Manager making comments on my salary

[helenvellyn]

Straight off the bat I'll say that my manager and I don't always see eye to eye.

He is not a lot older than me and is openly dismissive of women he perceives as a threat to him. Although he is my line manager, he doesn't do my day job and so has little involvement in my actual work. I effectively manage myself.

He has before made little digs about my salary, saying that I get paid too much and that he doesn't see how I can have no money (when joining office collective groaning about January payday) when 'he knows how much I earn'.

Today I said I was talking to a colleague about how I saved £40 buying some boots in a sale. He butted in and said 'I know how much you earn and you don't need to be buying boots in the sale'. This was in earshot of other colleagues.

AIBU to think this is very inappropriate? I am well paid for my role but I negotiated this and the company were obviously willing to pay it.

I don't think it's appropriate for a manager to remind me that he knows my salary as it was negotiated with HR and not him. He seems unhealthily preoccupied with it and I feel uncomfortable with the comments in front of colleagues.

AIBU?

YANBU it is totally inappropriate for him to mention this and you should tell him that you will not accept it. You say he is openly dismissive of other women, what have they done about it?

He may believe that you are overpaid compared to your colleagues, not all pay negotiations are fair. He may have reason to think you are difficult or not performing, we can’t know this. However bitching about it is the wrong way for him to deal with it but ultimately he does have power over you if he can block your bonus and possible progression.

If he is responsible for your performance pay and states that you are difficult then you need to have a meeting where it can all be addressed and documented. I’ve been working enough years to know you can’t let a bad situation slide, things rarely improve, and heresay can damage a reputation.

No argument the OP’s boss is behaving unprofessionally - I just wondered if the “why” might be because he’s comparing performances. Not because he’s jealous she makes more than him.

Does it matter why, if he is behaving unprofessionally? The problem is his behaviour, not why he feels upset at the OP earning more. It makes no odds whether he has a legitimate grievance.

And why say that I have never seen this played out when I said in my next post that I have been on the receiving end of comments about needing to be grateful for my salary? My performance was not an issue in this case and had it been, I would have expected management to raise that with me so that I could address it.

Because from you comments it was clear you were commenting on what should occur not what you’ve seen played out in real life with office politics, personalities and reputations mixed in.

He's being a knob but don't give him a head tilt because that's more knobbish.

He definitely doesn't less than me. How much more he earns I do not know.

He hasn't always been my line manager. My previous line manager left last year and was too expensive to replace. For a while I did both jobs but obviously had to report to someone and this guy has old experience in my area - eg worked in this sector 10 years ago. It's a tech industry and his knowledge is outdated.

There are ongoing issues as since he was made my line manager directors in the business ask him direct questions and he doesn't know the answer. Therefore I spend most of my day giving him information that he feeds back to senior management and receives credit for. Other people have also noticed this is happening but I appreciate it's not very tangible. However the comments on my salary definitely are tangible.

Because from you comments it was clear you were commenting on what should occur not what you’ve seen played out in real life with office politics, personalities and reputations mixed in

Huh? I really don't get this. You can theorise all you like why people behave in different ways. I know this too- people feel resentful for all sorts of reasons and sometimes legitimately so. I am sure that the people who made comments to me regarding my salary could have had reasons for saying what they did, e.g. personal dislike of me etc. No situation is ever completely black and white. That makes no difference- there are standards of behaviour in the workplace for a reason. No matter how deeply you feel that someone is being overpaid, you do not deal with it by making snide comments to them in front of colleagues. I am really not sure why this is hard to grasp.

Is it possible to stop feeding him answers? Senior management are at fault here for employing someone without the experience and not training or monitoring him. He may not even have managerial experience if he’s all they can afford.

Unfortunately I think that adds to your problem because you are asking directors to admit that your grievances have partly arisen from their own recruitment process and decisions.

So if you leave, he'll really be in the shit because it will become apparent he doesn't know anything

You actually have the power here

For a start, I would say that from now on you would prefer to answer directors questions directly - see him go all pale and sweaty when you say that

This is so inappropriate, please try and summarise everything in writing and meet with HR to discuss - even better if you have dates/times. Don’t suffer in silence, this isn’t OK and you’re not BU to address this.

Therefore I spend most of my day giving him information that he feeds back to senior management and receives credit for.

Ah. Now it makes sense. I've seen this a number of times before. A relatively new manager feels insecure and looks around for someone to project their discomfort on to. Typically they will focus on someone who they view as the biggest "threat". There doesn't need to be any objective truth in this, it's all about their perception. In my experience they often focus on someone who presents the lowest level of actual "threat" to them.

You are someone who was able to do his job without too much difficulty and who is still needed to keep his head above water so you are "it". In a situation like this, it's not unusual to see the manager try to get rid of the underling even though it will land them in difficulties. There is nothing rational about this. You should avoid getting into a fight with a superior who is not acting rationally. That's why HR needs to be involved.

He sounds like an insecure, unprofessional dickhead. I'd make a complaint. It's completely unacceptable for him to be making that type of comment, in any scenario.

Agree with what Thebluedog says. Also, how on earth does he know what your salary Is? Surely there's been a breach of data protection if he's seen your file?

In relation to you having to feed him answers, I wouldn't put that in writing but when you inevitably have to have that conversation with hr I would find a way to slip it in, subtly so as not to appear as a pp said to be criticising senior management.

I agree with others, start looking for another job although I appreciate you may not want to leave. This twat is determined to stagnate your career.

I'd go to HR and register a complaint about him. Its not appropriate for him to be making comments like that about your salary

He sounds like a twat

Is it normal for a line manager to know the salary of their direct reports?

I got a pay rise after being in the company for a year, this was written into my contract as I had passed a number of exams and certifications. My line manager had to confirm to HR I had passed them so I presumed this is how he knows my salary.

I've caught him talking on our internal messaging system to our head of department saying I was 'difficult' - without fairly discussing the problem with me first

I am guessing you don't have this in writing to show to HR? How did you come across the messages, can you bring it up with HR? But even so, I think you have enough for a complaint both with your appraisal comments and his ongoing salary comments.

I am also intrigued about how, or even if, he knows yours already and would bring that up with HR too.

I am a line manager and don't know my employees salary. I might be asked to confirm a qualification, as yours was, but I still wouldn't need to know the salary. I would be asking HR if he has been told and if so, why?

It sounds like jealousy, as he isn't as up to speed as you technically, and is definitely a firm of bullying, esp saying you wont get the pay rise and bonus. They shouldn't depend on personal feelings, but on how your work is.

Completely inappropriate. I work in HR. It is normal for LM's to know the salaries of their teams, but openly discussing it and declaring it as a reason for not nominating for increment or bonus is out of order. If you were in my business and raised a grievance about this he would be absolutely rinsed for this behaviour.

Regarding feeding him answers, I would say you are a bit busy, ask him to send you an email, as a reminder to reply when you have a minute. This means you have it in writing.

If he wont send the email, then tell him verbally, but follow up with an email, "Regarding your query earlier, the solution is xxxxxxx". Or even just say, I'll email you a response, its easier to explain in writing than verbally (I sometimes do this, as it is often easier to explain technical info in writing - I am an engineer)

You then have something in writing if anything comes up with senior management regarding your performance. This makes the information passing very tangible. If you know which director has asked the question, copy them in too.

And yes, I would also mention this to HR. Use it as an example of why his performance related bonus comment is unfair, given that you are doing part of his job.

We use an internal messaging system but I don't think it is monitored by IT and he always sends requests for info by this. The messages disappear after a certain amount of time and become untraceable. I have asked numerous times for the email etc with the enquiry for me to respond myself but he refuses to send it.

Saw the messages about me after he asked me to look at something on his screen and it was open.

When he asks you questions on the internal message system respond by email.

It sounds like he has it on for you so make sure you have a trail and I would make a complaint to HR about his comments on your salary

If it's possible, copy communications from the messaging system into a Word document. Keep a record summarising of all of your interactions where he's not behaving.

In your shoes I'd be reluctant to withdraw support where you're effectively doing his job. It will be be easy for him to present this as you being obstructive. Remember, if there's a dispute about this involving HR, they may well support the side that makes things easiest (in the short term) for the company* unless there's evidence that means they have to support the employee making the complaint.

• I realise that plenty of HR people have integrity but my experience of the disputes I've seen is that HR have chosen to take the side which most benefits the company.

I don't trust HR to be honest which is why I would only go to them with a solid complaint eg making comments about my salary.

I have a job interview Thursday. I didn't want to move as I haven't been at the company long but might have to accept it's the best option.

Unless the prospective job is a step down in seniority or has something that makes it unattractive, I think making a move is well worth considering. I would. Good luck with your interview.

The new job is a step up in position and quite a large payrise (about 8k). So maybe worth considering!

Good luck in the job interview, I really hope you get it.

I also hope he ends up in the shit when you leave

If you've been there a year that's fine.