To not want to pay for grave right now?

[NoticeBored]

I'll try to give as much information as possible without drip feeding or outing myself. I don't think I'm BU and as it's sensitive I'm aware in real life I can't really ask without sounding crass/causing upset which I'm loathe to do.

My dear father passed away recently. He had a long term partner of 10 years although they lived separately through choice. They spent about 5 nights a week together in either home. She wants to be buried with him.

His partner very kindly agreed to split the cost of the funeral with me and my siblings - who didn't speak to him due to a messy divorce from mum. His DP now wants to put the headstone up. She has recently had a massive windfall (150k+) and wants top of the range, all singing and dancing gravestone and surrounds. She is not willing to compromise on this and wants me to split the cost. I am officially next of Kin and can categorically say that my siblings won't contribute.

I genuinely cannot afford this. We are a single income family and tbh I had to take out a bank loan to cover my portion of the funeral and all the associated costs. I would be willing to pay half of the grave etc. if it was a reasonable price but there is no room for compromise with her. We will have two incomes next year and I have said if she's willing to wait to the end of 2019 I would be happy to do it then. She wants it up now. I am also not willing to owe her the money. I have said to either do it alone now or wait to next year to I can afford it.

I'm very aware she thinks I'm being out of line by refusing to do it now and pay her back but a) I'm not willing to 'owe' her, b) I think the expense she wants is excessive and don't want to be throwing away unnecessary money, c) she is insisting on it being done so quickly as not to mess with her benefits.

Given that she paid £1000 for the funeral AIBU insisting she either does it now and pays it herself or waits to next Christmas if she wants to share the cost? My share of her grave will be more expensive than what I paid for the funeral. Happy to hear all opinions but please don't be too harsh!

sparklepops123
Who's next of kin I'm sure they have the say so what happens officially

They don't. The owner of the grave does. Not always the same person.

She can not erect a headstone for about 12 months anyway. So pay your half of the funeral then leave her to get on with it when the time comes for the headstone.
She can’t force you to buy the headstone.

Also - does she have children? Because if she does, it's no more outrageous to ask them to contribute to what will be their mother's headstone than it is to insist that you do. After all, when she eventually dies, the headstone and the bulk of the carving will already have been paid for.

Sorry for your loss. Just say no and you can only afford XX. If she wants the full singing and dancing headstone, she needs to pay for it herself.

Those saying you can't erect a gravestone for months. Some plots now have concrete strips for the headstones laid so that you can have a headstone immediately as there is no 'ground to settle'. I was very grateful as I had one for my late DM within a couple of weeks of her funeral.

OP if she wants an expensive one right now then she has to pay. You are not being unreasonable.

Are you sure this windfall has nothing to do with insurance your Dad might have taken out. I'm the suspicious type but only thought of it when another poster said it might have something to do with your Dad's pension. Don't much like the sound of this woman at all. Tread carefully.

Who owns the rights over the grave? Is it you as next of kin?

She doesn't get to dictate. Or she shouldn't, anyway.

Tell her categorically that you simply cannot afford to progress on this front at the moment. Say that you will have to wait until you are more comfortable financially and then make a properly considered (by all parties involved) decision.

As others have pointed out, you usually do have to wait a few months for the ground to be properly settled over a new grave. Sometimes for around a year. It isn't unusual for graves to be without a headstone for quite a while. I know of one instance where a family did not put a headstone on the grave of their relative for about 2 years. Partly ground settlement and partly cost, as they were saving up for what they wanted.

I am sorry about your Dad. You just don't need this on top of everything else.

The grave belongs to whoever paid for it.
If she paid, she decides.
The burial application form will be very specific knows too much about the ICCM rules on such things

I think you are very sensible to reject her offer of a ´loan´until your financial situation in a year´s time is certain. You are already paying off the funeral debt and are a single income household. It is prefectly reasonable to tell her that you don´t want to take on more debt right now in case you find yourself in difficulties. If she is not prepared to accept it then she is being very unreasonable. I am sure your father would have wanted his grandchildren to be financially secure and it´s fine to say this too.

And, as others have said, when the time comes to get a stone you make it clear which sort of stone you can afford and if she doesn´t want one of those, she can accept the same amount and put it towards another a more expensive one.

I am sorry you are having to deal with this on top of your bereavement.

The grave was included in the price of the funeral and I dealt with the priest. No one said anything about deeds to it? We aren't in England though. Her money is definitely hers and been gained legally. I never considered that if she's for being buried there she will be benefiting directly from it. She is quite glamorous so I'd know she wouldn't be impressed with a bog standard surround. I'm glad that was pointed out.

Winter I think we're all awful at times and in different ways. He and I and you too I'm sure.

If she is being buried there too,then has she paid for her future grave plot, i know its hard and you have recently lost someone you love but don't let her railroad you. You could contact either the funeral director or the cemerary to find out who owns what, now and in the future.

I would only pay the proportion of what I could afford without his partner's offer. You could just put a cross up until you can afford that. Do not be browbeaten to making decisions. Do not get into debt, he was your father.

The windfall sounds suspect, is it a pension pot like suggested upthread?

No it's not a pension pot. It's an inheritance. From her own family.

My mother died in the 1970s and dad was a single parent on a single, low income, and could never afford a headstone. Fast forward many decades and my sister wanted me to pay half towards a sudden gravestone for our mother. (Dad died years ago). Why? Because her son was getting married and in the same church where mum is buried about 30 m from the church door and she didn't want the snobby, rich, future in laws to "see" our mum had no grave. Sister on a whacking wage, with savings, kids grown up. I have a lot of younger kids, on minimum wage, etc etc. I refused to go halves. It's as simple as that. Refuse.

Our mum knew we loved her. In fact, sister had never visited her grave and I had to show her where it was! Yet it only bothered her when outsiders were going to realise our mum had no headstone. Bugger that.

Her son is now married and not speaking to the snobby in laws anyway. I'd have wasted hundreds of pounds on a headstone for nephew having wedding photos taken for ten minutes...

My mum would rather my kids were fed and rent being paid to keep a roof over their heads. Sister with the big wages, paid for house so no rent or mortgage, didn't bother to pay out on her own, I noticed.

Say no. The dead don't care.

YANBU
She has a cheek asking you to subsidise something that she will benefit from when the time comes.

Does she have children of her own? If so, they can contribute towards their mother's plot.

Were your siblings NC with your dad as the divorce was a result of an affair with this woman?

No she wasn't the OW. She also has no other family. I didn't realise that there should be deeds to a grave. So now I'm panicking and trying to find out about them. I would never prevent her from being buried with him but tbh my DF went out of his way to ensure that I was to be in control and I need to respect that.

Call the cemetery and ask them to find the deeds, they will be on their register, get a copy too if you can, just ask them. If she has planned to be buried with him then she would have reserved or bought a plot which they may also know. If she is asking for you to contribute towards the headstone then will it be for both of them eventually, I wouldn't pay, just explain you cannot afford it. She has plenty of money. It was your dad's wishes that you were in control, could you tell her that. Sometimes people leave instructions for their final wishes in their Will .

He didn't have an estate but did get documents written up stipulating his burial plans and that I was to be in sole charge. Mainly because of the poor relationships with everyone and I'm generally fair. I'll try ringing the church to see about the deeds. I definitely know the plot wasn't previously reserved.

Yanbu and that aside when you do pay then it should only be a quarter. It will be her headstone you so she pays half and then half of your half towards your Dad's.

Tell her 2019 or nothing, it's not negotiable, no loan, you will pay x towards a basic one, she can pay the difference and wait for your contribution until 2019 or not at all

Do you have a copy of his plans, good luck with all this, it's a difficult time for you.

If you own the plot, as in are the deed holder then you decide who gets buried there. Each time the plot is opened you pay a fee, so when she dies the plot owner will have to pay for the ground to be opened.

If you pay and erect this headstone what happens if she goes on to have a new partner or husband and wants to buried with him ?

You could compromise and say you’ll pay for a regular headstone for your dad and when she dies her estate pays for the elaborate one she wants ?

So sorry about your father.

His partner very kindly agreed to split the cost of the funeral with me and my siblings

Is it not normal for a surviving spouse (or long-term partner) to cover ALL funeral and grave costs?

Seems strange that the default seems to be for you and your siblings to pay (although I know legally you are probably the next of kin).

Would it become a family plot for you and then your children too in the future? Or does the partner want it to just be for the two of them? If so I personally think she should pay for the whole thing.

With emotions already running high for both of you, I think the best thing is a very quick response saying you cannot afford to help contribute to the fancy one she is planning, and you are not willing to take on debt. Don’t let it drag on. The last thing you need is this stress on top of your grief.

Whether you then offer to contribute towards a standard grave is up to you. Since she has the money and she wants to share it one day I think she should pay for it all. If they had been married would there even be any question of you being asked to contribute?

Offering to pay a quarter towards a standard headstone would be a generous gesture, as Nocabbage suggested.

Good luck.

"Do you think that she might be trying to dispose of her recent inheritance a bit sharpish, so that she'll carry on receiving means tested benefits? That would be benefit fraud wouldn't it?"

No it isn't. There is a small time period were it doesn't count, as such, because it could be used to house yourself, for example.

I think you should tell her to pay for it, because she is hoping to be buried there.

OP have you included the grave in your own Will and discussed with the next owner in line (if not) what their feelings are about it all?

This is a warning why people need to have this stuff sorted when alive. You say you were estranged from your Father, is anyone likely to get vindictive over her being buried there?

Headbasher the issue with that is who owns the grave and the Partner being on benefits.

The DWP help with funeral costs only if you are the person who can legally burying them.