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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Homophobic comment to 5 year old?

47 replies

Mrsknackered · 06/03/2018 00:38

Backstory: Not first incident with my 5 year olds school (maybe some of you might remember the proposed 'yellow sash' punishment) I have been in contact with class teacher and family liaison a lot. I wasn't allowed to see headteachers in this saga because 'it has to go through the class teacher first' they wouldn't even give me an email address for them.

Wednesday: DS told me that he had kissed a boy in his class, boy got annoyed and told a teacher. Teacher has then told DS that 'you should only kiss girls'

I am fully aware that 5 year olds might not always tell a story word for word, and we had a big discussion about not kissing people, especially when they aren't happy about it. I wanted to speak to the class teacher today but she wasn't in (snow days following the day of the remark, so had to wait until today) and I tried to phone to speak to liaison in the morning, but couldn't get through.

I'm fuming about this remark - he wouldn't of heard this at home, so surely something along these lines must have been said? I'm laying awake trying to think of all the possible ways it could have been said.

What do I do?!

OP posts:

SneakyGremlins · 06/03/2018 00:40

What the teacher SHOULD have said is exactly what you did. He should only kiss people with permission and only if they're happy with it - regardless of gender!

SleepingStandingUp · 06/03/2018 00:42

There's two points - firstly, it isn't acceptable to kiss anyone without their permission so don't tell him to kiss girls, tell him not to kiss! Secondly, if he is allowed to kiss if the other person agrees then he should be able to kiss sometime off either sex.

I would ask for clarity over what was said tee him missing one of his class mates. Don't mention sex and get their version first. Then raise the above two concerns - don't encourage him to kiss girls without permission, don't tell him as a boy he can only kiss girls

Cavender · 06/03/2018 00:44

I’m astonished that the teacher said anything other than “don’t kiss anyone”.

Are you sure it wasn’t the other boy who said it? That sounds more likely.

You do need to get through to him that kissing other pupils isn’t on. Both my son and my daughter would hate that.

Isadora2007 · 06/03/2018 00:45

I’m not sure why you can’t ask for an appointment to see the headteacher- your class teacher doesn’t even have to know.

I’d definitely want to say something re the kissing. Your response was the correct one.

I disagree with the pp suggesting if consent is given it’s okay to kiss- is rather kids at primary school were NOT encouraged to kiss each other regardless of sex thanks. There are enough bugs around as it is!!!

Original poster

Mrsknackered · 06/03/2018 00:50

Isadora2007 absolutely no idea why. It's insane, it appears you can only speak to them if they wish to see you I.e. Attendance issues he was off for 4 days with chickenpox in his first term

I'd rather he didn't kiss anyone and he knows that, but I thought it was a good time to explain consent.

To PP who said other child may have said it, I think this is a possibility however he has repeatedly said it was 'Mrs X' who said it.

OP posts:

DalekDalekDalek · 06/03/2018 01:01

That doesn't sound right at all. Anyone should be able to make an appointment to see the headteacher if they are concerned. Is there a reason that they have forbidden you from doing this? Is it the same for all parents? I would speak to the governors or the LEA if this is happening.

Original poster

Mrsknackered · 06/03/2018 01:05

As far as I am aware, it is the same for all parents. In other schools, how do you usually contact governors also? Receptionist said they are unable to give out email addresses for head teachers or governors. There is apparently a drop in session for parents who want to see the heads, but I remember only seeing it mentioned once and at that point I had no qualms and had an exam. I can ask again tomorrow though, would rather get this sorted sooner rather than later though.

OP posts:

tumblrpigeon · 06/03/2018 01:05

Oh come on , let this go.

Original poster

Mrsknackered · 06/03/2018 01:06

tumblr pigeon let what go sorry?

OP posts:

Justmyownself · 06/03/2018 01:18

Some bonkers comments on here.

I take it that no parents kiss their babies anymore, as obviously a baby cannot consent to beong touched. And clearly, every parent now asks their six year old for consent to give them a goodnight kiss.

No? Didn't think so.

The kid is five FGS!

We are going to raise a generation of seriously messed up people if we keep spouting this rubbish to children

Cavender · 06/03/2018 01:26

Why bonkers Just?

Why don’t you think a five year old child of either sex should be able to say “don’t kiss me”?

Coyoacan · 06/03/2018 01:32

I'd be more concerned about your inability to see the head or the governors. Educating children is a joint venture between the school and the parents, so cutting the parents out of the picture is a hide onto nothing.

PerspicaciaTick · 06/03/2018 01:35

The comment is definitely but I would be looking to change schools given the total lack of engagement with, access to or transparency from the SLT and Governors. The school can't just pretend problems aren't happening by refusing to let you tell them about the problems.

In the meantime, have you asked for a copy of the complaints procedure? Follow it to the letter. While it is typical that they may not give out the personal emails of governors they should be able to give you some point of contact for your complaint possibly the Board of Governors' secretary or via the HT. If it is going in the post then use recorded delivery.

Justmyownself · 06/03/2018 01:37

They can. But telling kids about consent for this and consent for that will just lead to mass hysteria and paranoia.

What happens to that kid when someone doesnt ask for permission?

Or when the kid grows up with a head full of this nonsense and realises that one time Aunt Maude didn't ask for consent when kissing them goodbye, so obviously Auntie is now some sort of abuser.

If you tell a kid they should be afraid of Ladybirds, they will grow up being afraid of Ladybirds.

If you tell a kid every touch needs consent then they will grow up believing every touch without consent is abuse. Which it isn't.

God help these kids when it comes to their teens and they are trying to navigate the world of hormones and teen dating with their minds poisoned by all this.

DalekDalekDalek · 06/03/2018 01:37

I would have thought it would be easy to find contact details for the LEA on the internet.

1forAll74 · 06/03/2018 01:40

I have never heard anything quite so ridiculous as this, well perhaps I have, as everyday you hear something stupid like this these days. How crazy life is now !

Cavender · 06/03/2018 01:41

I think you are over complicating this Just.

A discussion of bodily autonomy with a young child doesn’t need to contain any discussion of abuse or anything negative at all.

Just positive reinforcement that it’s ok to decide for yourself whether you want kissed, cuddled, tickled etc.

Isadora2007 · 06/03/2018 01:53

God help these kids when it comes to their teens and they are trying to navigate the world of hormones and teen dating with their minds poisoned by all this

Imagine! Teens having all that consensual sexual activity?!?! Teens talking to each other to check they’re on the same page sexually?!?!? The shock and horror. Sexual assaults may, gulp, go DOWN and people may actually treat each other respectively.

What WILL future generations post on AIBU about?????

ashotinthedarkk · 06/03/2018 04:11

I'd let this go.

cariadlet · 06/03/2018 06:06

Justmyownself - the idea that asking for consent will lead to mass hysteria and paranoia is ridiculous.

I teach Year 1. Some children are very tactile and always want to kiss, cuddle or hold hands with their friends - or whoever happens to be sitting next to them! Other children hate being touched or kissed. The majority quite like it sometimes, but can still be annoyed if they're not in the mood to be kissed or if they are finding it distracting when they're trying to listen or get on with something else.

I always tell children that they must ask someone if they want to be kissed/cuddled. It's nothing to do with teaching children that every touch that hasn't been consented to is abuse. Just ordinary politeness and respect for each other (although it does lay the foundations for children understanding that they have control over their own bodies).

Extrapolating to the extreme example of not being able to kiss a baby as a baby can't give consent is nonsense.

I'd never say that boys can only kiss girls (or vice-versa), but given the info about the school it doesn't seem worth going in to complain about. Just keep giving more appropriate messages at home.

Justmyownself · 06/03/2018 06:42

Cariad

What do you tell a child to do if somebody touches them without consent?

Original poster

Mrsknackered · 06/03/2018 07:23

I obviously didn't say it in a way that made it into an abuse conversation just

I know DS1 is very cuddly and kisses anyone he loves, some children don't appreciate this (I didn't!)

Sorry I'm going to be really thick, but what is LEA? Completely new to all of this.

OP posts:

Mistoffelees · 06/03/2018 07:35

Completely normal to teach children about consent in this way, it should children who don't want to be cuddled by their friends just put up with it?
Also, babies can give consent of sorts, if someone started kissing someone's baby and they cried and the person carried on kissing them we'd end up with a post on here "AIBU to tell Auntie to stop kissing my baby when she starts crying"

Mistoffelees · 06/03/2018 07:35

LEA is local education authority by the way

scaryteacher · 06/03/2018 07:44

You are over thinking this. It was a comment in a busy classroom and would not have had a homophobic agenda. This is why teachers leave the profession because parents want to question and police every comment made during what is a busy working day. I would not have given a comment like that a second thought, apart from telling my ds not to kiss people, when he was 5, and I was doing my PGCE. I still wouldn't give it headspace, and he is now 22.

You will be that parent, and people will dread teaching your child in case you start breathing down their necks. You have another 13 years of education to go with your ds. How seriously do you think your complaints will be taken if you sweat the small stuff now?

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