'll be able to read Dutch. You'll also be able to decode Anglo-Saxon and Middle English very comfortably. Languages aren't just about being able to order a beer and pay for a taxi on holiday.

crazycrofter · 14/03/2018 09:44

That’s bad. My dd goes to a school that sounds very similar. They used to do French and Latin from the start and then get the chance to pick up Ancient Greek, Italian/Russian,Spanish,German from year 10 - because this was quite late the groups for these languages were small. I just looked back at previous GCSE results - German had 1, 2 and 4 students in 2013-2015 exam years.

Now they take either German or Spanish from year 8 as well as the French and Latin. My daughter is not a linguist but she was able to drop a Science to get an extra humanities choice and she could potentially have chosen 3 languages on top of her compulsory MFL.

I thought that was the benefit of independent schools!

chorltonwheelies · 14/03/2018 09:47

Ancient Greek. She thinks she wants to do medicine, so it could apparently be helpful Confused

So in many ways the German isn’t a deal breaker.

However, we are also v aware that things can easily change over the GCSE years & if she doesn’t do as well as she hopes in science then she’s got languages/classics as a fall back. She just seems to love languages, finds them dead easy and does really well. It’s her thing.

She also loves Science & is top set for those, but Set 2 for English & 3 for Maths so it could all change. So maybe if she wants to do medicine then I shouldn’t have kicked off re the German? Aargh. Overthinking. I hate making a fuss.

OP posts:
BigGreenOlives · 14/03/2018 10:02

German is really important for science, don’t knock it.

PushMyButton · 14/03/2018 10:23

As they've been advertising options that they have failed to offer right the way through- and you chose the school on that basis- I'd be tempted to tell them you were taking advice on a breach of contract....

carryondoctor · 14/03/2018 10:57

I don't think Latin is useless for other European languages - I think it's a good base. It's also great with classics as a PP said.

However I don't believe it's quite as useful as it used to be for medicine - and definitely not for law, where the use of all the old Latin legal phrases is now discouraged - quid putor est!

Tralalee · 14/03/2018 11:02

At dds comp you can do French German and Latin
At dd2s privaye school you can do French Spanish Latin Greek Russian or mandarin.

4 in a class is fine.
Is your school struggling financially?

DoloresLandingham · 14/03/2018 11:04

OP, can you tell from the website or the prospectus which languages each teacher offers? I wonder if they have had a resignation.

Tralalee · 14/03/2018 11:05

Tbh if she does 3 language and triple science then she's got 2 x English, 1x maths, that's 9 already with no humanity

SumAndSubstance · 14/03/2018 11:19

OP, are you aware that the quotation you gave from the website identifies the school?

carryondoctor · 14/03/2018 11:24

Agreed - Op, I think you should ask HQ to delete that post so it's not identifying for you!

chorltonwheelies · 14/03/2018 11:27

RE is the compulsory humanity.

The Head of Year is on the phone saying its to do with too small class numbers and the girls were aware that it could be a possibility that they wouldn't be able to take up all their first choices, although they were also told that it hasn't happened for a number of years.

The Deputy is in interviews all day and will ring me tomorrow.

They said their aim is to ease DD's distress and make the process a bit easier for her, but there's no chance they are going to run the German.

I was both apologetic, look I realise this isn't your personal fault, but also "this is not good enough, unacceptable, disingenuous" etc.

OP posts:
Tralalee · 14/03/2018 11:39

So that's 10 with RE. Don't do three languages.

Butterymuffin · 14/03/2018 11:42

RE is compulsory but she can't do the language of her choice? I wouldn't be impressed with that at all.

PushMyButton · 14/03/2018 11:42

I guess compulsory re probably means it's a faith school?

Buxbaum · 14/03/2018 11:44

Ah, ignore my previous question - and I agree with sum and doctor, perhaps get your post of 9.12 removed.

I've had a look at the website. I'm absolutely amazed at the number of MFL faculty members who can only offer one language. They simply wouldn't be hired in any state school I've worked in, regardless of the fact that they are native speakers. We can't justify a full salary on an MFL teacher who can't offer at least two languages to GCSE and at least one to A Level.

chorltonwheelies · 14/03/2018 11:55

Asked HQ to remove post. Didn’t realise it would identify. Gosh I am so cross though.

And I felt really bad telling the HOY that we would take it to the governors. I don’t want to be that parent and I know it’s not the end of the world but we sacrifice so much to pay fees, we watch every penny, never buy any luxuries, don’t have holidays, have a 15 year old car, stick to supermarket brands it’s where all my salary goes, it’s why I work my backside off, and so it really hurts. We thought it was worth it to give our kids the best start we could, but feck it. The others can go to the local comp & I can start enjoying life!

OP posts:
sonjadog · 14/03/2018 12:14

You should definitely be that parent. This isn't good enough of the school. I am a foreign language teacher at secondary school. Do not let yourself be fobbed off with any argumetns that four is not enough for proper interaction in a language classroom. That is completely untrue.

Butterymuffin · 14/03/2018 12:34

I would say pretty much what you've said in your post above in writing to the governors. You are the kind of parent they should want and not be letting down. It's ok to expect schools to be accountable for their decisions, as long as you're polite and reasonable about it. It's the people who aren't polite or reasonable who are 'THAT parent'.

chorltonwheelies · 14/03/2018 12:37

Also HoY tried to give me some flannel about finding the best way to explain it to the child. Hmm

I just don’t understand why they can run it with say 10, but not 4? What am I missing?

OP posts:
IhaveChillyToes · 14/03/2018 12:41

how the school can do a class of 2 in core German but a class of 4 is not got enough students for other German class according to deputy

The deputy is clearly a plonker and a liar

It is money for staff and time tabling, also mis management hiring mfl teachers with only one language

Percivalandproud · 14/03/2018 13:26

The Competition and Markets Authority is very interested in organisations which take your money but don't provide promised services. There is an emphasis on Higher Education at the moment but the same laws seem to apply to private schools.

If they're advertising two languages then they need to provide them.

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