Cousin asking permission for image use

[lexxibeth]

Hubby and I finally had our wedding day last October. We had limited budget but for ease of life after marriage (my mother) we extend the invite to first cousins. Ie, I do not have any kind of relationship with this particular cousin I am posting about.

As per, once the day was done social media was inundated with lots of pics from those who had camera phones and had shared the day with us.

Last night my cousin messaged to ask permission to use a photo she had taken on the day as a portfolio cover picture for a photography business page she is launching.

Now, I have a couple of issues but can't tell if I'm being a hormonal grump (32wk 5d today) but hubby also feels her request is pretty cheeky. Here's why;

Ignorant and cold to both of us on the day, kept to one side despite efforts to approach her.

Did not have a camera with her on the day, only her phone - which I find bizarre that someone wanting to advertise a professional photography service would use camera phone photos.

She has not shared a single photo of our day so in all honesty I wasn't aware she had even taken any!

I also saw that she had already gone ahead and used the photo 3 hours before she messaged me and the quality is not great.

Lastly, I feel like the implication is that she took the photo at our wedding as a designated photographer. To me that's unfair to our actual photographer and also a bit of a liberty/false advertisement.

As I've said, hubby is of the same mind as me but there's this little chime on my ear telling me it's no skin off my nose and I should be more supportive of someone trying to launch a creative career!

Thoughts?

Just let her use the photo, like you say, no skin of your nose. Her using your photo doesn't tie you into her business at all, if it does then I'm proud to be part of the National Maritime Museum!

OP, please don't listen to anyone who says she doesn't need permission because she owns the copyright. YOU own your personal image, your likeness, so only YOU can decide if it's used in an advert. I worked in the entertainment industry for years and a release form is a must. People can sue over their image being used without permission.

Its just a photo. It would be really precious to be so bitchy about it.

"you own the rights to your image and have a say in how pictures of you are used"
Not true Olivia Pope.

Pic on BBC home page today. Do you really think all these people signed a consent form?

I would also check your contract with your photographer, or at least chat to your photographer about whether they would mind, as it might undermine your agreement with your professional photographer in some way.

That’s not an advert though @lljkk

You don’t really have a relationship with this woman and it doesn’t seem as though it would matter much if you refused and she was offended but she was at your wedding because you wanted an easy life with your mother.
Is it really no skin off your nose or will your easy life with your mother be compromised by family dispute? Your cousin is clearly rude and you shouldn’t care what she thinks but is your mum a different matter?

That picture is in a public place, so the rules are different.

Iljkk There's a huge and legal distinction between being featured in a picture of a crowd taken at an event which has an expectation of being publicised as a news event to someone using a head shot of an individual to promote their business. You can argue the toss all you want, but as I said I've worked in the ents industry and dealt with dozens of release forms so I know what I'm talking about.

So everyone else who was there has plastered their photos of your wedding all over social media but you've got the hump because your cousin was ignorant on the day 😂😂😂😂

Your lucky she even asked you as she doesn’t need too, you don’t own the rights of the photo, there is now law about using photos with people in it.

Phones can take some pretty good photos these days. I have a very expensive camera, o do photography as a hobby but sometimes I get better photos on my Samsung phone, it’s about being in the right place at the right time rather than what you are using to take the photo.

If it was a relative of mine asking I would be fine with them using it, it will be helping her out and I don’t see what the problem is?

lljkk that's because it's a crowd scene and no-one is clearly identifiable. If that photo showed one or two people close up who were clearly identifiable, then the BBC would need them to sign release forms.

For a %of her profits then sure she can use your photo....

Absolutely DOES need your permission because I’m betting the image was not in a public space (like a city hall, beach, park or street).

Photographers reserve the copy right to use an image for their promotional and marketing use as part of their contract with you. But in this case, you didn’t hire her to take any photos.

As she was not commissioned to take the photo, she must ask your permission to use your likeness for commercial purposes. Unlike your wedding photographer, with whom you signed a contract and agreed that he/she can ONLY use your wedding photos to promote his/her business. But not make T-Shirts for sale. Or sell the image to a stock library, etc.

Because you have no contract with your cousin, she technically needs you to sign a model release form. Which is sort of what she’s doing by emailing for your written permission.

I think it’s wrong as it does imply she was paid to take that photo.

Far from being cheeky, her request is actually very polite given that, legally, she doesn't need your permission.

It is called a model release form. All photographers know that they cannot use someone's image for promotional use without permission.

that's because it's a crowd scene and no-one is clearly identifiable. If that photo showed one or two people close up who were clearly identifiable, then the BBC would need them to sign release forms.

They don't, we were in the crowd at a local event and front row, at least 8 photos of our group were posted including close ups of our children. They were posted on the local paper website, council website and in the paper. We were never asked to sign a waiver at all.

To those who say she can't use the print to profit financially - how can paparazzi take photos without consent and sell them on if that's the case?

www.rocketlawyer.com/article/when-you-need-a-photo-release.rl

This website explains it all quite clearly.

You can sell a picture of someone on the street but you can't use it to link it to a product or service ie use it to advertise said product.

Interesting 😀

As others have said, in this instance your cousin does need your permission. Other guests who posted pics of the day were just doing so for social reasons ..... ie just letting you/others see their pics not using them to promote a commercial enterprise. In asking your permission your cousin is acknowledging that she is aware that she needs this to proceed on this basis regardless of the fact that she owns the copyright of the image. She is doing 5e right thing to ask. It’s up to you whether you agree. I see she wants to use it as a cover picture - presumably on a FB page, not as part of a wider portfolio of work. In this situation I’d send her a note agreeing to it’s use and ask for copies of the images she took on the day to add to your collection.

www.wipo.int/export/sites/www/sme/en/documents/pdf/ip_photography.pdf - in case anyone has half an hour to waste finding out what you can and can't do with photos from an IP point of view - though I'd

yes, she is very rude. The least she could have done was sending you all the photos first. I would ask her for them, then let it go.

I'd also make it a funny story to tell all my family about the cheeky mare.

Pinkprincess Even though their nickname makes their profession sound dodgy, paps are actually defined as photo journalists, so the same rules apply to them about taking pictures in a public place as it would anyone else. So celebs in the street are fair game. If it's an event on private property and a pap has been commissioned by the organisers to take pictures for promotional reasons, any guest automatically waives their rights by agreeing to attend said event (it's always printed on the invite as a disclaimer). Many celeb guests do refuse to have their pictures taken though, which they have the right to do, so it's never an issue.

I think your reasons for saying no are a bit rubbish to be honest OP. You're either comfortable with a picture of your wedding being made public or you're not, you should make the decision on that basis. If you are comfortable with it, I don't know why you wouldn't help family out, even if you're not particularly close.

i thought you would need permission from the person you took the photo of too.

To those who say she can't use the print to profit financially - how can paparazzi take photos without consent and sell them on if that's the case?

This is a good point though.

i thought you would need permission from the person you took the photo of too.

To those who say she can't use the print to profit financially - how can paparazzi take photos without consent and sell them on if that's the case?

This is a good point though.

Am I the only one wondering why the OP invited this cousin who she has no relationship with to her wedding?' Why even invite her?

Some people are so weird!

IMO, I think the cousin probably DOES need the permission of the OP before she can use it for her website/company whatever, and I am sure the OP can say 'no you can't use it.'

If her and her cousin don't have any bond or relationship, does it matter if the cousin is miffed and irked that the OP says no to using the pic?